lefty's random dog thread.

Originally Posted by JLibourel

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Lefty, was the dog in the Ukrainian video a pure APBT or some kind of bandog? As you know, I am not afraid of big, tough dogs, but a couple of bandogs I have met were downright terrifying.

A few days ago, there was an incident in Rancho Mirage, California, where a man was reported killed by two "Bullmastiffs" he was trying to breed. From the one not very good photo of the dogs I saw, the dogs were most definitely not Bullmastiffs. They were either Bandogs or possibly Presas or Canes. As you doubtless recall, there was a similar confusion about the identity of the dogs that killed Diane Alexis Whipple in the notorious incident in San Francisco on January 27, 2001. The Presas were initially erroneously identified as "Bullmastiffs."

Interesting to see some Boxers doing protection work. I think most all the good ones are in Europe. Just about every American Boxer I have encountered has been hyper with very low trainability...although they are often sweet dogs.

Those Ukrainian dogs almost look like Preas. Since they have a pretty healthy fighting game over there it could be a mix of anything.

After the GSD, the Boxer is the most worked dog in Germany. To be fair, if I wanted a full on manstopper I wouldn't choose a Boxer, but for an all around companion with the abiilty to lay on a good fight it's an excellent choice. It is in great hands in Europe, but their approach to breeding wouldn't fly here. Too bad.

lefty

Originally Posted by dcg

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Adopted from the SPCA a few weeks ago:

Cute puppy.

lefty

Originally Posted by Maharlika

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robin--do you have a Tosa Inu? Those dogs are fierce!!!
No. They're a dog breed I've always liked, but my city lifestyle would not be suitable for one.

Originally Posted by Maharlika

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robin--do you have a Tosa Inu? Those dogs are fierce!!!

I'm not Robin, but I have owned four Tosas--two males and two females--a d have known many others. I don't know if "fierce" is the word. They can be very aggressive toward dogs that present a challenge. Usually they are fine with small dogs and dogs of the opposite sex. They are more predatory toward other animals than most mastiff types. Like most well-bred fighting dogs, they are not very human-aggressive. Dempsey was the only one of our four that was at all naturally protective. Zuma disliked strangers but was not aggressive toward them. My two girls were friends with everyone. My girl Tessa had the most gory history. She had been returned to her breeder because she had killed and partly eaten the neighbor's 100-pound Akita. I think the Akita must really have pushed her because she was pleasant and gentle, maybe even a bit shy, around other dogs she encountered with me. She was a total sweetheart with people and especially nice with children. She'd let little kids play around on her tummy and such. I am sure their parents would have freaked had they known her history, but I was sure of her temperament and knew the kids would be fine, and so they were.

Originally Posted by Tokyo Slim

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I want foxes.

Originally Posted by Tokyo Slim

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I want foxes.

http://cbsu.tc.cornell.edu/ccgr/behaviour/Index.htm

lefty

Originally Posted by JLibourel

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I'm not Robin, but I have owned four Tosas--two males and two females--a d have known many others. I don't know if "fierce" is the word. They can be very aggressive toward dogs that present a challenge. Usually they are fine with small dogs and dogs of the opposite sex. They are more predatory toward other animals than most mastiff types. Like most well-bred fighting dogs, they are not very human-aggressive. Dempsey was the only one of our four that was at all naturally protective. Zuma disliked strangers but was not aggressive toward them. My two girls were friends with everyone. My girl Tessa had the most gory history. She had been returned to her breeder because she had killed and partly eaten the neighbor's 100-pound Akita. I think the Akita must really have pushed her because she was pleasant and gentle, maybe even a bit shy, around other dogs she encountered with me. She was a total sweetheart with people and especially nice with children. She'd let little kids play around on her tummy and such. I am sure their parents would have freaked had they known her history, but I was sure of her temperament and knew the kids would be fine, and so they were.

Jan, how agile is the Tosa? To me the Fila Brasiliero always looked somewhat lumbering - the idea that they worked cattle seems a little ridiculous to me. I did meet a women who said her year old Fila puppy broke through her car window to get at someone.

Fila:



lefty

Originally Posted by lefty

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http://cbsu.tc.cornell.edu/ccgr/behaviour/Index.htm lefty
Yeah, I know. I saw a nature documentary on the domestication project. Foxes are so damn cute!

As to Tosa agility, you've got to remember that Tosas cover a wide spectrum of sizes from about 90 pounds to over 200. There are some smaller pure-bred Tosas in Japan than that. The really enormous ones usually come from lines heavily admixed with Old English Mastiffs and are very similar in most respects to the latter breed. My two males topped out around 130. Tessa was about 125, and little Jessie was about 98 pounds. For their size, they seemed pretty agile. They could leap high in the air, pivot on their hind legs and in general seemed much more trim and athletic than most giant breed dogs. One woman I know did quite a bit of agility trailing with her 120-pound male. While he was no Border Collie, he wasn't ridiculous doing agility either--at least that was my impression from what she told me. I know of one little female that went Sch. I. One breeder heavily advertised some of her dogs as Schutzhund titled but all they had was the "B" title.

