TOJ - updates on the debacle, complaints, news about other ventures, whatever.

Discussion in 'Streetwear and Denim' started by impolyt_one, Jan 7, 2011.

  1. vaalbara

    vaalbara Senior member

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    agreed. i took an unzipped fit pic but it came out poorly and it's too hot to take another one. maybe in a few months!
     


  2. Carpenoctem

    Carpenoctem Well-Known Member

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    At good restaraunts the waiter is tasked with knowing the entire menu, any and all questions a customer has about the menu are answered, and any assistance requested is rendered. Also bare in mind your standard meal, even at a very upscale restaraunt doesnt cost 700 bucks and if you dont like it you can send it back, which isnt the case here.

    I love toj as much as the next guy and have spent more with them than most but i feel sizing ones self from scratch will end up with cpuntless horrible fits from n00bs measuring their favorite dad jacket.

    A better approach would be like modern tailor. Merely submit body measurements with a choice of normal fit, slimfit or loose. Drew punches in the body measurements and they are automatically altered by a modifier according to the fit type selected.

    Second approach is merely measuring a well fitting jacket and using those exact measurements, but bear in mind not everyone already has well fitting clothing, and toj isnt exactly aa bad place to go for ones first nice jacket.
     


  3. jslade

    jslade Senior member

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    I'm ready to place my order, Drew. Shoot me an email back when you get the chance, and I will send it right over. I hammered out the measurements myself. No big deal.:devil:
     


  4. FrankieGT

    FrankieGT Active Member

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    Kind of like the approach that already exists?

    http://www.styleforum.net/forum/thread/217855/the-new-official-toj-thread-2011/7770
     


  5. LionelFrankenstein

    LionelFrankenstein Senior member

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    I get the feeling I should order another jacket soon before Drew gets sick of these people telling him what he should be doing and changes shit up. I don't think he's looking for suggestions so i don't know why people feel compelled to offer their own. It's really annoying.
     


  6. GBear

    GBear Senior member

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    When did you order the jacket?
     


  7. vaalbara

    vaalbara Senior member

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    jun 20
     


  8. GBear

    GBear Senior member

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    Okay thanks. Ordered mine on the 5th. I'm excited. :)
     


  9. Carpenoctem

    Carpenoctem Well-Known Member

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    How about you actually go through the process and contribute some business to Drew rather than just suckling his teet? The guy is operating a small business and he is clearly frustrated. Loyal, repeat customers offering input on how to streamline the process is the best possible way for him to find out what works and what doesnt. Its the whole point of this thread and the reason toj is so cool. We get to interact directly with the designer, and he gets ro interact directly with his customer base.

    Frankly though onlypeople who have bought, or are serious about buying and have the means to do so should be participating.
     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2011


  10. vaalbara

    vaalbara Senior member

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    so have you actually bought anything from toj or do you just get a hardon for writing long angry aimless rants?
     


  11. LionelFrankenstein

    LionelFrankenstein Senior member

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    Not that I care to perpetuate your nonsense but I've ordered from TOJ on a few occasions in the past and will soon do so again. Though I haven't bought anything since Charly left it seems like it shouldn't be too hard to figure things out on my own given those new posts.
     


  12. Carpenoctem

    Carpenoctem Well-Known Member

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    Then you know why Charly was so helpful, he didnt really size anyone from scratch which would be somewhat impossible without seeing them in person. His job was simply to translate their measurements into a well fitting jacket. Some jackets look better with extra length, or slightly longer sleeves, etc.

    The point is any retard can measure themselves but often times people are unaware of how to translate those body measurements into a jacket which fits the way they want. I distinctly remember how the old jackets size charts were all different, as they are designed to fit slightly differently. This is why charly recommended a completely different set of measurements for my moto than he did for my dr.

    Obviously Drew wants to simplify this process a bit, and the measuring guide certainly will help people take more accurate measurements but it does literally nothing to tell people how to translate their body measurements into clothing.

