Modified Brooks Brothers OCBD: Improvement or Crime against Nature?

Originally Posted by RJman

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Why can't Matuozzo make you an OCBD?

I'm sure she could, but it would be overkill for a shirt I'd like to neglect and abuse with impunity. With discounts, these bad boys are only ~$100 each.

Originally Posted by Manton

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I don't like it. I don't know if I am just being a purist, or if that is my considered aethetic judgement. Maybe a bit of both.

I modified the classic design a little with my CEGO OCBDs, but not that much.

Keep in mind I have never liked mitered or two button cuffs. I also don't like French fronts. And I agree with Captain Snark that a two button collar on an OCBD just seems transgressional in a bad way.

I guessed that you wouldn't like it--which is fair enough, because I wasn't sure that I'd like it either. It did take me a little while to get used to looking at the double-button collar. Now I'm sold.

When worn, the changes don't register so much. We'll see what you think when I put up more photos.

Originally Posted by Connemara

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I don't think OCBD's should be so "formal." They are inherently casual shirts. French placket, mitered cuff...

Well, yes, I suppose that is the fundamental controversy. But I think the fabric and button-down collar keep thinks pretty casual; in application, the other details aren't particularly noticeable.

Originally Posted by Tarmac

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I like it. I would buy it.

Ah, a fan!

Originally Posted by Cornellian

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I'm not wild about the lack of a placket on such a "heavy" shirt . . .

I agree this was the most dubious change, but it looks alright. There's no awkward bulking.

I think that this shirt of yours, M., would get much love on the AAAC "trad" forum.

Share the love, brother.


- B

I go no placket on all my shirts so they can be worn tieless (I am a jacket, no tie guy, esp. in summer). so +1 for the no placket heavy OCBD. To my eye, a placket has to be covered by a tie, and I have a bunch of no-placket BDs, mainly Jantzens, and I like this part of your shirt a lot & have worn no-placket BDs and find them to my liking etc.

The two-button idea is interesting. I'm on the fence. I like BDs to wear tieless since the buttons hold the collars up. I see how the extra button hole & higher collar would give the shirt some structure there, but I don't know that I like the sight of two undone buttons on a shirt worn without a tie. It looks like the collar on a Baracuta jacket (which I like), only with points.

I think maybe the two-button BD collar might look better in something like Get Smart's shirtjack, that is, a shirt that is not meant to be worn with a jacket.

Good job with the experiment, and thank you for posting the pictures.

Looks really,the combo of french placket and no pocket make for a clean look, but personally I have to have a pocket onmy OCBD's

Originally Posted by PittDoc

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Oxford cloth, button down, full cut, etc. all are part of a classic casual look to wear with khakis and a blazer, not an Italian suit. Why even bother BB with such a Frankenstein creation? I'm sure they were glad to take your money but the crew at 346 Madison is probably still laughing.

I'm sure 346 Madison Avenue knows nothing of this shirt. Anyway, their boss is an Italian.

Originally Posted by RJman

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I think mafoofran could get a Matuozzo OBCD and a Rubinacci sack suit. Then he'd be ballin'. Or rollin'. Or whatever the kids are saying.

I do not 'ball' or 'roll'. But a Rubinacci sack would be a fascinating creature.

Originally Posted by voxsartoria

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I think that this shirt of yours, M., would get much love on the AAAC "trad" forum.

Share the love, brother.

Am I even allowed over there anymore? The shirt would only cause further alienation.

I like it. Does it fit well?

Originally Posted by iammatt

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I like it. Does it fit well?

Actually, it fits pretty damned well. Don't tell Anna. There's about an extra 3/4 inch around the waist, but I think the slightly roomier fit suits the shirt.

I like it, but then again I am not a fan of the classic Brooks BD design.

The two-button collar, in particular, is a good improvement.

Originally Posted by mafoofan

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I'm sure she could, but it would be overkill for a shirt I'd like to neglect and abuse with impunity. With discounts, these bad boys are only ~$100 each.

When is the best time to buy to get these kinds of discounts? Are the MTM OCBD's USA made? Do they charge extra for style preferences such as no pocket and side pleats instead of a box pleat?

Thanks.

Originally Posted by mafoofan

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I'm sure she could, but it would be overkill for a shirt I'd like to neglect and abuse with impunity. With discounts, these bad boys are only ~$100 each.
Oh, you can afford it. The difference is like 7% of one Rubinacci.

Originally Posted by Dewey

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I go no placket on all my shirts so they can be worn tieless
??? Is that what I've been doing wrong all these years?

