Vintage Dress shoe appreciation, tips, maintenance and advice

[wasmisterfu]

When the listing says AE and the code says Alden. Developing...

 

[wasmisterfu]

Vintage violation.

Here are those black shell AE Leeds I purchased recently. I never did get the insoles to soften up, even after trying Bedo's salt-removing technique. Oh well.

View attachment 1400978

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Black laces looked pretty dull, so I tried gold. I think it works, plus those were the colors of my high school, so win-win.

Listed as an 8.5, they are actually a 9 D, so they're a little loose. Oh well. They have a ****** half-sole replacement, so I don't see me investing much more time or money in them.

Spoiler: Before

As purchased. These guys were rode hard and put up wet.

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Well they look great. One thing you might want to do is, when ready, send them for AE recraft. That’ll get you a new cork-bed, midsoles and soles (plus welts). It may substantially improve the feel of the shoe.

 

[wasmisterfu]

My 93602 also used to be green with envy. Now they are just green.

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Dude, those are freakin cool... laces are a really nice touch.

 

[friendlygoz]

AE St George monk strap chukkas today. These are from 1970 or 1971. Steve from Bedo’s remade the straps.

 

[Nealjpage]

Well they look great. One thing you might want to do is, when ready, send them for AE recraft. That’ll get you a new cork-bed, midsoles and soles (plus welts). It may substantially improve the feel of the shoe.

Thanks. I thought about the AE recraft, but since the heel linings are shot, and since they don't fit too great, I'll probably just wear them until something better comes along. Also, I don't understand why AE doesn't replace the insoles when they recraft. It's not like those are structural. Or are they?

 

[Nealjpage]

12D guys. Cool, vintage, SHARK Allen Edmonds:

Men's Sz 12 Allen Edmonds Designer Black Shoes | ShopGoodwill.com

www.shopgoodwill.com

 

[wasmisterfu]

Thanks. I thought about the AE recraft, but since the heel linings are shot, and since they don't fit too great, I'll probably just wear them until something better comes along. Also, I don't understand why AE doesn't replace the insoles when they recraft. It's not like those are structural. Or are they?

They are 100% structural. In a Goodyear Welt shoe, the insole anchors both the upper and the welt, via the rib. In nailless 360 welt construction, as implemented by AE, that rib runs all the way around the perimeter of the insole, formed from stitching the upper leather to the gemming, which is cemented to the bottom of insole. The upper, once stitched to the gemming and having formed up the rib, is essentially now unitized with the insole, and then has the welt Goodyear Stitched all the way around to said rib. Subsequently, the sole (and if double soled, the midsole also) are outsole stitched to the welt. The heel-stack is then cemented and nailed only to the outsole.

The unitized nature of the upper and insole, is what allows AE to rapidly and cost effectively perform a recraft: they insert the last to preserve shape, they then remove the heel-stack, soles and welts. However, the unitized insole and upper remain intact and in one piece. Removing the insole would make relasting in this fashion, pretty much impossible.

So, in general, the insole in a Goodyear welt shoe is the core structural anchoring component, to which everything else is directly or indirectly attached. It is possible, though very time consuming and very expensive, to replace the insoles. This requires taking precise measurements of the old insole, applying gemming in almost exactly the position on the new insole, and then re-tacking the upper to an accurate last, stitching/forming the rib with the upper in nearly exactly the same positions and dimensions. Get any of this wrong and the shoe shape and size could be very negatively altered, or things may simply not come together.

There are videos of Steve from Bedo’s doing this kind of work, and it costs a lot of money. Unless it’s a super-rare or important pair (like Shell Yuma’s), it’s not worth doing. Put simply, on a GYW shoe (or pretty much on any welted shoe), once the insole is shot, the shoe is shot. That’s why you want to occasionally condition your insoles, if your shoe has leather insoles. When buying pairs, you always want to check the insole condition, to make sure they aren’t cracking, dried out, or outright failing.

 

[CWOyaji]

Size 13 C bros, I think these are model 684. Trees and bags included.

 

[wasmisterfu]

Size 13 C bros, I think these are model 684. Trees and bags included.
View attachment 1401176

Oh no... I’ve already spent too much money on shoes this last month. Must... resist..

 

[CWOyaji]

Oh no... I’ve already spent too much money on shoes this last month. Must... resist..

The 684 is on the Aberdeen last, which runs narrow, in case you need another reason to say no.

Spoiler: Alden lasts

 

[wasmisterfu]

The 684 is on the Aberdeen last, which runs narrow, in case you need another reason to say no.

Spoiler: Alden lasts

View attachment 1401185

So, by narrow, is it narrow through the whole, like the AE 108 last, or is it specific to forefoot, toe, etc.?

 

[madhat]

So, by narrow, is it narrow through the whole, like the AE 108 last, or is it specific to forefoot, toe, etc.?

More like the toe area.

 

[CWOyaji]

So, by narrow, is it narrow through the whole, like the AE 108 last, or is it specific to forefoot, toe, etc.?

I wear Aberdeen in 13 D just fine. Check the chart I put in the spoiler though. A lot of the Alden obsessives on the web have opinions about lasts, so I recommend reading some of those too.

 

[nikolau]

They are 100% structural. In a Goodyear Welt shoe, the insole anchors both the upper and the welt, via the rib. In nailless 360 welt construction, as implemented by AE, that rib runs all the way around the perimeter of the insole, formed from stitching the upper leather to the gemming, which is cemented to the bottom of insole. The upper, once stitched to the gemming and having formed up the rib, is essentially now unitized with the insole, and then has the welt Goodyear Stitched all the way around to said rib. Subsequently, the sole (and if double soled, the midsole also) are outsole stitched to the welt. The heel-stack is then cemented and nailed only to the outsole.

The unitized nature of the upper and insole, is what allows AE to rapidly and cost effectively perform a recraft: they insert the last to preserve shape, they then remove the heel-stack, soles and welts. However, the unitized insole and upper remain intact and in one piece. Removing the insole would make relasting in this fashion, pretty much impossible.

So, in general, the insole in a Goodyear welt shoe is the core structural anchoring component, to which everything else is directly or indirectly attached. It is possible, though very time consuming and very expensive, to replace the insoles. This requires taking precise measurements of the old insole, applying gemming in almost exactly the position on the new insole, and then re-tacking the upper to an accurate last, stitching/forming the rib with the upper in nearly exactly the same positions and dimensions. Get any of this wrong and the shoe shape and size could be very negatively altered, or things may simply not come together.

There are videos of Steve from Bedo’s doing this kind of work, and it costs a lot of money. Unless it’s a super-rare or important pair (like Shell Yuma’s), it’s not worth doing. Put simply, on a GYW shoe (or pretty much on any welted shoe), once the insole is shot, the shoe is shot. That’s why you want to occasionally condition your insoles, if your shoe has leather insoles. When buying pairs, you always want to check the insole condition, to make sure they aren’t cracking, dried out, or outright failing.

I’ve been quoted no more than $100 to replace a welt- I didn’t realize it was so involved.

Edit: I’ve never inquired about replacing the insole, I thought that came together with re-welting. How much does such work tend to run?

 

[wasmisterfu]

I’ve been quoted no more than $100 to replace a welt- I didn’t realize it was so involved.

Welt’s are not too hard, the only requirement is either the original last, or something that closely approximates it. That’s because you want the rib positioning and shape to match original state very closely, or the welt might not correctly follow that line (think of it like trying to zip the zipper on a duffle bag that’s too misshapen).

Replacing insoles is definitely much, much harder (it’s not considered serviceable, like welts, soles, heals, etc.).