    If Drew doesnt have the time to translate these numbers, he could just provide a set of modifiers by which a person multiplies their raw measurements, to arrive at a set of jacket measurements. Hes provided those modifier numbers for p2p but ideally we also need them for all of the individual measurements, and they should be included in the guide which must then be easily accessible to the standard n00b.

    This would cut down on dumb questions from confused first time buyers, but unfortunately would do nothing for people asking about zippers, random modifications etc. Unfortunately for Drew that sort of stuff just comes with the territory and he'll have to ignore it if he wants to maintain his sanity.
     


  13. melonadejello

    melonadejello Senior member

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    If you supply body measurements and tell him that they are body measurements, then he makes the jacket to fit.
    You obviously missed the whole point of Guide B
    It would have taken way less time for you to just click the link posted above than it did to type out all that


     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2011


  14. impolyt_one

    impolyt_one Senior member

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    Carpenoctum, what are you talking about at this point?

    Anyway, as has been pointed out, there are two sizing methods that are pretty workable - there is no 'true size' and if you can't figure out what is going on with the chart, then forget about it. For leathers, the size chart only ever existed as a hypothetical base, with the obvious assumption that nobody is exactly alike and therefore modifications and custom measurement sets are normal.

    When sending me emails, I can't get emails formatted like 'i need a size 45 with the length of a 46 and the sleeve widths of a 44 and the length of a 49, and the p2p of a 47' - I am doing this on an iPad, most likely inside a car, so i can't work like that. Obviously, I don't have the measurement charts and the 200 some corresponding measurments memorized. Just tell me the raw numbers in inches, that's all you need to make an order.

    skitlets asid something about size 46 not being 46 - well, your issue was the sleeve widths, and that is because you took a normal size and shortened it... if you take a normal size and squeeze it down in height, it will appear wider than normal; likewise if you take a normal size and stretch it in height, it will appear slimmer proportionally... Also bear in mind that what applies to a DR from 6 months ago doesn't have to do with a Harrington now. I thought this stuff was all kind of given.

    Just relax, and take things one by one, and for what they are. The menu is really not that long or extensive, on purpose.
     


  15. impolyt_one

    impolyt_one Senior member

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    Wrong, on most counts. (all?)
    -The size charts were all different because they were made 2 yeats ago, and just based on the original samples and then extrapolated in Excel. That is it. There was no magic or specific reason. Turned out in the end that since all the leathers are made from scratch, patterns, measurements, everything individualized, that the size charts never really did anything but anchor numbers, and it was 100% arbitrary.

    -Charly took your measurements and guided people with the same exact things I've posted in this thread basically, for a year and a half. It turned out in the end that by common sense, it was unnecessary for him to waste his time on that. Also, I have a different taste for how the jackets should fit (not that anybody listens to me) but that is different than how Charly sized things, so I needed to make a change. It was forward progress for what I want. I want to make consistently good clothing with an artful fit, and not a generic size chart 'perfect' fit.

    -As I said, if I have to have another person doing emails, answering questions there are either no answer to, or circular questions, that would cost me a lot more money obviously, and that person does not actively make me money by doing that, so the solution would be that the price of the goods would have to go up 30%. That is not arbitrary, that is the actual cost of complicating the matter.

    -I don't need to give you the ratios for all the dimensions, that is my secret recipe. I just need to know your body measurements and you will tell me if you want a jacket measuring in X numbers, or if ou are giving me a list of raw body measurements and are asking me to size you. That is it. I'm not inviting you into my kitchen.

    -Slow down and think about what you are posting, all of your concerns have been answered in the recent previous pages. There's more than enough to work with and Carpenoctum, you are making a complete mess of this thread now and confusing people. I get 5 emails the minute someone makes a mess in the thread because people get confused, and it's not necessary. I am not doing brain surgery, I am making casual clothes for men.
     


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