Can't lose my gut - wtf??

whacked · Jul 30, 2008

Originally Posted by odoreater

The problem is that a McDonald's patty does not have the same calories/fat/carbs/fiber.

Says who?

Big Mac All-Beef Hamburger Patty

Organic Valley Ground Beef Patties, Frozen

Adjust for weight and temp (frozen vs. whatever), you basically have the same thing.

NorCal · Jul 30, 2008

Originally Posted by whacked

Says who?

Big Mac All-Beef Hamburger Patty

Organic Valley Ground Beef Patties, Frozen

Adjust for weight and temp (frozen vs. whatever), you basically have the same thing.

Says science. It turns out that the type of fats in Mc **** burgers is different from the fat in grass fed beef. Omega 3 v. omega 6 and all that.

why · Jul 30, 2008

Originally Posted by NorCal

Says science. It turns out that the type of fats in Mc **** burgers is different from the fat in grass fed beef. Omega 3 v. omega 6 and all that.
You're an idiot. I hate to be so blunt, but you have no idea what you're talking about. The types of fats may change slightly (stearic vs linoleic, etc.) but in terms of calories it's almost identical. Omega-3s don't factor in much at all since they're all polyunsaturated and beef has very little polyunsaturated fats (it has to do with the biology of cows and tissue storage and stuff). You don't even know what the **** an Omega-3 is or how it affects the human body outside of what's on your vitamin label.

NorCal · Jul 30, 2008

Originally Posted by why

You're an idiot. I hate to be so blunt, but you have no idea what you're talking about. The types of fats may change slightly (stearic vs linoleic, etc.) but in terms of calories it's almost identical. Omega-3s don't factor in much at all since they're all monounsaturated and beef has very little monounsaturated fats (it has to do with the biology of cows and tissue storage and stuff). You don't even know what the **** an Omega-3 is or how it affects the human body outside of what's on your vitamin label.
Oh my. You need to read more. Try "in Defence of Food" or just start here http://www.csuchico.edu/agr/grsfdbef...ben-o3-o6.html It turns out that many ideas about food are WORNG.

odoreater · Jul 30, 2008

Originally Posted by whacked

Says who?

Big Mac All-Beef Hamburger Patty

Organic Valley Ground Beef Patties, Frozen

Adjust for weight and temp (frozen vs. whatever), you basically have the same thing.

Not quite. You're just picking one's that are convenient for your argument. I can do the same thing:

McDonalds patty: size - 66 gr., 180 calories, 13 gr. fat, (including 1 gr. trans fat), 250 mg. sodium, 15 gr. protein.
Source: McDonalds.com

Beef patties I eat: size - 66 gr., 99 calories (almost half of McDonalds), 5 gr. fat (almost 1/3 of McDonalds), 13 gr. protein
Source: fitday.com

NorCal · Jul 30, 2008

You know what? The above response on my part was a bit weak. It was the first articule google brought up. But do a little research on the subject it might open your eyes a bit.

It also occurred to me that we are likely talking about to different things. You seem to equate health with body fat percentage. Lower body fat equals better health. And so you are only looking at factors that are relevant to reducing body fat percentage.
I am looking at health more as a general over all bodily well being. In my view of health what you eat matters a lot and not just as a means to lower body fat percentage.

whacked · Jul 30, 2008

Originally Posted by odoreater

Not quite. You're just picking one's that are convenient for your argument. I can do the same thing:

McDonalds patty: size - 66 gr., 180 calories, 13 gr. fat, (including 1 gr. trans fat), 250 mg. sodium, 15 gr. protein.
Source: McDonalds.com

Beef patties I eat: size - 66 gr., 99 calories (almost half of McDonalds), 5 gr. fat (almost 1/3 of McDonalds), 13 gr. protein
Source: fitday.com

Uhhh... what's that supposed to prove again? Comparing McDonalds' regular 85% lean/15% fat beef against your 95% lean/5% fat patties? Why don't you just put McD' Apple Pie and organic apples side by side while you're at it?

The point is, for the same grade of meat, McD's and grass-fed beef patties have the same calories/fat/carbs/fiber. Contrary to your earlier post.

odoreater · Jul 30, 2008

Originally Posted by whacked

Uhhh... what's that supposed to prove again? Comparing McDonalds' regular 85% lean/15% fat beef against your 95% lean/5% fat patties? Why don't you just put McD' Apple Pie and organic apples side by side while you're at it?

The point is, for the same grade of meat, McD's and grass-fed beef patties have the same calories/fat/carbs/fiber. Contrary to your earlier post.

So, basically, you're saying that if a mcdonalds burger were the same as any other burger, then it would be the same. Gee, I guess I agree with that.

And, on top of that, do they measure the calories/fat/carbs/fiber on the mcdonalds patty before or after it's been sitting in that drawer in all the grease where they keep them before they warm them up for you? Come on dude, a little common sense goes a long way.

What all this is supposed to prove is that it's a lot easier to stay healthy and lose weight by eating home made burgers rather than McDonalds burgers.

