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Vogel and other shoes

Discussion in 'Classic Menswear' started by TimelessRider, Jun 20, 2004.

  1. TimelessRider

    TimelessRider Senior member

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    Finally received my Vogel custom shoes and as promised here are some pics and opinions, for whatever they're worth. [​IMG] Fit/Comfort: It is by far the best fitting shoe I have - on both feet. My right foot is half a size shorter, a full width wider, and flatter than my left foot. This leads to all sorts of fitting issues when buying RTW leather shoes unless I special order different sizes. Both my feet feel comfortable all the way from the heel to the toe. Neither foot slips at the heel, and both sets of toes have wiggle room. My one negative point about the fit, is when I flex the shoe, there seems to be excessive material bunching up above the toes. Not sure how or if they could fix this without destroying the overall fit, so I'll use the shoe a few weeks before deciding whether to do anything about this. The good fit alone enhances comfort, but there is nothing special about the insole that makes this an ultra comfortable shoe. Also I don't think anything special was done to account for one foot being flatter than the other. I wore the shoe yesterday while tromping around the city for a whole day checking out father's day sales and it still felt good at the end of the day. I think because of the fit, this shoe will figure frequently in my rotation. Looks: Hardly the nicest looking shoe, but it was never intended to be. Its primary purpose is to be worn with jeans or textured casual slacks. For what it is, I think it's quite handsome, but was never intended to draw much attention. It was quite surprising when some people complimented me on this shoe - these same people have never said a word about my Edward Green or Vass shoes. Go figure. The design is not a stock Vogel shoe. I gave them a printout of this picture of the Edward Green Dover from dressy.net to use as a sample. I indicated that the picture doesn't show the split-toe, and also told them to make no attempt at duplicating the handwork on the uppers, and to simply attach the apron as they would on any other shoe. I am quite satisfied that they followed my instructions and the end result looks like the sample, in profile at least. Construction and overall quality: Despite many hours spent on these forums, my knowledge of shoe construction still leaves much to be desired. The shoe is entirely machine made, though possibly hand-cut. All the stitching is very even and neat. The edges of the leather are neatly cut and in perfect alignment. The shoe is welted; whether it's Goodyear welted or not, I can't say. Bear in mind that if you do not specifically request a welted shoe, Vogel will provide a bonded shoe. There is no extra charge for standard welting, though a reverse welt may incur an additional fee. The leather seems to be of fair quality though nothing special. It's English calf from a company called Pebody (maybe spelled Peabody). They have much nicer looking leathers in their swatch book, but those would not have been appropriate for this shoe. The sole seems soft, which I'm led to believe is an indication of poor quality though it certainly enhances immediate comfort. I was expecting the stitching on the sole to be completely exposed as it is on some of their sample shoes, but it seems like they've made some attempt at channeling, though the end-result is not very attractive. See pics for more detail. Service: I'm going to rate the service as very good so far. They suffered through 3 visits from me, and answered all my questions before I placed an order. However there was a delay in delivering the shoes: it took 16 weeks instead of the promised 12 weeks. The ultimate test will be how they handle things when or if I request any alterations. Aesthetics: Laces are too short Gap between laces is somewhat wide, though I didn't specify any requirements for this. Shoe trees are excellent but are an additional $55. As RIDER has mentioned previously they are from Dunkelman/Dasco - specifically the model 640. No shoe bags or branded box. They came in a shipping box wrapped with lots of paper. My name and order date is printed on the inside of the tongue More pics to follow.
     
