Vitale Barberis Cahttp://www.vitalebarberiscnonico

Discussion in 'Classic Menswear' started by Millerp, Mar 18, 2005.

  1. Millerp

    Millerp Senior member

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    My local tailor has swatch books of Super 120s wool and cashmere from an Italian woolen mill called Vitale Barberis Canonico. The material has a fine hand and seems to be of good quality. I looked the mill up on Google. http://www.vitalebarberiscanonico.it/ The brand seems legitimate, but I've never heard of it. My tailor said their products are equal to Scabal or Zegna. Just wondering if any forum members know of this mill or have had any items of clothing made from this company's cloth. I'm considering getting some trousers made from this cloth. Thanks
     
  2. lisapop

    lisapop Senior member

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    Actually, not to break your heart, but it's an inferior cloth, as is much of the over-hyped cloth from Italy (e.g. Loro Piana), and elsewhere.  Reason being that the cloth is not 4 ply, which is the benchmark for quality.  It is 3 ply.  4 ply cloth is comprised of 2 fibers in length and 2 fibers in width.  3 ply cloth is comprised of 2 fibers in length and just 1 fiber in width, resulting in cloth that tends to wrinkle and crumple.  It's a way of cutting corners and charging a lot of money. I believe that's called progess.

    This brand is not to be confused with Carlo Barbera, which is among the finest cloth, distributed by Lesser in the UK.  I proudly own several garments made from the superb Barbera range.  
    Grayson
     
  3. MilanoStyle

    MilanoStyle Senior member

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    This is interesting, how can I tell if a fabric is x Ply, where x is integer?
     
  4. lisapop

    lisapop Senior member

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    When you examine a sample of cloth, you can try to untwist the fibers. If there are 2 fibers twisted together, they'll untwist, but if there is just 1 fiber, it, of course, will not untwist.
    Grayson
     
  5. Carlo

    Carlo Senior member

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    FWIW - Barbera and Barberis are priced differently as well. Of the BIG valley mills in Biella I think VB makes some of the nicer fabrics but they are a totally different critter than what Carlo Barbera makes.


    Pricewise a 120's from Carlo Barbera is 2.5 times what it would be from VB or the other mills that due large scale production. Carlo Barbera only produces about 10-15% of what the others do each year and the Who's Who list in Italy buys up their best stuff. SHould you decide to set reason aside and make a suit or trousers from pure cashmere, Barbera's worsted cashmere is very, very good stuff and doesn't abrade like cheaper ones.

    Note - when I say that CB is far more expensive I am not suggesting that they are overpriced in the slightest. They are worth every penny.

    Don't confuse Viale Barberis or Carlo Barbera with Joseph Barbera. Joseph Barbera was the bespoke tailor who dressed such luminaries as Scooby Doo, Yogi Bear, George Jetson, Magilla Gorilla and Fred Flintstone along with his alterations guy, William Hanna.
     
  6. Stu

    Stu Senior member

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    Actually I was thinking about having Chan make me a summer beige suit of VB 130s. Are you telling me not to bother?
     
  7. lisapop

    lisapop Senior member

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    Actually, the Carlo Barbera range of cloth for Lesser I've used is lambswool, which has advantages over cashmere: It has a softness that closely approximates that of cashmere (due to the lanolin content), yet given it's not cashmere, it will not stretch over time as cashmere tends to do. Several people have felt my Barbera lambswool jackets and have purred, "Oooh, cashmere".
    Grayson
     
  8. dah328

    dah328 Senior member

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    My experience is considerably less broad and more pedestrian than Grayson's, and I'm sure his evaluation of Vitale Barberis relative to Carlo Barbera is accurate.  That said, I have several items of clothing made from Vitale Barberis 130's that I'm quite happy with relative to my other clothes (Loro Piana, mid-range RTW, etc).  At its price point, I don't think Vitale Barberis is a bad choice.

    Not to hijack the thread or anything (well, maybe a little), but it would be interesting to see an assessment of cloths at different price points.  The same has been done for RTW suits, shirts, and shoes, but seldom is cloth discussed in the same way.

    dan
     
  9. Millerp

    Millerp Senior member

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    Thank you all. I knew forum members
    would likely have an answer to my question.

    Mr Grayson - My tailor also compared the cloth
    to that of Loro Piana. He said he could make me a pair
    of trousers of VB Super 120's for $275. Am I being
    taken?

    Always appreciate your knowledge.
     
  10. lisapop

    lisapop Senior member

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    With the wide array of cloth available to you, you can do better. Check out the better English cloth.
    Grayson
     
  11. lisapop

    lisapop Senior member

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    $275 is a very reasonable price for custom trousers, at a time when some high-end brands get that price and more for ready-made trousers, so I don't think you're being taken advantage of. I just happen to have a preference for English cloth, which, dollar for dollar, I feel represents a better long-term value and offers a higher degree of comfort and durability. There's an abundance of quality cloth out there and so you needn't get locked into one kind. Just my $.02
    Grayson
     
  12. lisapop

    lisapop Senior member

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  13. Millerp

    Millerp Senior member

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    Mr. Grayson - thanks.

    I too like English cloths. I have two sport coats
    made with H&S cloth and they wear beautifully.

    I too would like to see a discussion of cloths.
     
  14. BlvdDandy

    BlvdDandy Senior member

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    I started a thread on a similar topic a little while back. I collected the names of all the fabric manufacturers (and sellers) I could find on the forum, and then asked for input. What follows is the graded list. It should be noted that Teir 3 doesn't mean bad, just not as good as Teirs 1 and 2. The cloth within each teir is listed randomly, although Teir 3 is roughly ordered by quality. Again, all of this is based on feedback I got from other threads, so please feel free to move stuff around and add prices.

    Teir 1:
    Moxon Huddersfield
    Dormuiel
    Scabal
    H. Lessor
    Holland & Sherry

    Teir 2:
    Carlo Barbera
    Guabello
    JJ Minnis
    Fox Brothers
    Harrisons
    Charles Clayton
    Bower Roebuck

    Teir 3:
    Vitale Barberis Canonico
    Reda
    Piacenza
    Policarpo
    Zegna
    Cerruti
    Wain Shiell
    Reid & Taylor
    Smiths
    Loro Piana
    Taylor & Lodge
    William Halstead
     
  15. lisapop

    lisapop Senior member

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