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What's your favorite mainstream designer?

Discussion in 'Classic Menswear' started by European Interloper, Apr 12, 2002.

  1. jetLab

    jetLab Well-Known Member

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    Seven is coming out with men's jeans and they think cords will be the next big thing. I saw no-logo Prada Sport jeans on sale the other day for around $150. They were straight-leg and seemed to have a nice fit, but looked a bit too plain. http://www.b-forza.com/1.28/4026.html A lot of Prada Sport sweaters and shirts now don't have any logos which is good. Go to eBay and you will see why Prada needs to get rid of the red flash.
     
  2. LA Guy

    LA Guy Opposite Santa Staff Member Admin Moderator

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    Actually, cords have been a "hipster" staple since at least the mid-nineties, and have been shown on the runways for at least 2 winter seasons. The next big thing, huh? Sort of like military gear or western wear? Or maybe distressed jeans? Or maybe 3-piece suits and traditional menswear?

    The problem with designer clothing is that it's often used in lieu of any real personal style. Notice that designers never base their collections on what celebrities are wearing this year, since that's what they designed last year, and what the typical man or woman shopping at Barneys/Macys/Target will be wearing next year. They base their collections around street musicians, Italian gentlemen lounging in the piazza, army-surplus and vintage-clothed grad students, British punk rockers and hostel-hopping backpackers, none of which generally give a damn whether cords are going to be big this year, or whether Tom Ford thinks that lux/flash is SO over.
     
  3. bigbadbuff

    bigbadbuff Senior member

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    RL Purple Label overrated? Maybe, but barely if at all. The few things I have from that line I love.

    I am in a similiar dilemma as someone else stated here- I'm 5'10" 220 lbs and go to the gym as well... so the designers out there I can where is sadly very, very minimal.

    The best designers IMO (from my experience) that are consistently excellent with their quality and wearability are Armani, Zegna, Lora Piana and Barbera.
     
  4. Joe G

    Joe G Senior member

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    I feel ya. At about the same weight but with about a half-foot, I couldn't wear anything by Dior Homme or Yamamoto even if I particularly wanted to.

    Peace,

    JG
     
  5. LabelKing

    LabelKing Senior member

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    I have a question of the fits of Dior Homme, Yamamoto, YSL, and such. Are the sizes are made smaller, or what? Thank you.
     
  6. pstoller

    pstoller Senior member

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    Not the sizes, per se, but the cuts. That is, those designers tend to cut closer to the body, assuming a slimmer physique. So, pant legs will be narrower, as will jacket sleeves and waists, even if the nominal pant waist and jacket chest measurements are (roughly) the same as other designers.
     
  7. Joe G

    Joe G Senior member

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    The YSL RG stuff I saw this season (Quartier 206 in Berlin carries most of the line) was actually quite generous in cut. Comically so, even. I find it quite humourous that whilst actual hip-hoppers are coming up with classically-inspired clothing, Tom Ford takes another spin at hip-hop fashion ca. 1995.

    Peace,

    JG
     
  8. pstoller

    pstoller Senior member

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    Different stuff in Europe, maybe? None of the YSL RG I've seen in LA recently (at Neiman Marcus, Fred Segal, YSL boutiques, etc.) could be remotely described as "hip-hop fashion c. 1995." I didn't try it on to check the fit, but it certainly didn't look especially generously cut on hangers or mannequins.
     
  9. davei

    davei Senior member

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    The YSL RG stuff I saw this season (Quartier 206 in Berlin carries most of the line) was actually quite generous in cut. Comically so, even. I find it quite humourous that whilst actual hip-hoppers are coming up with classically-inspired clothing, Tom Ford takes another spin at hip-hop fashion ca. 1995.
    Different stuff in Europe, maybe? None of the YSL RG I've seen in LA recently (at Neiman Marcus, Fred Segal, YSL boutiques, etc.) could be remotely described as "hip-hop fashion c. 1995." I didn't try it on to check the fit, but it certainly didn't look especially generously cut on hangers or mannequins.
    Probably buyer editing. All the RG stuff I've seen in Toronto is slim cut as well. It's in keeping with the general perception of European clothing.
     
  10. Joe G

    Joe G Senior member

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    The cuts are still slim, but the sizes are out-of-whack. For example, I saw an interesting coat and tried it on. It fit pretty well. When I looked at the label, what made be laugh was not the price, but the size. It was a size 50. I normally take 56 in coats to be worn with jackets, and 54 otherwise. It was about this time that I was informed I should buy my normal size and deal with errant billows of cloth all about. The same with the trousers: it seems Tom Ford wants to make people who sell YSL into the old "Gap girls" from SNL. No, they're perfect, you just need to cinch 'em. No thanks.

    Peace,

    JG
     
  11. pstoller

    pstoller Senior member

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    I should probably move this over to "pet peeves," but count me as one who's fed up with designers who seem incapable of accurately using a tape measure. An inch is an inch, a centimeter is a centimeter. If pants are size 32 x 32 (US), then they should have an actual 32" waistband and 32" inseam (or, in the case of jeans, should at least shrink to that size after washing). If a jacket is a size 40 (US), then it should comfortably fit a man with a 40" chest, not a man with a 44" chest or a 36" chest.

    Someone over in "peeves" complained about people who don't know their own size. I agree; but, when designers don't even know what size a garment is, how are average consumers supposed to figure it out? This is not "style," it's stupidity.
     