  2. TimelessRider

    TimelessRider Senior member

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    More closeups of the Vogels. In reality the shoes are not as shiny as they seem in the pics. It's just a weird interaction between the pebble-grain and the camera flash. Click on the pics for higher resolution. [​IMG][​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG] [​IMG]
     
  3. TimelessRider

    TimelessRider Senior member

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    Some pics of my RTW shoes. Click for higher resolution. The comfy chocolate brown suede Vass Budapest Goyser: [​IMG] The amazingly beautiful (my humble opinion) oxblood calf Vass Alt Wien: [​IMG] The elegant black calf RLPL Court Monkstrap (Edward Green Troon) - Thank you, Phil, for pointing out the sale at Ralph Lauren: [​IMG] The summery light brown suede Weston 556: [​IMG] The unusually styled burnished cognac calf Grenson Masterpiece Wellington: [​IMG]
     
  4. Lomezz

    Lomezz Senior member

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    TR - very nice shoes - wear them in good health.

    I remember checking the Vogel website and being surprised at the affordability of custom shoes. They do have - at least to my untrained eye - that elusive 'bespoke' silhouette in the profile.

    Is the sole oak-bark leather? can you specify that? Also, is the heel combination or full leather?
     
  5. TimelessRider

    TimelessRider Senior member

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    Lomezz - not sure about the oak bark. I will find out at my next visit. The heel on my shoes has a quarter-inch thick piece of rubber covering the entire heel. They offer many varieties of heels including completely rubber ones and combination styles such as the ones from Alden.
     
  6. STYLESTUDENT

    STYLESTUDENT Senior member

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    TR-

    Very impressive collection.

    With reference to the Vass Alt Wien medallion captoe shoes, Roetzel's book suggests that this type of shoe is a good match for softer or patterned suitings such as flannel or plaid. What's your opinion of Roetzel's suggestions, which amount to a limitation on use. Do you wear your Alt Wien shoes with, say, smooth solid 150's suits? Thanks.
     
  7. Steve B.

    Steve B. Senior member

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    I have the same Vass Alt Wiens, and think they're incredible. I follow Roetzel's advice, but have also been known to wear then with reds, pinks, purples and jeans.
     
  8. TimelessRider

    TimelessRider Senior member

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    StyleStudent - The simple answer to your question is "no, I would not wear this shoe with a 150s suit". For the simple reason that I don't own any 150s suits. [​IMG] But seriously though, the Alt Wien in the picture is made on the Budapest last and has a heavy double sole. If you've ever seen the Budapest last - my favorite of the Vass lasts, and very distinctive in appearance - you'll realize the full and high toe-box gives it a casual and almost rugged look. I wear those shoes with jeans primarily. Roetzel's statement regarding flannel or POW check was made in reference to the closed lace version of this shoe (pg 159 of Gentleman). With regard to the open laced version, he suggests on pg 161, "a check sports jacket and cavalry twill pants." I'm guessing Roetzel's statement has something to do with texture matching and the inherent casualness of open lacing. The real sartorial experts on the forum can chime in here and correct me if I'm wrong. Brogueing as well as the open lacing create that illusion of weight/bulk on the shoe, and this works better with heavier materials and patterns like flannel, plaid, and twill. I see his point but a similar style on a different last, say Vass's P2 last with single sole, and more subtle brogueing may work well with lighter fabrics. Or take the Edward Green Cardiff, which doesn't have perforations on the heel cap and would look fantastic with a lighterweight suit.
     
  9. jcusey

    jcusey Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    Hey. I have those Grenson boots. Good-looking, but they don't fit that well, at least for me.

    Anyway, thanks for your Vogel report. The $64,000 question is whether you think that the price ($850, right?) was reasonable given the shoes you received and whether you'll consider ordering more pairs.

    It looks like the shoes are stitched aloft and that they have a rubber toplift. Do you happen to know whether they can do a combination heel and channelled soles?
     
  10. TimelessRider

    TimelessRider Senior member

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    Yeah, those Grensons are cut bigger than the equivalent Edward Green size. I need to find some kind of insole for them. That's the price I pay for buying blind, but it's better than them being too tight.

    Vogel offers combination heels but not channelled soles.

    Even if I wear these shoes a lot, I don't think this particular shoe was worth $850. But I would pay $650 for subsequent shoes (which is what they would cost), if they successfully manage to get rid of the excessive creasing on the top without destroying the fit on my current pair. I would also like to see if they can offer different toe-shapes for different shoes.
     
