Why Bespoke Shirts?

[Manton]

Only people from noblility

Les Incroyables were by definition not from the nobility. They purposely sought to ape English middle and upper-middle class fashions as a reaction against court dress.

 

[William Massena]

Quote:

In France this is called a DANTON collar.
I do not speak French. Is Danton a French word or the name of a shirt designer who made a collar like this?
Alex, Danton was the first important figure of the French revolution. After the fall of the King, the young French republic decided to  "revolutionize" many of the Old Regime established concept, the time was changed to 100 second increment per minute, calendar had 10 or 11 months of equal days, etc... Obviously fashion of the court was the first to go. These shirts with lace or very elaborate collars were replaced with something very similar to your design. but with a long elaborate neckwear. The most powerful politician of the time Danton was known to wear that shirt with some elaborate white Ascot around his neck. However, he soon got the same fate as Louis XVI, a victim of Terror. When he was sent to the guillotine without his protective neckwear, the simplicity of his shirt somewhat stuck in people's mind. Thus the name of the collar, especially appropriate  to get your head cut. I am sure you can use that as a Marketing tool. Â

 

[ernest]

Quote:

(ernest @ Feb. 24 2005,23:17) Only people from noblility
Les Incroyables were by definition not from the nobility. Â They purposely sought to ape English middle and upper-middle class fashions as a reaction against court dress.
Don't forget you are not Danton but just Manton.

 

[uriahheep]

Don't forget you are not Danton but just Manton.

Here's an example of what amuses me and makes me like Ernest. I don't think that his statements are out of malice, but he probably "loses in translation" sometimes.

 

[linux_pro]

Quote:

my mom always told me that if I asked politely and said please, than I could have one
And, linux, your Mom was entirely correct. I would gladly have given you one. But that wasn't enough, was it? You just had to push the envelope and go for the BIG prize ... the four or five. BZZZZZ Buzzer Sounds - Regis looks crestfallen. Well, linux, you lost the grand prize ... but let's see what Vanna has for you. Oh. You win the wonderful new Salad Spinner and ... but wait, there's more. Seriously, guys, thank you both. That was very nice of you. I shall try to find - or take - more photos as soon as the Regency event is over.
Oh, man.. Foiled by my own greed. Heh heh heh. Well, I had to try something. Ya can't blame a guy for trying, right? Seriously though, that shirt looks very nice. Maybe it's the lighting or something, but it looks... smooth, or silky, not sure how to describe it. It just "flows" really well, and is obviously going to be a great fit on whoever you made it for. To be honest, before this thread I kind of wondered if there could really be much difference at all between a high-end MTM shirt and a bespoke one. Or, even a nice RTW and an MTM. I thought maybe it was just something that only the fanatical would notice. But I have to say that at least from your photos, that shirt appears to be of much higher quality overall (and actually somehow better looking) than any of the shirts in my wardrobe, some of which cost almost as much as your custom shirts (well not quite almost as much, about half as much probably at most). I would be interested in a thread about what type of collars you offer - maybe pictures. Of course, that would probably be too time-consuming. But it would be very interesting reading, especially for those of us with strangely shaped necks, thin faces, etc. I've always been told to wear a straight pointed collar because I am thin. It would be interesting to hear your thoughts on what collars work for who, what ties, what type of suits, etc. But I understand that would probably be vastly too time-consuming. Thanks for the great info so far in this thread. (and no thanks for the pic that makes me want to quit my job in search of the perfect shirt)

 

[Manton]

Don't forget you are not Danton but just Manton.

I have not forgotten. I have no wish to be mistaken for a French revolutionary, however "moderate" he may appear when viewed in the harsh light cast by Robespierre and HÃ

bert. I prefer my own country's revolution.

 

[Alexander Kabbaz]

I do not speak French. Is Danton a French word or the name of a shirt designer who made a collar like this?

Talk about dense, no? Qualification for your bespoke maker: Get so involved in your clothing that the only world history he remembers is that which occurred between Savile Row and Seventh Ave. How embarrassing. [Kabbaz slinks away into corner, hides head under Italian Collar.]

 

[Manton]

hides head under Italian Collar.

Don't you mean a Danton collar?

 

[Manton]

Qualification for your bespoke maker: Get so involved in your clothing that the only world history he remembers is that which occurred between Savile Row and Seventh Ave.

I remember reading somewhere that bespoke artisans ought to concentrate on their craft, and not waste their time on reading or family or hobbies, so as to better serve their customers. But I could just be imagining it.

 

[Alexander Kabbaz]

Oops. No. I meant Manton collar.

Edit:
I think he's been hiding over in the Lounge while I bury my head in the Collar.

 

[uppercase]

Pictures, Alex. Think pictures.
When you finish up the exhibition and all....
They add alot to the descriptions.
All kinds of pictures of all kinds of shirts, collars, other treatments..... TIA

 

[MCA]

Quote:

(That, and the fact that you probably don't make shirts out of 100% polyester)
No, we try to stay only with the higher quality 60%Poly/40%Cotton.
Hi Alex, Did you really mean poly****????

was this a joke???????

Seriously. I Just looked at your Italian collar (I've known it as pajama collar). I know my shirtmaker makes them, but I've never dared asking for one, because samples haven't been available. Your example I find technically impressive. Clearly challenging to make. Do you fuse any part of the collar? However, stylistically speaking, it strikes me as a bit feminine. I'm sure this is not because of any shortcomings of your work. Maybe it's the collar type/pose of the mannequin combination. I'll keep an eye out for other examples of the pajama collar though... perhaps It'll change my mind. Cheers. Edit: Thanks a lot for the pics and information. Always very helpful.

 

[Alexander Kabbaz]

Seriously. I Just looked at your Italian collar (I've known it as pajama collar).

Dear MCA, Our Italian Collar is not a Pajama collar. A traditional Pajama collar has lapels and the leaf has no interlining. The collar lays flat. The construction is completely different. Here is one of our pajama collars:

As to the gender issue ... it's kind of all in how you wear it. You know, the attitude thing. I wear them often and have yet to be barred from the Men's room.

 

[Alexander Kabbaz]

(uppercase \tPosted on Feb. 25 2005,09:50) Pictures, Alex. Think pictures. When you finish up the exhibition and all.... They add alot to the descriptions. All kinds of pictures of all kinds of shirts, collars, other treatments..... TIA

And for tonight's desert, we have a few old leftovers:

 

[Alexander Kabbaz]

Some have inquired regarding pearl buttons and how they are colored. They are dyed. The process for dying is complicated. We have experimented here in the kilns at our art school with good successes ... but the process is quite time-consuming and difficult. Others, for example Gritti, are able to dye certain darker colors onto troca with great consistency. There are three Gritti colors (the 6 buttons, 3rd & 4th rows, left) on this chart. The remainder* were all dyed prior to 1950 by the now defunct Schwanda Button Company of Long Island. I managed to locate the Schwanda collection a couple of decades back and acquired the majority of it. A few colors, notably White, Black("smoke"), Grey, Off-white, Abalone, and some Browns occur naturally but without, except in the case of white, consistency of either color or shell quality. *A few of the smoke colored buttons are from the Muscatine Iowa fellows and were made of mussel shells prior to 1900.