NorCal · Jul 30, 2008

Originally Posted by whacked

The point is, for the same grade of meat, McD's and grass-fed beef patties have the same calories/fat/carbs/fiber. Contrary to your earlier post.

This is not true. Do some research. Grass fed cows have almost zero E.Coli as well.

lefty · Jul 30, 2008

Originally Posted by odoreater

Actually, a bodybuilding diet is pretty simple. Egg whites, chicken breast, tuna, lean steak, and dark carbs (wheat bread, brown rice, oats, etc.), 1 gram of protein per lb. of bodyweight, 40% calories from protein, 40% from carbs, 20 % from good fats. That's what he does. None of this "your body oxides fat the same way no matter what" bla bla bla.

I'm getting tired of all these bookworms that never set foot in a gym telling people to ignore their own experience because that's not what the book says.

I don't know what you're saying. The laws of science cease to work once you adhere to a BB diet?

I've said this before, but the reason BBs stick with the diet you've posted is because it nearly impossible to overeat tuna and oats. It's a simple matter of control.

You gave no idea what various posters experience level is regarding exercise or weight control. Calling these guys bookworms is pretty weak.

lefty

odoreater · Jul 30, 2008

Originally Posted by lefty

I don't know what you're saying. The laws of science cease to work once you adhere to a BB diet?

I've said this before, but the reason BBs stick with the diet you've posted is because it nearly impossible to overeat tuna and oats. It's a simple matter of control.

You gave no idea what various posters experience level is regarding exercise or weight control. Calling these guys bookworms is pretty weak.

lefty

The laws of science? First of all, everyone's body reacts differently to different things. Second of all, there is not a single issue that comes up in these dieting discussions on which there is scientific consensus. Our bodies are very complicated and highly individual and therefore, there are no "laws" when it comes to them. There are, on the other hand, some methods that seem to work and some that seem not to work, so, people can either try what has worked in the past, or they can try what a text book tells them should be true. Personally, I'd rather try what has worked for me and for others in the past, instead of something that some guy who has never tried any of this stuff writes about in a text book. But, that's just me.

lefty · Jul 30, 2008

Originally Posted by odoreater

The laws of science? First of all, everyone's body reacts differently to different things. Second of all, there is not a single issue that comes up in these dieting discussions on which there is scientific consensus. Our bodies are very complicated and highly individual and therefore, there are no "laws" when it comes to them. There are, on the other hand, some methods that seem to work and some that seem not to work, so, people can either try what has worked in the past, or they can try what a text book tells them should be true. Personally, I'd rather try what has worked for me and for others in the past, instead of something that some guy who has never tried any of this stuff writes about in a text book. But, that's just me.

For the most part, we react the same things. There are individual responses that vary, but they are minor variances.

Calling our bodies "highly individual" to me smacks of making excuses for obesity or weakness.

The studies that people post are in fact, scientists looking at things that work and trying to repeat and quantify them. As far as I know, no one has posted anything from a text book. What could your issue be with that?

Remember what Tyler Durden said, "You are not special. You are not a beautiful or unique snowflake. You're the same decaying organic matter as everything else."

lefty

odoreater · Jul 30, 2008

Originally Posted by lefty

For the most part, we react the same things. There are individual responses that vary, but they are minor variances.

Calling our bodies "highly individual" to me smacks of making excuses for obesity or weakness.

The studies that people post are in fact, scientists looking at things that work and trying to repeat and quantify them. As far as I know, no one has posted anything from a text book. What could your issue be with that?

Remember what Tyler Durden said, "You are not special. You are not a beautiful or unique snowflake. You're the same decaying organic matter as everything else."

lefty

My issue is that there are many posters on this board who have negative comments about every single bit of advice (a lot of which is good advice) that is given based on what they've apparently read in books/studies, when it appears that they have never put any of this to the test themselves.

And calling us "highly individual" has nothing to do with obesity and weakness, it has to do with the fact that some things work for some people and don't work for others for whatever reason, so everyone needs to find what works for them.

lefty · Jul 30, 2008

Originally Posted by odoreater

My issue is that there are many posters on this board who have negative comments about every single bit of advice (a lot of which is good advice) that is given based on what they've apparently read in books/studies, when it appears that they have never put any of this to the test themselves.

And calling us "highly individual" has nothing to do with obesity and weakness, it has to do with the fact that some things work for some people and don't work for others for whatever reason, so everyone needs to find what works for them.

A lot the advice is really stupid. "Don't eat grains if you eat to lose BF" comes to mind.

If you disagree with someone who posts the measurable results of a study, prove them wrong with contrary measurable results. Pointing out some big guy at your gym who "eats a tuna shake every day at noon" isn't going to cut it.

lefty

odoreater · Jul 30, 2008

Originally Posted by lefty

A lot the advice is really stupid. "Don't eat grains if you eat to lose BF" comes to mind.

If you disagree with someone who posts the measurable results of a study, prove them wrong with contrary measurable results. Pointing out some big guy at your gym who "eats a tuna shake every day at noon" isn't going to cut it.

lefty

So, personal experience that works doesn't cut it? The only thing that cuts it is what studies say? Sorry, but I disagree.

Can't lose my gut - wtf??

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