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You're right, I've never been Christian, Hindu or Buddhist, and have never studied them. However, I have had extensive conversations on the matter, often with people who hold PhDs in the study of these religions. I have, on MANY occasions found that I know more about Christianity than someone saying they are a devout Christian. I've also had them try arguments on me that make no sense at all and fall appart before they even get started (Like: 'The bible is written by men inspired by god, so what is in it is true, and it tells me there is a god, so therefore god is real' I kid you not, I get it all the time). The very few intellectual people who can argue their religion without resorting to stupid circular logic tend to agree that Christianity is full of contradictions, and that if it is the work of god, man has messed that work up good and proper. They eventually jufst say that I might be right, but they like to think that god is real, and some of the bible is worth while so they will stay Christian. I'm okay with that, because they generally don't try to push their religion on me, and think ethical decisions through, rather than looking for passages in the bible to support their pre-conceived notions, prejudices and hatred.
No doubt about it, there are a lot of ****** Xns, just as there are a lot of ****** people of any kind. Well, we all suck to some extent, don't we? (Pardon the language. I need to get to bed.) I think that if you want to judge something well, you need (one needs) to judge it not just on it's worst practitioners but also on its best.
I'm being pushy because I don't like people who say things like this:
Just because we don't know something doesn't mean god did it. It's a possibility, but it's hardly the ONLY possibility.
I don't think blackplatano's argument rests on God doing what we don't know. But maybe it does. He's drawing from a tradition that goes back at least to Aristotle, who said that either all of existence is traced back to one source (linear causality starting with one "unmoved mover") or all of reality is cyclical. He thought the second was irrational. Xn theologians agreed and thought it supported and was supported by the stories of Genesis.
blackplatano asserted that he had proof. I have not seen any of this proof he apparently has.
Well, we can prove very little if anything that we think we know. I'm pretty sure that secular, non-believing historians of today believe Jesus the man existed around 2000 yrs ago. They would base that not only on the testimony of believers but also on the testimony of contemporary (nonXn and non-Jewish) Roman historians.[/quote]I'm willing to accept that he was a man that really existed, I just want to see the proof of it. I'm not asking for proof of him as the Son of God, because that is a waste of time as you wont be able to provide it to my satisfaction.[/quote]Why is proof so important to you? Do you really think that all you know is based on proof?
Anyway, on the "Son of God" thing... aren't we all sons of god? It says that in the bible. So how is Jesus anything other than another man? Some say because he IS god, the physical embodiment of him... but I thought we all were made in god's image, and were all one with god.
Yes, we are all sons (or daughters) of God. But his divinity is by essence and ours is by gift. We were made in the image of God, but the image is not the thing itself. "Image" is a metaphor. The pt is that we share a likeness.
Personally, I believe in Jesus primarily bec. I think there is a great depth and wisdom to his teachings and actions. I wasn't always very religious, but life experience and study has again and again brought home to me the wisdom of Xy. True, Xns as individuals and as a group are not perfect, but what is? Xns and Xy are not what is to be worshiped. God is. And we should not confuse Xns image of God for God, imo.
[/quote]It looks to me like Jesus was just some guy who had some pretty neat ideas, which is kinda awesome in my book.[/quote]It is awesome. And what if he was/is more?