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What are your 10 favorite cities in the world?

Discussion in 'General Chat' started by drizzt3117, Nov 24, 2004.

  1. globetrotter

    globetrotter Senior member

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    I would have a problem calling a city a great food city based entirly on imported cuisines
    If thats the case, then SURELY there are no AMERICAN cities on your list of "great food cities" or are you suggesting that "american cuisine" (I.E. hamburgers, barbeque, hotdogs, pizza, Jello, etc) ranks among the worlds best?
    well, what I usually eat in London or amsterdam is "imported" cuisines - usually chinese in london and surinamese in amsterdam. but nobody would call those great food cities. New york may be the only exception to the "rule" - the very scale of available and quality of varried cuisines stagers the mind. the main diference between new york and tokyo in this instance is that the best indian food in new york is made for indians who live in new york, the best chinese is made for chinese in new york, etc. in tokyo, the food preperation people are imported to make food for the japanese (and pardon my generalization, but it is close to perfect). you don't have a large indian population, or mexicn population in tokyo, and most of the expats are people who are not their for good. If I had to choose the best food cities in North America - New York would be on the very short list, but the others would be cities would strong indiginous cuisines - memphis, new orleans, san antonio
     
  2. drizzt3117

    drizzt3117 Senior member

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    I agree to some degree with TS's comments:

    I think the Japanese as well as Chinese, and other Asian cultures, are somewhat more insular than European cultures, at least overtly so. The Chinese and Japanese both have terms that represent non-Chinese and non-Japanese people as inferior. While Western cultures may feel the same way, it's at least not as clearly stated.

    As far as costs, I think generally Tokyo is one of the most expensive cities in the world, but TS is right in saying that you can find expensive meals anywhere you go, and you can also find relatively inexpensive meals wherever you go.

    Finally, regarding cuisine, there actually is an "American-style" haute-cuisine, kind of a farm-fresh fusion cuisine that has been put into the limelight by the likes of Keller and Ogden, pretty good and interesting stuff, and quite different from French cuisine, although it is inspired by many different styles of cuisine from different cultures.
     
  3. ernest

    ernest Senior member

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    Talk me about japanese food. What do they can in the morning most of time?
    Are you asking me what Japanese people eat for breakfast? Well a traditional Japanese breakfast consists of Miso soup, rice, and possibly some fish. But by no means is that your only option. you can eat excellent fresh baked french pastries, omlettes, eggs benedict, pancakes, dim-sum, cereal, fresh fruit, scrambled eggs, sausages, a proper english breakfast, hashbrowns, whatever... thinking you have to eat sushi and rice three meals a day is ludicrous. I would be in real trouble in France, since I don't really like eating foie gras, escargo and drinking wine for every meal. Globetrotter -
    If thats the case, then SURELY there are no AMERICAN cities on your list of "great food cities" or are you suggesting that "american cuisine" (I.E. hamburgers, barbeque, hotdogs, pizza, Jello, etc) ranks among the worlds best?
    Not ALL but 90% of them. Most of fructs, vegetables, weat... HOW MUCH IS AN APPLE?
    What Western guy wants ti eat this? None. I imagine you can eat western food too but why going to Tokyo to eat western food at a higher price than at home?
    Who told you it was the typical French lunch or diner? Nobody eats escargo and most of people eat foie gras 3/4 fois per years. The choice in French food (cheese, bread, hams, deserts...) or meals (each area has her very different dishes) is 100 time larger than in Japanese food. And we have many strangers who imported their own food.
     
  4. drizzt3117

    drizzt3117 Senior member

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    (drizzt3117 @ Feb. 23 2005,19:01) Yes you can read the signs but what significance does Nepszinhaz utca have to most people who don't speak Hungarian? I estimate about 5-10% of the people in Budapest actually speak English, I think the total in Tokyo is probably closer to 50%, and at least 25%. Anyone under the age of 30 should speak English fairly well, I have quite a few employees that emigrated here to take jobs directly from Tokyo and hadn't been outside of the US, their English is not too hard to understand. Older Hungarians may speak French or German, the younger ones are more likely to speak Slavic languages (mostly Russian) Remember, under the 40 years of Soviet rule, they didn't teach much French or German in Hungary.
    Russian have gone for long time (enough to allow a generation to speak English) In east of Europe many people have always spoken German particulary in Hungary (dont' forget the Autro-hungarian Empire and that East Germany was a model in the east bloc so many people learnt german). And people from east Europe are very talented for languages, much more than Japanese. Everybody under 30 years speaks English because English is everywhere (all movies on TV or cinema are in original version with subtitles). I think that in Japan (like in France) everything on TV is in Japanese (French).
    Umm, have you BEEN to budapest or hungary? While I believe more people speak German than English, most people there do not communicate well in either. The Russian occupation of Hungary ended only about 15 years ago, and the school systems did not immediately switch to a system which educates the speakers in English. Also, the Austro-Hungarian empire ended in 1919, and in the ~30 years between the wars, German was not taught in schools. I would say that Budapest has the lowest percentage of english speakers of any major European city (pop > 1M)
     
  5. ernest

    ernest Senior member

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    So how can you say it is an expensive city?

