Unfunded Liabilities: a/k/a The Cloth Thread

[dukeaw]

Some worsted some woolen

can you give an example by fabric # of a woolen? I see the twill weave in almost all of them which make me think they're all worsted.

Would a 315g woolen hold its shape vs a 380-400g woolen flannel?

 

[Guizp]

Hey!

@Guizp
Funny, I just stumbled across this yesterday.

It‘s the collection in this video I think.



maybe check with customer service at The Merchant Fox. They should be able to help you out.

Yes, this is the one ive seen. Looks nice the color is strong enough.

I know scabal has in the their flannel collection. Bateman ogden may have one too

Thanks will check it.

I like this one also, worn by Musella Dembech

 

[jonathanS]

Is the bateman ogden flannel a worsted or woolen flannel? I'm looking at their bespoke flannel book and I cannot tell. Its weight makes me think its its worsted?

weight has nothing to do with worsted / woolen. Its how the flannel is finished / texture

 

[dieworkwear]

weight has nothing to do with worsted / woolen. Its how the flannel is finished / texture

Worsted/ woolen has to do with how the hairs are treated before they're spun into yarn. Not how the fabric is finished.

I believe lightweight flannels can only be made with worsted yarn, but I may be wrong.

 

[dukeaw]

Worsted/ woolen has to do with how the hairs are treated before they're spun into yarn. Not how the fabric is finished.

I believe lightweight flannels can only be made with worsted yarn, but I may be wrong.

My understanding is that worsted can be a lighter fabric because of the denser yarn structure. Woolen is typically heavier because the yarn is a looser weave and needs more material to hold its integrity. That is why woolen flannel can bag and often doesnt hold the crease. That is why lighter flannels are typically worsted and heavier flannels can be worsted or woolen, but if they show the weave they are worsted. Woolen flannel has a mottled effect and less apparent weave pattern. Or I could be totally wrong since I've only learned this stuff from reading random sources like styleforum and blogs like putthison, permanent style, and dieworkwear...

That is why I think bateman ogden is all worsted flannel. I also believe most italian flannel is worsted because it tends to be a lighter flannel cloth than english flannel.

Dugdale flannel I believe is woolen. So is Minnis. both are around 400+g You can see the mottled color effect on those cloths.

 

[jonathanS]

Worsted/ woolen has to do with how the hairs are treated before they're spun into yarn. Not how the fabric is finished.

I believe lightweight flannels can only be made with worsted yarn, but I may be wrong.

Which is how it’s finished vs the actual yarn. My point is you’ll know the difference by the texture. Woolen had a fuzzier feel to it

 

[dieworkwear]

Which is how it’s finished vs the actual yarn.

Worsted vs woolen refers to the yarn

Woolen vs Worsted

Classically speaking there are 2 types of yarn. Woolen spun, and Worsted Spun. Back in "Ye Goode Old Dayes" all spinners would process their own fleece (or have a small child, or hefty man do it...

www.hilltopcloud.co.uk

 

[jonathanS]

My understanding is that worsted can be a lighter fabric because of the denser yarn structure. Woolen is typically heavier because the yarn is a looser weave and needs more material to hold its integrity. That is why woolen flannel can bag and often doesnt hold the crease. That is why lighter flannels are typically worsted and heavier flannels can be worsted or woolen, but if they show the weave they are worsted. Woolen flannel has a mottled effect and less apparent weave pattern. Or I could be totally wrong since I've only learned this stuff from reading random sources like styleforum and blogs like putthison, permanent style, and dieworkwear...

That is why I think bateman ogden is all worsted flannel. I also believe most italian flannel is worsted because it tends to be a lighter flannel cloth than english flannel.

Dugdale flannel I believe is woolen. So is Minnis. both are around 400+g You can see the mottled color effect on those cloths.

I’m not sure if most Italian flannel is woolen or worsted. I remember seeing some woolen flannel by drapers, cacciapoli, vbc, etc. So I’m not sure.
Also, Dugdale has a worsted flannel book (if I recall correctly). My understanding is most makers make both woolen and worsted. Most people prefer woolen though.
One issue with lightweight worsted flannels is that flannel isn’t as durable generally- this holds even more so.

I really like the Minnis woolen 480 grams (I believe it was 480) flannel for what it’s worth.

 

[jonathanS]

Worsted vs woolen refers to the yarn

Woolen vs Worsted

Classically speaking there are 2 types of yarn. Woolen spun, and Worsted Spun. Back in "Ye Goode Old Dayes" all spinners would process their own fleece (or have a small child, or hefty man do it...

www.hilltopcloud.co.uk

What’s your point. She still won’t sleep with you.

 

[dieworkwear]

What’s your point. She still won’t sleep with you.

? Are you 12?

This is a really weird comment. But you said that worsted vs woolen is about the fabric finishing. I was only correcting you to say that it is not. It's about how the fibers are treated before they're spun into yarn. You can't weave fabric out of woolen yarn and turn it into worsted through the finishing process.

 

[jonathanS]

? Are you 12?

This is a really weird comment. But you said that worsted vs woolen is about the fabric finishing. I was only correcting you to say that it is not. It's about how the fibers are treated before they're spun into yarn. You can't weave fabric out of woolen yarn and turn it into worsted through the finishing process.

If you weren’t trying to be a jackass, then I apologize.
I was making a broader point about the texture and recognizing the difference between worsted / woolen flannel. You were going out of your way to correct a minor point, which I was technically not correct about, but did not detract from the broader and more important point relative to the original question.

when I was thinking of finishing I was thinking about the weaving process. Maybe I didn’t use the “correct” terminology to describe this process. Just felt like you were trying to be a jerk about it. If that wasn’t your intention, then I apologize.

 

[artyom.le.gall]

Hello everyone,
I need some recommendations
I am currently preparing my winter orders and looking for a light brown/ chestnut striped flannel suiting . Preferably without cashmere but I am opened to it.

I ve seen a fox one but can't find it again, don't know if they produce it anymore.
There is one from piacenza noble flannel which is good but would like it a little bit lighter in color.
Do you have something in mind ?

Thank you !

I believe you are referring to the cloth here. I was looking for it myself few months back on the Fox website. Could find only a pillow ..?

 

[breakaway01]

Dugdale flannel I believe is woolen. So is Minnis. both are around 400+g You can see the mottled color effect on those cloths.

Dugdale definitely offers a worsted flannel. It’s quite nice actually. I think it’s around 13 oz and doesn’t bag/stretch to any appreciable extent.

 

[sensuki]

That is why I think bateman ogden is all worsted flannel. I also believe most italian flannel is worsted because it tends to be a lighter flannel cloth than english flannel.

can you give an example by fabric # of a woolen? I see the twill weave in almost all of them which make me think they're all worsted.

Would a 315g woolen hold its shape vs a 380-400g woolen flannel?

Can't speak to 315g, but I've got a pair of trousers in ~340g italian woollen flannel from HFW (which I think is made by VBC) it's a prunelle (twill) weave. I like them and I only get them pressed 1-2 times a year, however I would only get a heavier woollen flannel in future.

 

[Concordia]

Thought I'd try here rather than starting a new thread-- I'm moving a (very nice) HK suit over from their own horn buttons, which I do not care for, to the standard SR London product. I have found suppliers in the past, but have completely forgotten who they might be.

Does anyone know of a shop in Soho that carries these? The normal 2-hole, very dark grey matte horn buttons for sleeves.