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toddler fights

Discussion in 'General Chat' started by globetrotter, Jun 10, 2005.

  1. globetrotter

    globetrotter Senior member

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    well, the only fathering sites I know recomend wearing synthetics, so I couldn't possibly hang around [​IMG]
     
  2. Kai

    Kai Senior member

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    Nothing wrong with a little well-plotted revenge. When I was in 2nd grade, I got revenge on the class bully (who reveled in tormenting me) by growing some virulent cold/flu strain  (donated by my sister) in an agar dish and smearing said biological weapon all over the bully's stuff.  He was very very sick for the better part of a week.  I had threatened him ahead of time that I was going to put a curse on him through black magic and voodoo, so when he really did get violently ill, he became  convinced I was a dangerous person, and left me alone.  Martial arts aren't the only way to defend yourself. [​IMG]
     
  3. faustian bargain

    faustian bargain Senior member

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    biological warfare, awesome.

    wow, a 2nd grader with access to agar, and the wherewithal to use it. your parents must've been lab biologists...?
     
  4. LA Guy

    LA Guy Opposite Santa Staff Member Admin Moderator

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    I have concluded that we were a pretty evil bunch of little boys. Now we are a pretty evil bunch of preening men. Like Doctor Evil, but with a fetish for fancy dress. Very attractive.
     
  5. PHV

    PHV Senior member

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    (Tokyo Slim @ June 10 2005,12:32) My children will be lethal with a blade by age 5. I'll also teach them how satisfying it is to hold the anger and pain of public insults inside, while plotting to get revenge far from the prying eyes of the adults. Daddy, daddy, little timmy "fell" down the well. (again) Sort of reminds me of my childhood.
    Nothing wrong with a little well-plotted revenge. When I was in 2nd grade, I got revenge on the class bully (who reveled in tormenting me) by growing some virulent cold/flu strain  (donated by my sister) in an agar dish and smearing said biological weapon all over the bully's stuff.  He was very very sick for the better part of a week.  I had threatened him ahead of time that I was going to put a curse on him through black magic and voodoo, so when he really did get violently ill, he became  convinced I was a dangerous person, and left me alone.  Martial arts aren't the only way to defend yourself. [​IMG]
    You better let the UN weapons inspectors in when the knock. Lord knows you don't want to be part of the "axis of evil".
     
  6. Kai

    Kai Senior member

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    Mom was in medical school at the time. She was excited to give me stuff for my "science experiments."
     
  7. globetrotter

    globetrotter Senior member

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    wow, Kai, I no longer admire you only for your extensive collection of bespoke shoes. such extensive revenge in second grade indicates some serious evil plotting abilities. one would think that you could grow up to be a..... let's see.... maybe a lawyer [​IMG]
     
  8. Fabienne

    Fabienne Senior member

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    Globetrotter, what was said to the 5 year old after this happened? It might have been good to help him and your son get through this by deconstructing the occurance.

    When we were in Paris last week, our apartment was 50 yards from the Square Necker (it has a children's playground) and spent quite a few hours there with our 2 1/2 year old. I didn't hesitate to discipline a kid who wasn't mine. If I see a 3 year old throwing sand at an 18 month old's face, I will intervene if the parents are not watching.

    When I was six or seven, a bully (a boy) tormented me for a few weeks. Finally, I snapped, although I was much smaller than he was. I began hitting and shouting in a rage. He ran away in tears and never bothered me again.
     
  9. Stu

    Stu Senior member

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    (Tokyo Slim @ June 10 2005,12:32) My children will be lethal with a blade by age 5. I'll also teach them how satisfying it is to hold the anger and pain of public insults inside, while plotting to get revenge far from the prying eyes of the adults. Daddy, daddy, little timmy "fell" down the well. (again) Sort of reminds me of my childhood.
    Nothing wrong with a little well-plotted revenge. When I was in 2nd grade, I got revenge on the class bully (who reveled in tormenting me) by growing some virulent cold/flu strain  (donated by my sister) in an agar dish and smearing said biological weapon all over the bully's stuff.  He was very very sick for the better part of a week.  I had threatened him ahead of time that I was going to put a curse on him through black magic and voodoo, so when he really did get violently ill, he became  convinced I was a dangerous person, and left me alone.  Martial arts aren't the only way to defend yourself. [​IMG]
    I'm no lawyer, Kai, but I think you just copped to attempted murder [​IMG] Maybe we can plea you down to felonious assault.
     