    Take the same average meal/same quality. What would be the price in Paris/NY/Tokyo.
     
  6. drizzt3117

    drizzt3117 Senior member

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    (Tokyo Slim @ Feb. 24 2005,21:40) Ernest, your assertion that ALL products in Japan are imported, thus expensive is not only incorrect, it would be economically unfeasible. The Japanese make some fine goat cheeses and wines BTW. Maybe not up to the standards of your superior french palette, but very good nonetheless. Imported v.s. domestic has very little to do with cost in many places and for many different things, in fact I remember noticing at a bar that beer imported from the US (and even some from Europe) was less expensive than some Japanese domestic. Of course, like everything else in asia, it depends on where you go for your food.
    Are you asking me what Japanese people eat for breakfast? Well a traditional Japanese breakfast consists of Miso soup, rice, and possibly some fish. But by no means is that your only option. you can eat excellent fresh baked french pastries, omlettes, eggs benedict, pancakes, dim-sum, cereal, fresh fruit, scrambled eggs, sausages, a proper english breakfast, hashbrowns, whatever... thinking you have to eat sushi and rice three meals a day is ludicrous. I would be in real trouble in France, since I don't really like eating foie gras, escargo and drinking wine for every meal. Globetrotter -
    If thats the case, then SURELY there are no AMERICAN cities on your list of "great food cities" or are you suggesting that "american cuisine" (I.E. hamburgers, barbeque, hotdogs, pizza, Jello, etc) ranks among the worlds best?
    Not ALL but 90% of them. Most of fructs, vegetables, weat... HOW MUCH IS AN APPLE?
    What Western guy wants ti eat this? None. I imagine you can eat western food too but why going to Tokyo to eat western food at a higher price than at home?
    Who told you it was the typical French lunch or diner? Nobody eats escargo and most of people eat foie gras 3/4 fois per years. The choice in French food (cheese, bread, hams, deserts...) or meals (each area has her very different dishes) is 100 time larger than in Japanese food. And we have many strangers who imported their own food.
    I think most Westerners that visit Japan will eat Japanese food, most people enjoy it quite a bit, in the US, japanese restaurants are absolutely everywhere. Americans, at least, seem to have very little problem eating Japanese food.
     
  7. drizzt3117

    drizzt3117 Senior member

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    (drizzt3117 @ Feb. 24 2005,21:58) As far as costs, I think generally Tokyo is one of the most expensive cities in the world, but TS is right in saying that you can find expensive meals anywhere you go, and you can also find relatively inexpensive meals wherever you go.
    So how can you say it is an expensive city? Take the same average meal/same quality. What would be the price in Paris/NY/Tokyo.
    It's really hard to compare, especially because a huge percentage of the cost of a meal is going to be wine, so the list is going to determine what the cost is. However, prices at Nobu are pretty similar in London, Tokyo, and New York (within 10-15%) for a non-wine experience.
     
  8. ernest

    ernest Senior member

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    So how do you explain that people go more in PAris/London/NYC/ROMA than to Tokyo if this is one of the best 10 cities for all these things told by TS ?
     
  9. drizzt3117

    drizzt3117 Senior member

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    The question isn't whether it's one of the best cities in the world, the question was what are your favorite cities in the world. If most of the people who go there really like it, then it's going to be one of their favorite cities. The expense of going to Tokyo is higher than going to places in the US (for Americans) or even going to Europe (for Americans) so likely less people will have gone there than to the latter places. Some people may have Antartica has one of their 10 favorite places, but most people won't, because very few people have gone there.
     
  10. Roy

    Roy Senior member

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    (drizzt3117 @ Feb. 23 2005,18:18) It could be that less people have been to Tokyo than to cities in Europe, it's difficult to call a city one of your favorite if you haven't been there. Â
    So how do you explain that people go more in PAris/London/NYC/ROMA than to Tokyo if this is one of the best 10 cities for all these things told by TS ?
    You're out of your mind. I'm from Amsterdam. If I want to go to Paris it will just take me 3 hours on the Thalys. If I feel like going to Rome it is 1,5 hours by plane. When I feel like going to Geneva it's 1 hour by plane. If I want to go Tokio it's 14 hours by plane. Not to mention the cost. THAT is why most people go to the cities you mentioned.
     
  11. Tokyo Slim

    Tokyo Slim Senior member

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    First of all, fruits and vegetables are mostly grown locally, apples, pears, cherries, tangerines, and etc. are frequently grown in Japan. Where do you get your information? Whomever is telling you these lies should be stopped.

    I was there last two years ago. I wasn't really concerned with the price of apples, so I don't really recall. I DO know that a bag of six oranges was 500 yen at the local grocery store. I'm sorry, I don't really like apples.

    I hope that answers your question.