  12. LA Guy

    LA Guy Opposite Santa Staff Member Admin Moderator

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    I usually agree with pstoller, but have to disagree somewhat with this one. I think that designers should size their clothing according to how *they* believe a piece should fit. After all, they design on a standard form, and unless there has been some miscommunication with the manufacturer, I'm fairly sure that Tom Ford understands that his size 50 Gucci overcoat is meant to be oversized, same as Hedi Slimane realizes that his size 50 jacket will hug the torso of any man with a standard 33 inch waist. If a customer wants a tighter or looser fit, it is the customer's perogative, not the designer's to conform to his wishes.

    Sometimes, I see people wearing tight Comme shirts, when it's obvious that the shirt was meant to be worn oversized to emphasize the pattern. I've also seen people wear loose Dior (and he wasn't a small man. I have no idea how he found the size). Fine. But that's personal style or the lack thereof, and not necessarily how the designer envisioned his (or her) creation to look.
     
  13. davei

    davei Senior member

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    There may be a standard form, but fit models differ between designers. Obviously, not everyone has the same body type, so what may look horrid in "actual designer size" may look great going a size up or size down. There's a little subversion of a designer's vision going on, but personally, I'll go up or down a size for a particular fit. Sometimes sizes vary in a single designer's line, which is VERY annoying (should go in the other thread [​IMG] ) I have this one Dirk Schonberger shirt which fits perfectly (not too loose, not too tight, neck button can be done up comfortably) and it's an M. I had to get this one jersey type shirt from the same designer in a XXL because the neck hole in M was just too darned tight. And no, my neck hasn't grown lately, I've been a 16 neck for years [​IMG]
     
  14. Joe G

    Joe G Senior member

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    I think I'll split the difference here. It's perfectly fine for designers to shape their pieces however they want. However, I have to side with pstoller that the conventional size measurements should be done precisely, and accurately noted on the piece. After all, a 32x32 pair of jeans doesn't say anything about the dimensions of the jeans in any place except for the waist and inside leg. Those should be precisely 32" each. A shirt labeled a size 41 should have a collar of precisely 41cm (16"), although the sizing convention leaves it free to have a body 41cm around as well, or sleeves twenty feet long for that matter. And a size 56 coat should have a chest dimension of precisely 46". With that "hardpoint" in place, it can be darted or billowed to the heart's content. As for the YSL RG coat I tried on, I agree with you that it was Mr. Ford's prerogative to design overcoats to be worn such that the wearer is swimming inside of it. However, pstoller is 100% right that it should be sized according to a hard measurement. He can indicate the manner in which it is to be worn either through a competent sales staff (I've never seen a YSL RG stockist lacking such people, and Quartier 206 certainly doesn't) or through a size-description such as "56 intended for someone who normally takes a 50". I guess another method is an entirely editorial sizing scheme, i.e. S/M/L or a numeric representation thereof. This method seems particularly French, being used by Lacoste for their tennis shirts and Yamamoto, etc. And all of the dispute about how things should be sized aside, it's also my prerogative to call his oversized coat design moronic. Â [​IMG] Peace, JG
     
  15. pstoller

    pstoller Senior member

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    Given the "over" in "overcoat," I accept that such garments are going to be sized loosely to allow for suits, sweaters, and the like. It's hard to be precise with such a garment, even if you're Hedi Slimane. And, as for M.Slimane's jacket, if it requires a man with an 8 drop, that's fine...but there's no good reason he shouldn't say so.

    (A note on that: my Dior tux jacket leaves virtually no room for me to have a larger waist than I do. However, the pants that came with the jacket were 2+ inches too large, requiring a recut. I have seen Dior Homme outfits on the runway, and the look is NOT to have your pants falling off your ass. So, why didn't the pants fit me off the rack, when the jacket did?)

    I'm not simply talking about tighter or looser fit: I'm talking about does or doesn't fit. There are designers who clearly want you to look like you're a kid wearing your dad's clothes (Rei Kawakubo comes to mind), and I suppose I can make exceptions for such designers even if I can't take their jackets seriously. Dave's point about fit models is well taken; I don't expect the line of a jacket to work for me just because it's "my size." But if something fits me perfectly when I go up or down a size (or two), it's not the fit model.

    Regarding YSL, Might not Ford be using French sizing rather than Italian? Not that I understand what the basis is for the sizing system, but I wear a size 40 in YSL pants, whereas I wear a 46 (usually) in Italian sizing. Obviously, Ford doesn't mean to bisect his customers when they zip their flies.
     
  16. feltva

    feltva Member

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    I voted, with ease, for Dior with Slimane at the helm. This man really knows how to cut cloth. Especially for us tall skinny guys (I'm 6', 140 lbs). His designs aren't for every body type, but if you can pull them off, they make you look so good. Take for instance the suit he cut for himself for the fall 2001 Dior show. This is him at the end of the show: http://www.firstview.com/MENfall2001...DIOR/P107.html http://www.firstview.com/MENfall2001...DIOR/P108.html http://www.firstview.com/MENfall2001...DIOR/P109.html
     
  17. Stone

    Stone Senior member

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    The only label that doesn't produce anything I wouldn't buy is CP Company... so, Massimo Osti, but I don't think that's mainstream.

    I chose Ralph Lauren, then, I guess, for Purple Label...although that clothing doesn't really seem "designed".
     
  18. European Interloper

    European Interloper Senior member

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    CP Company is well known but as it has (to my knowledge) only entered the mainstream in terms of casual, non-hard-labour wear, I left it off the list. I love the rereleased Mille jacket... I used to wear my father's, but it was always too big in the arms. Now, everything fits perfectly.
    European Interloper
     
  19. jetLab

    jetLab Well-Known Member

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    Where's Neil Barrett?
     
  20. European Interloper

    European Interloper Senior member

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