Originally Posted by mafoofan

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I do not 'ball'... But a Rubinacci sack would be a fascinating creature.
I need to wash my brain now.

Originally Posted by mafoofan

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Am I even allowed over there anymore? The shirt would only cause further alienation.

Replace the lowly Manton-y plastic buttons with those Kabbaz MOP ones. They are the finest in the world...center punched from mermaid scale.

Stock up on underwear and socks while you are over there. I am particularly fond of the Zimmerli briefs with the rise that go up to one's nips. I like stuffing the extra fabric into Japanese denim...gathering it up like a spent parachute and jam, jam, jamming it into a pair of Somets.

Makes it look like your packin' cannon...but be careful, you have to stuff the front rather than the back for this effect.



- B

I think I like it, and I imagine I'll like it even more once it gets a bit tattered. My first thought was that maybe you'd be better off with a more refined cloth, but the more I've looked at it, the more I've decided I like the contrast of the design details and the simple cloth. Makes the shirt look less precious than it might with a fancier cloth. The lack of placket works very well. My fondness for minimalism/tradition probably would have prompted me to stick with one-button cuffs, but that's a minor quibble, and me being stuck in my ways.

Not quite sure what to think of the tall two-button collar for open-collar wear. I once bought a tall-collar buttondown and returned it, thinking the collar seemed a bit much. Maybe it was something about the overall effect of that specific shirt, or maybe I just wimped out. I'll be curious to see some pictures of yours in action.

Anyway, nice to see someone willing to tweak a classic design. Doubt you'll run into anyone wearing a shirt like yours, M. Hope you get plenty of wear out of it.

Originally Posted by Dewey

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I go no placket on all my shirts so they can be worn tieless (I am a jacket, no tie guy, esp. in summer). so +1 for the no placket heavy OCBD. To my eye, a placket has to be covered by a tie, and I have a bunch of no-placket BDs, mainly Jantzens, and I like this part of your shirt a lot & have worn no-placket BDs and find them to my liking etc.
Not sure this is so. I think of the french front shirt as more formal or elegant and a placket as less formal and better for tieless. A small difference either way.

Originally Posted by Eustace Tilley

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The two-button collar, in particular, is a good improvement.

I like that all my shirts have two-button collars now. The uniformity soothes me.

Originally Posted by cvac

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When is the best time to buy to get these kinds of discounts? Are the MTM OCBD's USA made? Do they charge extra for style preferences such as no pocket and side pleats instead of a box pleat?

They usually give a 15% discount whenever you buy at least three made-to-measure shirts. That discount can be combined with a further 15% if you apply for and use a Brooks Brothers card to make the purchase.

The options you name don't cost extra.

Originally Posted by RJman

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Oh, you can afford it. The difference is like 7% of one Rubinacci.

Oh, I definitely can't afford it. Anyway, to be admittedly hypocritical, a handsewn OCBD seems a little antithetical to me.

Originally Posted by voxsartoria

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Replace the lowly Manton-y plastic buttons with those Kabbaz MOP ones. They are the finest in the world...center punched from mermaid scale.

Stock up on underwear and socks while you are over there. I am particularly fond of the Zimmerli briefs with the rise that go up to one's nips. I like stuffing the extra fabric into Japanese denim...gathering it up like a spent parachute and jam, jam, jamming it into a pair of Somets.

Makes it look like your packin' cannon...but be careful, you have to stuff the front rather than the back for this effect.

For the record, you said it, not me .

Originally Posted by DocHolliday

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The lack of placket works very well. My fondness for minimalism/tradition probably would have prompted me to stick with one-button cuffs, but that's a minor quibble, and me being stuck in my ways.

Not quite sure what to think of the tall two-button collar for open-collar wear. I once bought a tall-collar buttondown and returned it, thinking the collar seemed a bit much. Maybe it was something about the overall effect of that specific shirt, or maybe I just wimped out. I'll be curious to see some pictures of yours in action.

I might have considered a one-button cuff, but oddly, Brooks Brothers only offers a mitered cuff with two buttons. I don't know why.

The two-button collar is, I think, the most traumatic change to the shirt since it alters the element it's best known for. So, it does look odd at first. But objectively, I think it's an improvement since it adds some vertical emphasis. I normally always leave two shirt buttons undone because I don't like how stuffy it looks to unbutton only the top one. But with this shirt, I'm fine with leaving only one button undone because the collar appears to carve out more open neck space.

Originally Posted by Film Noir Buff

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Not sure this is so. I think of the french front shirt as more formal or elegant and a placket as less formal and better for tieless. A small difference either way.

That's what I figure.