    RIGHT NOW, as of 2005.02.24 21:14:23 GMT.
    1.00 United States Dollars \t \t= \t \t105.344 JPY


    So RIGHT NOW - six oranges would cost you $4.75 in USD

    or 3.6 Euro
     
  12. ernest

    ernest Senior member

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    Quote Ernest, your assertion that ALL products in Japan are imported, thus expensive is not only incorrect, it would be economically unfeasible. Not ALL but 90% of them. Most of fructs, vegetables, weat... HOW MUCH IS AN APPLE?
    First of all, fruits and vegetables are mostly grown locally, apples, pears, cherries, tangerines, and etc. are frequently grown in Japan. Where do you get your information? Whomever is telling you these lies should be stopped. I was there last two years ago. I wasn't really concerned with the price of apples, so I don't really recall. I DO know that a bag of six oranges was 500 yen at the local grocery store. I'm sorry, I don't really like apples. I hope that answers your question. RIGHT NOW, as of 2005.02.24 21:14:23 GMT. 1.00  United States Dollars \t  \t= \t  \t105.344 JPY So RIGHT NOW - six oranges would cost you $4.75 in USD or 3.6 Euro
    In Paris, 2kg = 2.7 euros
     
  13. Rbaalrajhi

    Rbaalrajhi Well-Known Member

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    Jeddah is not so good to live but the colonies are nice, and plenty of the oil.
     
  14. ernest

    ernest Senior member

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    Quote Ernest, your assertion that ALL products in Japan are imported, thus expensive is not only incorrect, it would be economically unfeasible. Not ALL but 90% of them. Most of fructs, vegetables, weat... HOW MUCH IS AN APPLE?
    First of all, fruits and vegetables are mostly grown locally, apples, pears, cherries, tangerines, and etc. are frequently grown in Japan. Where do you get your information? Whomever is telling you these lies should be stopped. I was there last two years ago. I wasn't really concerned with the price of apples, so I don't really recall. I DO know that a bag of six oranges was 500 yen at the local grocery store. I'm sorry, I don't really like apples. I hope that answers your question. RIGHT NOW, as of 2005.02.24 21:14:23 GMT. 1.00  United States Dollars \t  \t= \t  \t105.344 JPY So RIGHT NOW - six oranges would cost you $4.75 in USD or 3.6 Euro
    In Paris, 2kg = 2.7 euros So you must pay 40% more in Tokyo. If you take account of the strong euros it is more than 70% more. When $1= euros, the orange were at 4.75 euros........ + 67%.
     
  15. drizzt3117

    drizzt3117 Senior member

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    I'm sure in some places in Tokyo oranges would be cheaper and in others they would be more expensive. The best way to compare prices is still PPP (Purchasing Power Parity) and using the big mac method. http://www.economist.com/markets....3503641 It shows, Japanese big mac $2.50, European $3.75, this isn't absolutely accurate as it's not taking into account regional (city) prices, but generally food prices (except for beef) in Tokyo are not completely out of line IMO. Real Estate is going to be far more problematic, but the last time I saw a survey in terms of the real cost of living in different cities, the two most expensive cities to live in were Oslo and Stockholm, closely followed by London, New York, Tokyo, San Francisco, and Paris.
     
  16. ernest

    ernest Senior member

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    Big mac is used only because you find it everywhere...
     
  17. Rbaalrajhi

    Rbaalrajhi Well-Known Member

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    (drizzt3117 @ Feb. 25 2005,01:21) I'm sure in some places in Tokyo oranges would be cheaper and in others they would be more expensive. Â The best way to compare prices is still PPP (Purchasing Power Parity) and using the big mac method. http://www.economist.com/markets....3503641 It shows, Japanese big mac $2.50, European $3.75, this isn't absolutely accurate as it's not taking into account regional (city) prices, but generally food prices (except for beef) in Tokyo are not completely out of line IMO. Â Real Estate is going to be far more problematic, but the last time I saw a survey in terms of the real cost of living in different cities, the two most expensive cities to live in were Oslo and Stockholm, closely followed by London, New York, Tokyo, San Francisco, and Paris.
    Big mac is used only because you find it everywhere...
    Of course you can only compare the poduct that you can find everwher, otherwis what is point mashallah.
     
  18. drizzt3117

    drizzt3117 Senior member

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    true, I think paris and tokyo are pretty close in terms of food costs, Tokyo has more expensive rent though.
     
  19. ernest

    ernest Senior member

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    Tokyo is much more expensive for food.

    how much is

    1 kg of apple?
    1 kg of tomatoes?
    1 yahourt?
    1 gruyere?
    1.5 l of Evian?
    1 kg of bananas?
    1 kg of ham?
     
  20. Rbaalrajhi

    Rbaalrajhi Well-Known Member

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    (drizzt3117 @ Feb. 25 2005,01:52) true, I think paris and tokyo are pretty close in terms of food costs, Tokyo has more expensive rent though.
    Tokyo is much more expensive for food. how much is 1 kg of apple? 1 kg of tomatoes? 1 yahourt? 1 gruyere? 1.5 l of Evian? 1 kg of bananas? 1 kg of ham?
    Japanese do not eat these food for standard, only frencher do. Evian is the french water, why not can buy the japanese water?
     

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