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whnay.'s good taste thread

Discussion in 'Classic Menswear' started by Manton, Jul 30, 2012.

  1. mafoofan

    mafoofan Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    Well, let me be clear. There is "passable" according to rules of specific orthodoxies, and there is "passable" according to aesthetic considerations taken in light of such orthodoxies.

    From my understanding of Ivy or American Trad orthodoxy, a white OCBD worn as above is perfectly passable--even ideal. However, my point is that, taking the broader classic menswear orthodoxy as a whole, we know white to be the most formal of shirt colors. Further, since we are now "allowed" to wear blue as a staple shirt, we have a more casual alternative available which is "passable" in the big picture (though perhaps not by Ivy or American Trad standards; I can't say because I'm not an expert on them). That alternative also happens to be beyond correct. It is thematically more coherent and aesthetically superior (white cuts harshly against tweed, which is typically imbued with the color of an earthy landscape).

    If you want to mimmic a particular style from the past, such as Ivy, my reasoning doesn't work for you. But I hate historical costume. I'd rather dress in a way prudently informed by tradition, not in slavish, to-the-letter adherence to one idiosyncratic orthodoxy or another.
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2013
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  2. Tirailleur1

    Tirailleur1 Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    Doc what do you define as "simply"? I personally dont think anyone in sf dresses "simply." The sacred cows included
     
  3. Omar1223

    Omar1223 Senior member

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    i think it looks great too. i was curious as to what foo thought and his explanation was more or less how i thought he would feel.
     
  4. DocHolliday

    DocHolliday Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    Chris O'Donnell's character looks like he got dressed without thinking about it. Easy, natural, effortless. Yet he still looks great. Exactly what Foo says he's aiming for.
     
  5. Tirailleur1

    Tirailleur1 Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    Well it is fair to also mention that it is a different time where everyone dressed this way without thinking about it. Sort of lime second nature. I believe no matter how nonchalant one looks in his suit today it will still come off too cerebral. Would you agree?
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2013
  6. Cantabrigian

    Cantabrigian Senior member

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    A blazer, if anything, should distinctly not be worsted.

    Without some texture (hopsack, fresco, even flannel), it looks like a suitcoat. Blazers also like patch pockets and patch pockets on a worsted cloth always looks wrong (Phat Guido notwithstanding).
     
  7. dieworkwear

    dieworkwear Senior member

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  8. mafoofan

    mafoofan Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    Hopsack and fresco are worsted cloths. They just have more open weaves.

    I think a flannel blazer is an oddball garment.


    I am not mistaking anything. I understand the difference. And I am also familiar with worsted flannels. I own two suits made of the stuff. Yes, you can find the twill weave, but you have to look closely. From normal viewing distance (say, three to five feet away), you shouldn't be able to see it.

    Now look at the "flannel" separates at Land's End. That is clearly not a worsted flannel. It has none of the brushed texture you would expect to find over the twill base.
     
  9. dieworkwear

    dieworkwear Senior member

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  10. mafoofan

    mafoofan Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    Yes. Look at the close-up of the cloth. If you were told nothing, would you say it were a worsted flannel? I sincerely doubt it. And if it is a worsted flannel, and barely brushed with barely any flannel texture at all, it is only technically worsted flannel, and certainly would not suffice for a classic "grey flannel suit."
     
  11. Apollotrader

    Apollotrader Senior member

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    Some people, even those with massive amounts of excellent knowledge, would do well with a nice tall cool glass of polish with a sidecar of tact once in a while.
     
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  12. Tirailleur1

    Tirailleur1 Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    I would assume that it would be terribly presumptuous for one to clearly tell fabrication from the computer screen.

    But then again you are foo... you are always right.
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2013
  13. dieworkwear

    dieworkwear Senior member

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    Yea, I've seen swatches of worsted flannel with degrees of nappy-ness (is that a PC term?). Some look like the Lands End one. I assume that's just a super up-close shot. Look how big the twill weave is. If you zoomed in on some worsted flannel, it would look like that.

    Anyway, regarding charcoal pants - whatever you guys think of Foo's delivery, I think he's more or less right. I don't think it's bad to own one or two pairs in the closet. I do. But they get worn maybe two or three times a year? Most well dressed gentlemen I know also rarely charcoal pants. That doesn't mean you'll look bad in charcoal pants, it simply means that FME, most well dressed men I know rarely wear them.
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2013
  14. aravenel

    aravenel Senior member

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    Definitely agree, though like you, I am not as vehement as :foo:. I have a couple of pairs, and don't wear them often. Mid-grey is where its at.
     
  15. Tirailleur1

    Tirailleur1 Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    That is different from CHARCOAL PANTS ARE BAD AND ALL OF YOU ARE IGNORANT PLEBS LISTEN TO ME

    I personally wouldn't necessarily wear charcoal pants myself, but I have seen them executed well. You might rarely wear yours. But I am sure that there are many things in your closet that your rarely wear as well.
     
  16. Tirailleur1

    Tirailleur1 Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    I'm a mid-grey guy myself. But I do have a charcoal suit.
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2013
  17. Patrick R

    Patrick R Senior member

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  18. dieworkwear

    dieworkwear Senior member

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    It stands as good advice though: if you're just starting to build a wardrobe, you should not buy navy or charcoal trousers before having a bunch of lights and mid-greys in the closet, in different weaves and weights. You may be the exception to this rule and look great in those trous, but one things is for sure: you will be building an unorthodox wardrobe, and then find it difficult to use a lot of the other advice given on here. That seems like it will just make things harder on yourself for no reason.
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2013
  19. etkl

    etkl Senior member

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    I have no quibble with your experience or tone but my experience is quite the opposite and I wear regularly wear charcoal pants, for example, with a black and white glen plaid sportcoat. Moreover every swatchbook of trousering I've ever seen includes variations of charcoal in worsted and/or flannel.
     
  20. aravenel

    aravenel Senior member

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    Absolutely agree with this.

    Charcoal trousers can work--with a light grey SC (which is hard to pull off in and of itself), or sometimes with sweaters. But yeah, they are not particularly versatile, are hard to do well, and I rarely wear mine for these reasons. And like you, I would not advise newbies to buy them. Mid grey, mid grey, mid grey, maybe some shade of brown.

    Honestly, mine probably get worn the most when I do something dumb like mistakenly take all my mid-greys to the cleaners at the same time. Whoops.
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2013
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