  11. TimelessRider

    TimelessRider Senior member

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    Steve B. - I just noticed: Congratulations on your 1000 posts.
     
  12. Looking to improve

    Looking to improve Senior member

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    When will it be possible to post a 'drooling smilie'? I think these are simply beautiful. [​IMG] MtB
     
  13. T4phage

    T4phage Senior member

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    Originally Posted by TimelessRider,20 June 2004, 07:32
    Some pics of my RTW shoes. Â Click for higher resolution. [...] The summery light brown suede Weston 556: [​IMG]
    When will it be possible to post a 'drooling smilie'? I think these are simply beautiful. [​IMG] MtB
    You should go to Antwerp or Brussels and visit the Weston store there  [​IMG] .  Nice shoes there and the Perry designed Westons are a breath of fresh air compared to Greens  [​IMG] .
     
  14. jcusey

    jcusey Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    Always with the Perry Westons, aren't you? [​IMG] I ordered the Perry Chelsea boot in that color suede two or three weeks ago. They apparently didn't have it in stock, so I'll have to wait a while. I'll probably have something to wear until then, though.
     
  15. T4phage

    T4phage Senior member

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    (T4phage @ 22 June 2004, 04:19) You should go to Antwerp or Brussels and visit the Weston store then  [​IMG] .  Nice shoes there and the Perry designed Westons are a breath of fresh air compared to Greens  [​IMG] .
    Always with the Perry Westons, aren't you? Â [​IMG] I ordered the Perry Chelsea boot in that color suede two or three weeks ago. They apparently didn't have it in stock, so I'll have to wait a while. I'll probably have something to wear until then, though.
    [​IMG] Yup.. Such a different asthetic from my other shoes. I did end up purchasing your Perry split toes. What happened to the monkstrap? I thought you were going to get them?
     
  16. Looking to improve

    Looking to improve Senior member

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    Well, I might go there, but I'm also trying to think of which suede colour Edward Green offers that resembles the posted colour so I can then maybe order the 'Windermere'. But there are many more Greens on my wish list, which I don't really need. So all long term 'projects'... Actually, how do the Westons in question compare to Green's 'Windermere'? MtB
     
  17. T4phage

    T4phage Senior member

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    (T4phage @ 22 June 2004, 02:19) You should go to Antwerp or Brussels and visit the Weston store there  [​IMG] .  Nice shoes there and the Perry designed Westons are a breath of fresh air compared to Greens  [​IMG] .
    Well, I might go there, but I'm also trying to think of which suede colour Edward Green offers that resembles the posted colour so I can then maybe order the 'Windermere'. But there are many more Greens on my wish list, which I don't really need. So all long term 'projects'... Actually, how do the Westons in question compare to Green's 'Windermere'? MtB
    Sorry, no experience with the E.G Windmere. Maybe Jcusey (who owns Westons and Greens) may have the models and be able to help.
     
  18. Looking to improve

    Looking to improve Senior member

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    Well, I have a pair of Windermere myself (black calf), and am wondering more about which colour of suede to choose. But any comparisons on the fit are more than welcome.

    MtB

    *Edited for a typing error
     
  19. T4phage

    T4phage Senior member

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    (T4phage @ 28 June 2004, 02:22) Sorry, no experience with the E.G Windmere. Â Maybe Jcusey (who owns Westons and Greens) may have the models and be able to help.
    Well, I have a pair of Windermere myself (black calf), and am wondering more about which colour of suede to coose. But any comparisons on the fit are more than welcome. MtB
    It is a pity that the last Weston dealer in Nederlands dropped them (on P.C ). From the picture, my demi chasse is the same colour suede, but I don't remember the name. Next time I'm at a E.G retailer, I'll look at the swatch book to see what comes closest.
     
  20. Looking to improve

    Looking to improve Senior member

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    If you would, thanks. [​IMG] . Not to influence you, but my guess would probably be the clove suede. MtB
     

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