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Tony Dungy: Overrated?

Douglas

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There's a general round of ass-licking going around now that Tony Dungy has formally retired from his head coaching job at the helm of the Colts. There's talk of the Hall of Fame and he's being lauded in exalting words by the media. Mike and Mike this morning had a huge love-in with Bill Polian re: Dungy. So I submit for general debate and discussion: Is Tony Dungy overrated and overloved for his accomplishments?

I'll start - I say yes, overrated. He was a fine coach in Tampa Bay, and also a fine coach in Indianapolis, but to say he is some kind of Hall-of-Fame supercoach is taking things a bit too far. He's won a single Super Bowl, his offensive coordinator is essentially the quarterback, and though he's had success his teams have probably underperformed more than anything. Think about it - if Brian Billick is hired in the next couple of years by a Cincinnati, Seattle, or something and takes them to a few playoffs, his resume will essentially be identical to Dungy's. And I don't think anyone will be falling over themselves to give Billick the edmorel treatment.

I will say that Dungy seems like a nice, upstanding, classy fellow - but if those were the criteria I'd be in the NFL Hall of Fame.
 

thekunk07

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nice man-solid but not-spectacular coach. lost too many playoff games, some inexplicably.
 

Ambulance Chaser

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Not overrated. He is the second best NFL coach of his era, behind Bill Belichick. (You can make an argument for Mike Shanahan for the second slot because of his two Super Bowl wins, but Shanahan's record without John Elway is very average.) Even more significant than Dungy's statistics (six consecutive 12-win seasons, NFL record ten straight playoff appearances) is what he did to turn around the culture of losing in Tampa Bay and Indianapolis. People don't remember because those teams are good now, but they used to be where Detroit is now. And Dungy won with class and integrity, which still means a lot.
 

kwilkinson

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I guess I'd say overrated because people make him out to be the best coach in history.
He does, however, deserve to be in the HoF. He's been to the playoffs for 10 straight seasons. Sure, they've routinely underperformed in the playoffs, but it's no small task doing it for 10 straight seasons. There have only been two seasons in his coaching career that he didn't lead his team to the playoffs. He's got a superbowl ring. He coached through the suicide of his son (I'm sorry, but that's impressive). He has been incredibly involved in community outreach and volunteering.
So, overrated, yes. HoF-worthy, yes.
 

montecristo#4

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Originally Posted by Douglas
Is Tony Dungy overrated and overloved for his accomplishments?

Of course he is overrated. He has the benefit of one of the best QBs of all time, yet his teams still have a losing record in the playoffs. That's really all you need to know. NOT Hall of Fame material, unless you think that being the first black coach to win a Super Bowl is an automatic qualifier. Personally, I think the sam e standards ought to govern.

Dungy also annoys me because of his holier-than-thou attitude, which I think is complete nonsense and not backed up at all by the reality of Dungy's life.

"One and Dungy." If he were a great coach, then Colts homers wouldn't have given him this nickname.
 

zalb916

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Dungy is 139-69 (.668). Billick is 85-67 (.559). Dungy has two more career losses than Billick, but he's coached 56 more games. His winning percentage puts him just after these guys on the all-time list:

John Madden (1969-78) 103-32-7 .750
Vince Lombardi (1959-69) 96-34-6 .728
George Allen (1966-77) 116-47-5 .705
Blanton Collier (1963-70) 76-34-2 .688
Don Shula (1963-95) 328-156-6 .676
George Halas (1922-29; 33-42; 46-55; 58-67) 318-148-31 .671

He's in some pretty good company. Plus, note all the great coaches not listed: Gibbs, Parcells, etc.

I agree that Dungy has a huge flaw that nobody discusses. He can't win in the playoffs. Yes, the Colts won the Super Bowl once, but they have also been one and done so many times in the past five or so years when they have been the No. 1 or No. 2 seed. That ain't good. Judging him by his playoff success relative to his regular season success, then he may be overrated. But he's had an amazing coaching career.
 

thekunk07

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yes, but you also think the redskins are a solid team.


shanahan is better.
you could argue gruden is better.
there are others.

Originally Posted by Ambulance Chaser
Not overrated. He is the second best NFL coach of his era, behind Bill Belichick. (You can make an argument for Mike Shanahan for the second slot because of his two Super Bowl wins, but Shanahan's record without John Elway is very average.) Even more significant than Dungy's statistics (six consecutive 12-win seasons, NFL record ten straight playoff appearances) is what he did to turn around the culture of losing in Tampa Bay and Indianapolis. People don't remember because those teams are good now, but they used to be where Detroit is now. And Dungy won with class and integrity, which still means a lot.
 

zalb916

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Originally Posted by thekunk07
yes, but you also think the redskins are a solid team.


shanahan is better.
you could argue gruden is better.
there are others.


Shanahan's record: 138-90.
Dungy's record: 139-69.

Shanahan has won one playoff game since the 1998 season. One. He's coached for a decade with one playoff win. That's better than Dungy? The only argument you can make for Shanahan is the one extra Super Bowl.
 

why

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Bill Cowher is better than both those fools.

As for Belichik's record: he fucking coached the Browns for a few years.

I say that as a Browns fan.
 

Ambulance Chaser

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Every HOF has tiers. Dungy is not in the legend tier, but his coaching record is still HOF-worthy in my opinion.

A tougher question is whether Donovan McNabb is HOF material. I thinks he's just outside right now, and if he wins the Super Bowl this year, or sometime in the future, he gets in.
 

thekunk07

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McNabb is WAY outside hall of fame caliber.

and the w-l record is a bit overrated. andy reid has a lot of wins, but manages a clock like herm edwards.

look at what belichiock did without brady. lets see how dungy would do without peyton.


Originally Posted by Ambulance Chaser
Every HOF has tiers. Dungy is not in the legend tier, but his coaching record is still HOF-worthy in my opinion.

A tougher question is whether Donovan McNabb is HOF material. I thinks he's just outside right now, and if he wins the Super Bowl this year, or sometime in the future, he gets in.
 

kwilkinson

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Originally Posted by thekunk07
look at what belichiock did without brady. lets see how dungy would do without peyton.

Just over .500, with 4/6 seasons going to the playoffs.
Pre-Brady, Belichick went 36-44 with one trip to the playoffs (as a head coach). If you don't really count 2000 season as "with Brady" then Bill went 41-55 pre-Brady.
 

thekunk07

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^yeah. okay, not HOF material. though he gets some poiints for surviving with sean king.

btw, my rankings of current top 5 coaches would be:

bellicheck (best, hands down)
fisher(most with least)
shanahan(always competitive, offensive genius)
coughlin(solid)
gruden(tarnished a bit now)
 

Ambulance Chaser

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Originally Posted by kwilkinson
Just over .500, with 4/6 seasons going to the playoffs.
Pre-Brady, Belichick went 36-44 with one trip to the playoffs (as a head coach)

Beat me to it. Belichick's record without Tom Brady at QB is very average. No coach other than Joe Gibbs has won multiple championships without a top-flight QB.

Dungy's coaching record is not that dissimilar to John Madden's. Madden only won one Super Bowl and one AFC Championship, as he was going up against the great Pittsburgh Steelers teams of the 1970s. He has a better winning percentage than Dungy (which is explained in part by the fact that he took over a good Raiders team) and a mediocre (9-7) playoff record.
 

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