Which shoe do you like better: EG Inverness 82 Last or JL Westminster?

[paeday]

I just wanted to hear what members of this forum think. I posted a similar question regarding the JL Jremyn II and EG/RLPL Grant and I really enjoyed the responses (I ended up getting the Vale in Parisian Brown). Thanks in advance....your thoughts are much appreciated.

PD

 

[aportnoy]

Be a man, buy both.

 

[luk-cha]

personally i too would get both but if 1 is only the option i would get the inverness in antiqued burgundy

 

[william]

I like the JL Westminster better due to the balmoral styling.

 

[josepidal]

I think it ends up as a question between 8000 last and 888 last. What do you guys think? I own both, but end up thinking I really prefer the 888 last.

Hence, Inverness.

 

[paeday]

Again thanks for the responses......I would love the get both shoes but I wanted to get a shoe that would fill the balmoral/oxford wingtip role in my rotation and I can only afford one at the moment (alas, I can only dream about being a real man

).

I think both the Inverness and Westminster are bal wingtips full brogue shoes and I have a need for that. I do have a clunky Allen-Edmond blucher wingtip I picked up at GVH but I wanted a more sophisticated balmoral to complement that one.

I believe that the JL Westminster is actually on the 7000 last and the 82 last from EG is similiar (both rounded toes). I do love the 888 and I have four pairs of EG/RLPL on that last so I wanted something rounded to add a little variety.

PD

 

[zjpj83]

8000 last rules

 

[luk-cha]

Originally Posted by josepidal

I think it ends up as a question between 8000 last and 888 last. What do you guys think? I own both, but end up thinking I really prefer the 888 last.

Hence, Inverness.

the title of the thread tell us he is after the 82! not the 888

 

[josepidal]

Yeah, I need to go to sleep, sorry for the mixup.

Maybe we can request Aportnoy for a side-by-side photo of 82 versus 7000. For round toe, I imagine I'd go with 7000.

 

[HalfCanvas]

The Inverness is a blind brogue, which makes it a very sleek wingtip. I've never seen it on the 82 last though. I think the EG website has it on the 888.

 

[Roger]

The JL Westminster is on the 7000 last. In Gaziano and Girling's taxonomy of their lasts, the JL 7000 and the EG 82 would fall into the category of "smart round lasts." This means a pretty sleek, quite-tapered form running from the ball of the foot to the toe, when viewed from above. If you were to take the width of the toe about 1/2" back, it would be considerably less than found in a more traditional round-toe last like the EG 202. This means that there will be a little empty space right at the toe in the 7000 (and probably the 82 as well, although I don't have shoes on that last). Because of this, I take an 8.5 UK in the 7000 last, as opposed to the 9 UK I take in a less-tapered last like the JL 8695.

With all credit to Timeless Rider (and I hope his permission!), here's his extremely helpful page showing some comparisons of the various lasts, including the JL 7000 and the EG 82:

http://img25.imageshack.us/gal.php?g=eg606-eg888_sm.jpg

If you click (to enlarge) on the picture of the EG 82 and JL 7000, you'll see a nice comparison of them from above. The JL 7000 (represented here by the Jermyn II) can be seen to be considerably more tapered than the EG 82, the latter tending towards a more traditional round-toe last. Now if you drop down to the last picture on the right and enlarge it, you'll see the difference in the two lasts from a side view. It's clear from that perspective that the JL 7000 has a lower and more-tapered toe box (by a fair margin) than does the EG 82. All things considered, the JL 7000 last is considerably sleeker than the EG 82, and, in my opinion, a far more interesting last. I have a pair of the Westminsters and consider them one of my best and most versatile shoes.

There are other variables on which these two shoes differ. The JL Westminster (coming from their Prestige line) has their RTW beveled waist and slight fiddleback sole form at the waist (certainly not what you'd see in bespoke shoes, but noticeable nonetheless). When I place a straightedge across the sole at the waist, there is about 1/4" drop from the height of the "fiddleback" at the center to the edges--the latter having some bevel to them at the waist. On my EG shoes, there is very little drop across the sole at the waist.

Another difference is in the broguing pattern, from back of the wingtip pattern, which is the same on each. On the Inverness, there are three lines of broguing, going in different directions, whereas on the Westminster, there is really only a single line running around the throat and running back the full length of the shoe to the heel and parallel to the sole line, a pattern somewhat similar to that seen on typical derby longwings. I like this pattern and find it a little more racy than that on the Inverness.

Finally, and on this I might be completely out to lunch (so someone--Tattersall, Aportnoy, Jcusey, Bengal-stripe--please correct me if I'm wrong), I was under the impression that the Inverness had what might be termed "flush" broguing--i.e., where the broguing is done in a single piece of leather, without a second piece of brogued leather being stitched on top of a piece of unbrogued leather. I don't have the Inverness, so cannot confirm this (and it's all but impossible to tell from the catalog picture), but that was my impression. The Westminster is made with the typical broguing pattern where a brogued piece of leather is stitched on top of a smooth piece (and thus is raised from the underlying piece) at the toe and along the quarters. If this were true, the brogued portions of the Inverness would not be raised, and the whole shoe would be flush with respect to the pieces of leather stitched together. The effect of this would be a slightly sleeker form, I think, while still maintaining the brogued appearance. But again, I may be hallucinating about this!

Edit: I guess I should try to answer the opening question. For me, I'd take the JL Westminster over the EG Inverness on the 82 last, largely because of the differences in the lasts. On the other hand, if the Inverness were on the EG 88 or 888 lasts, it would be a difficult choice. Still, given the differences in the soles at the waist and in the broguing pattern (not the laid-on vs. blind broguing, regarding which I like the latter--thanks, HalfCanvas, for clarifying that), I think my personal choice would still be the Westminster.

 

[HalfCanvas]

You are right that the Inverness is a "flush brogue," something I referred to as "blind brogue." It does result in a sleek wingtip.

 

[TKDKid]

JL Westminster:

- the top part of the shoe overlapping the bottom part looks a bit weird to me.

I think I'm used to it being the other way around, like on these:

 

[Artisan Fan]

I like the EG better.

 

[gdl203]

I would vote for the JL just because of the last choice. If you were considering Inverness on 888, I would vote for that - I have a pair in Burgundy and it's one of my favorite pairs of shoes