Why the lack of MTM/bespoke casual shirts?

Hey everyone,

I was just reading that "Band of Outsiders is overrated" thread and noticed that someone mentioned MTM shirts being cheaper than BoO at retail.

I like the fit and general aesthetic of BoO shirts, but have a feeling that MTM shirts could fit even better. It'd also be nice to choose my own details & fabrics. The thought of such shirts being cheaper than BoO is also really appealing.

So: why don't we see many MTM/bespoke casual shirts here in SW&D when their dressier counterparts are in abundance over in Men's Clothing? Is it because there are too many variables in the detailing on casual shirts, or just that there aren't many streetwear types interested in wearing MTM, that MTM casual shirts actually wouldn't be that cheap, or what?

Are there some great, cheap MTM casual shirt places that I'm overlooking? I'm interested...

There's not a large enough market yet, and if there is, nobody has taken the initiative to get a business going.

What we need is someone who lives in Hong Kong to go to Jantzen with some BoO shirts, get the sizing right, have that set as a 'model' and let us taller folks be able to adjust from that template.

The walls between MC and SW&D are falling. I kind of like this. Cross-pollination of ideas is always a good way to prevent mental masturbation.

It's not that the idea of MTM casual shirts is a new thing, it's that there simply isn't a readily available program that will provide them. Remember that MTM isn't true bespoke - you're working off a template and hoping that your measurements translate in to something similiar to what you want.

It's also important to realize that most of these tailors have no experience with these type of shirts. When I put in the order for my mytailor.com shirt, Joe actually called me becuase he was so shocked by the measurements - I had to assure him that I really wanted a shirt that was only 29" long with an 18" shoulder and a 21.5" chest!

Which did you get the 2 ply superfine?

Er yea, I did the Two Ply Superfine in Soft Heavy Oxford or Classic Heavy.. don't remember. Picked a white color.

Originally Posted by wmmk

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So: why don't we see many MTM/bespoke casual shirts here in SW&D when their dressier counterparts are in abundance over in Men's Clothing? Is it because there are too many variables in the detailing on casual shirts, or just that there aren't many streetwear types interested in wearing MTM, that MTM casual shirts actually wouldn't be that cheap, or what?

Ok, I think people are starting to miss the big picture.

Let's go basic: what's the basic difference between a shirt you see in MC and a shirt you'd see over here?


Think about it. Let it sink in.


Give up? Maybe some visuals will help:
A trad shirt (Zegna):

A streetwear shirt (Apolis):



A shirt just isn't a shirt. Trad can get away with keeping details simple but clearly there's FAR more room for experimentation in streetwear that you're really almost not even buying fabric to cover your back, you're wearing someone's art (not to sound overly dramatic.) MTM just couldn't do this.

Because there is not a good MTM with casual fabrics that I know of at a good price point.

I do MTM for my dress shirts, jantzen that is...

^ I'd say that depends on the person doing your MTM pieces.

I think Get Smart has had Jantzen cut him military style casual shirts before. I just think that we need someone to get a good dialogue going with one of these tailors, get 1-2 base models put together, and let people just make personal adjustments from those templates.

Originally Posted by Teger

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I think Get Smart has had Jantzen cut him military style casual shirts before. I just think that we need someone to get a good dialogue going with one of these tailors, get 1-2 base models put together, and let people just make personal adjustments from those templates.
Yes. But this probably won't happen. And if it did happen, it would probably be at the "might as well buy BoO instead" price point

Originally Posted by Teger

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I think Get Smart has had Jantzen cut him military style casual shirts before. I just think that we need someone to get a good dialogue going with one of these tailors, get 1-2 base models put together, and let people just make personal adjustments from those templates.
It takes a lot more work to have **** done right. He had a shirt jack made but it was only because a friend of his had previously set up an entire model for them to keep on record to copy. My problem is that do I really want to put all this ******* effort into a shirt when a) I don't know how good the fabric will be and b) at the end of the day it will still be a Jantzen. And c) wonder if I'll ever actually live to receive the shirt I made.

Originally Posted by whodini

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It takes a lot more work to have **** done right. He had a shirt jack made but it was only because a friend of his had previously set up an entire model for them to keep on record to copy.

My problem is that do I really want to put all this ******* effort into a shirt when a) I don't know how good the fabric will be and b) at the end of the day it will still be a Jantzen.

And c) wonder if I'll ever actually live to receive the shirt I made.

Part c sucks.
Part b... really? That's like people saying your friend's suit will just be a thick as thieves suit after all

Originally Posted by cldpsu

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Part c sucks. Part b... really? That's like people saying your friend's suit will just be a thick as thieves suit after all
Yeah, because the fine people at Jantzen also happen to be bad-ass skinheads who take me out for frozen yogurt when I'm in town... Are you really saying Jantzen is like TaT? **** man, that's just sad. You and I will have some words in a few weeks.

MTM also offers no instant gratification.