As to Filas, one friend of mine who was into Filas said he thought a lot of the Fila's problems came from the American penchant for turning a 100-pound dog into a 200-pound dog. I wouldn't be surprised if there were some smaller working strains in Brazil. I've met some Filas that were surprisingly pleasant, others that were crazy, dangerous brutes.

Originally Posted by JLibourel

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As to Tosa agility, you've got to remember that Tosas cover a wide spectrum of sizes from about 90 pounds to over 200. There are some smaller pure-bred Tosas in Japan than that. The really enormous ones usually come from lines heavily admixed with Old English Mastiffs and are very similar in most respects to the latter breed. My two males topped out around 130. Tessa was about 125, and little Jessie was about 98 pounds. For their size, they seemed pretty agile. They could leap high in the air, pivot of their hind legs and in general seemed much more trim and athletic than most giant breed dogs. One woman I know did quite a bit of agility trailing with her 120-pound male. While he was no Border Collie, he wasn't ridiculous doing agility either--at least that was my impression from what she told me. I know of one little female that went Sch. I. One breeder heavily advertised some of her dogs as Schutzhund titled but all they had was the "B" title.

As to Filas, one friend of mine who was into Filas said he thought a lot of the Fila's problems came from the American penchant for turning a 100-pound dog into a 200-pound dog. I wouldn't be surprised if there were some smaller working strains in Brazil. I've met some Filas that were surprisingly pleasant, others that were crazy, dangerous brutes.

I believe there was a Tosa in the old video, Dogs That Protect, clearing a four foot fence before a bite.

Have to agree about the bigger-is-better US attitude. Ruined a lot of good breeds.

The most agile of the big molossers I ever saw was a Boerboel. Couldn't bite worth a damn, but this thing could leap into the back of a pickup from a dead sit.



Of course that excludes American Bulldogs, which I like very much and can pretty well fit any need, but I'm not sure I consider them molossers. Damned if I know what they are.

Nice bulldog in a blind:



Interesting pic from 1910 showing two types of bulldog:



A series of Bulldog skulls illustrating the degradation of the breed's head ...

19th century:


1905:


Juvenile from 1910:


Couple of nice Am Bulls including a very stout brindle:



Another coloured Am Bull:



And for you, Jan, a nice little Staffy Bull bred in Hungary:



lefty

If they didn't dock Boerboels' tails, it would be hard as hell to tell them from Tosas. At first, I thought the dogs in the photo you posted were Tosas. The lighter colored dog on the (viewer's) left looks very, very Tosa-like.

Once in Long Beach, as I was walking Dempsey, a man said to me "Ik geloof dat is en Boerboel." ["I believe that is a Boerboel" in Afrikaans.] I replied, "Nee, dat is geen Boerhoel, hij is en Japanees Tosa" [No, that's no Boeboel, he's a Japanese Tosa."] The man seemed completely unsurprised that I could reply to his Afrikaans in Dutch, which struck me as a little odd.

I've only met a couple of Boerboels. Both seemed very sweet. A gun writer I knew had a huge Boerboel *****. I never saw her, but she sounded very Fila-like--extremely human-aggressive.

One of my most dog-wise dog buddies got a couple of American Bulldogs out of what were supposed to be very good working lines--none of this oversized Johnson stuff. He was rather disappointed in them. "Shells of Pit Bulls," was how he characterized them. I've met a number of other people who have been very happy with theirs, however.

Here's Buster--the ever-expanding presa canario / destroyer of houses I was staying with recently. I don't have any good photos of him as he wouldn't sit still when I wanted him to mug for the camera so you can't really tell just how huge he is. He's only about 1.5 years old, weighs about as much as me, and has, correction, had an attitude problem; I am the dog whisperer. Seriously, just call me Cesar Millan. Now he's much improved. What a big sweetie pie.






And here's the best dog ever--my old pooch Hamlet, mutt from the pound. I believe he was a sharpei / pit bull / german shepherd (those ears are def shepherd-y).

Hooray for molossers! They are great dogs. Alas, given my proclivity for city living and self-hate for keeping a large breed dog in a city apartment, my next one will likely be some lapdog. Any suggestions?

Old pic, but damn:

lefty

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This pic has me at odds. It is simultaneously hilarious since it's almost cartoon-like and also incredibly SAD! POOR THING!!!!

Bonny, pure bred California Coastal Farm Dog