Voxsartoria's Weekly WAYWRN Subjective and Totally Unfair Digest

Discussion in 'Classic Menswear' started by voxsartoria, Feb 13, 2009.

  1. Manton

    Manton RINO Dubiously Honored

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    Oh please. If that is really a reason for any of you to have a problem with me, I can only assume you all have serious reading comprehension deficiencies.

    A distressed plane landed in my foyer today. None of the passengers was hurt.
     
  2. mafoofan

    mafoofan THE FOO Dubiously Honored

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    My problem is with people who pinpoint this point in time and then tell me what came after sucks and is inferior.

    I can't speak for anyone else, but I think you are selling my position short. I don't have a particular time in mind, and I clearly have my own eccentricities that betray past norms. As I'm sure you will agree, postmodernism has changed the reasons why society rejects and adopts new norms. Regardless of whether you think that's good or bad, it is a real phenomenon. I reject changes that are purely postmodernist in nature (I know, I'm being sloppy with the term, but please be charitable). While that appears to make my preferences correlate with a point in time, I wouldn't make too much out of it.
     
  3. Film Noir Buff

    Film Noir Buff Senior member

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    But then you're not rejecting changes that came after as much as choosing a different time to be your guide. If the whole if history is your oyster it could be said you're rejecting the Toga as much as the slim suit and everything else along with those (except point "o"). And that's saying nothing of the irrationality inherent in choosing a dress style that pushes colleagues to refer to your hanky in a category of work where sticking out for your dress is not seen as rational.
    This is a fascinating way to look at it and even suggests ideology over aesthetics, function, purpose etc.. But there are definitely periods of heightened creativity that people draw on more than others like Brummel's England, The sixties. I know that with military uniforms certain periods are considered classic in spite of their antiquity because the length of the conflict led to perfect cross sections of aesthetics and practicality. I think the 1920s are probably more creative than the 1930s but the 1930s was the time that set about codifying and standardizing the innovations of the previous decade's break from rigidity.
     
  4. mafoofan

    mafoofan THE FOO Dubiously Honored

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    A distressed plane landed in my foyer today. None of the passengers was hurt.

    My 'foyer' is about five feet wide. Even I could not lie down in it without bumping my head. And I'd like to note on another matter: you still haven't said sorry for insulting me.
     
  5. mafoofan

    mafoofan THE FOO Dubiously Honored

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    This is a fascinating way to look at it and even suggests ideology over aesthetics, function, purpose etc.

    It is a philosophical controversy at the heart of this: does rationality (or ideology, values, etc.) govern or predict aesthetics, or are they two unrelated matters?
     
  6. Manton

    Manton RINO Dubiously Honored

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    My 'foyer' is about five feet wide. Even I could not lie down in it without bumping my head, and you still didn't say sorry for insulting me.

    I am not sorry. I am sorry if you feel bad, but I believe the word I used was apt. Perhaps I should have qualified it with "dense in this instance," and indeed I will do so now.

    That said, I don't want to fight with you, or join the anti-foo anvil chorus, so we may as well let it drop.
     
  7. Manton

    Manton RINO Dubiously Honored

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    It is a philosophical controversy at the heart of this: does rationality (or ideology, values, etc.) govern or predict aesthetics, or are they two unrelated matters?

    First, rationality and ideology are only dimly related. Second, values is a fraught term in and of itself. Third, to some extent aesthetics are rational, in the sense of understandable because operating on natural principles, but I don't think clothing aesthetics make the cut. There is too much arbitrary variation which cannot be explained by any transcendent standard.

    But I have had my say on this at length in another place.
     
  8. mafoofan

    mafoofan THE FOO Dubiously Honored

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    I am not sorry. I am sorry if you feel bad, but I believe the word I used was apt. Perhaps I should have qualified it with "dense in this instance," and indeed I will do so now.

    I don't feel bad. I just think calling me dense in response to a polite post addressing you was uncalled for, no matter how wrong you thought I was.
     
  9. Fuuma

    Fuuma Franchouillard Modasse

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    I often hear this regarding music, rock & roll died after 1973.

    I think AA and Esquire plates depict the pinnacle of being well dressed. The difference then and now lies in the audience. When first seen in its day people would aspire to dress in that way. Today it is scoffed at and deemed irrelevant.


    I'm pretty sure most didn't give a fuck.

    As for the pinnacle it was togas, made things so much easier when it was time to party like it's 1999.

    Deeming it irrelevant sorta makes it irrelevant and it is to most.
     
  10. RJman

    RJman Posse Member Dubiously Honored

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    Oh please. If that is really a reason for any of you to have a problem with me, I can only assume you all have serious reading comprehension deficiencies.
    I don't let manton put words or anything else in my mouth. You had me at hello.

    My 'foyer' is about five feet wide. Even I could not lie down in it without bumping my head. And I'd like to note on another matter: you still haven't said sorry for insulting me.
    Why does Manton have to apologize to you?

    I am not sorry. I am sorry if you feel bad, but I believe the word I used was apt. Perhaps I should have qualified it with "dense in this instance," and indeed I will do so now.

    That said, I don't want to fight with you, or join the anti-foo anvil chorus, so we may as well let it drop.

    What is an anvil chorus?

    Is it better to be a smart stupid person or a stupid smart person (like me)?
     
  11. mafoofan

    mafoofan THE FOO Dubiously Honored

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    I'm pretty sure most didn't give a fuck.

    You don't think many people divine certain impressions about a guy in a carefully tailored jacket or suit? Even in my own family, the way I dress sometimes becomes a source of argument.
     
  12. Fuuma

    Fuuma Franchouillard Modasse

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    I can't speak for anyone else, but I think you are selling my position short. I don't have a particular time in mind, and I clearly have my own eccentricities that betray past norms. As I'm sure you will agree, postmodernism has changed the reasons why society rejects and adopts new norms. Regardless of whether you think that's good or bad, it is a real phenomenon. I reject changes that are purely postmodernist in nature (I know, I'm being sloppy with the term, but please be charitable). While that appears to make my preferences correlate with a point in time, I wouldn't make too much out of it.
    Are you saying changes before were made for rational reasons and now, due to postmodernism we became irrational (so now that we live in postmodernity we have "irrational" fashions). I posit we were never rational and never will be.
     
  13. RJman

    RJman Posse Member Dubiously Honored

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    You don't think many people divine certain impressions about a guy in a carefully tailored jacket or suit? Even in my own family, the way I dress sometimes becomes a source of argument.

    What do they argue about? I think I read a Gore Vidal short story like this.
     
  14. mafoofan

    mafoofan THE FOO Dubiously Honored

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    I don't let manton put words or anything else in my mouth. You had me at hello.

    Are you saying I let Manton put words in my mouth, or that I let you put words in my mouth? Clarity, RJ, clarity.

    Why does Manton have to apologize to you?

    He doesn't have to. But I would apologize for calling someone 'dense' because I didn't like or agree with his politely conveyed opinion.
     
  15. Fuuma

    Fuuma Franchouillard Modasse

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    You don't think many people divine certain impressions about a guy in a carefully tailored jacket or suit? Even in my own family, the way I dress sometimes becomes a source of argument.

    In the sense that they didn't study AA or aspire to dress that way, aside from vague yearnings for the lifestyle that could have included seeing them in a fancy suit (the way would have been cut=irrelevant, the status it denotes=important).
     

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