  10. globetrotter

    globetrotter Senior member

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    F,

    I was wondering when you would get in, I was waiting for your input....

    I am not of the opinion that it is benifitial to either discipline somebody else's child, or to be overly protective of my child, when there is not a life, limb or soul threatening situation (as FIH mentioned, it can happen).

    I fugure that we disagree on this, if somebody else is raising there kid to be a bully it is not my position to try and shape the kid - one repremand from a stranger will do nothing but confuse the kid. (on the other hand, one of our sons friends has a bad home situation that is reflected in his behavior and a lot of us have taken to spending time with him to give him stability, to help, but that is an entirely differnet situation). I have pulled kids apart to prevent somebody from getting hurt, but not to try to teach the kids who aren't mine (or part of my circle of friends and family) my values. this kids mother, who actually was a minor friend of ours, who I realy don't think we will see much of from now on, didn't seem overly concerned about the whole thing, although she may not have seen what promted the whole conflict.

    also, my son will be faced with violence and with unfairness his whole life,I don't want to give him so much protection that he isn't prepared, like some type of galapogas tortoise, unprepared for hunters.
     
  11. Fabienne

    Fabienne Senior member

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    I don't think we necessarily disagree. Unfortunately, my son knows all too well how to defend himself. I don't intervene unless the damage incurred will result in intense suffering (the sand thrown in the eyes of the baby incident did happen). I don't tell other people's children not to burp while seated at the dinner table, no matter how strong the urge... Still, I think there might be somewhat of a cultural difference here when you talk of your reluctance to discipline someone else's child.
     
  12. Fabienne

    Fabienne Senior member

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    PS: I'm not sure if your son is too young for this, but what about asking him what else he could have done instead of hitting the 5 year old (thus putting himself in danger of being further attacked in a way he couldn't handle)? You, as an adult, could also suggest other ways out of conflict (for example, something along the lines of what Kai suggested...). Your son sounds like he tried initially to handle the provocation without hitting, but was pushed to react as he did because he lacked the words. He sounds like an intelligent kid from what you have said about him till now, I would think that he would be eager to find creative ways of handling conflict that could prove useful his whole life.
     
  13. globetrotter

    globetrotter Senior member

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    F,

    I think that you are right about the cultural angle - when I lived in israel it was pretty common form parents to discipline other people's kids, inlcuding about basic etiquite things. and I probrably did it myself. I try not to do it in the states, and I have seen other people do it to other kids and get involved in a major shouting match with parents. But, in terms of what you specificaly stated, I would have stopped a kid throwing sand on a baby, as well.

    I think that kai handled his conflict in a very creative way, and hats off to him. I went through part of my life looking for "creative" ways to handle conflict, and I am not nessasarily happy with that. I spent another part of my life solving conflicts in a much more direct way, and I am not sure that that is best, either.

    I think that a lot of the people who are too violent, or too obsessed with guns, or a variety of other weaknessess later on in life are people who are not able to protect themselves comfortably as children, and grow up feeling very insecure about the world. I am significantly less worried about him putting himself in danger of a further attack than I am worried about him becoming too aggresive. the line is very fine. I have no doubt that I could give him the tools he needs to protect himself in this situation; I am not convinced that he will use them correctly, and I am not convinced that it wouldn't be a good lesson for him to get his ass kicked a few more times before I do.
     
  14. PHV

    PHV Senior member

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    There is no creative non direct means of conflict resolution at that age short of taddle tailing.
     
  15. Fabienne

    Fabienne Senior member

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    Fists forward...
    Agressivity in children is natural, and even needs to be expressed. Pushing, pinching arms, cheeks, kicking, pulling hair are common to all children. However, they don't come out of nowhere. In most cases, conflicts are about possessing an object, a toy, about going down the slide first. Agressivity can also manifest itself when a child was denied something, did not get an answer upon a question, or when he/she is bothered during voluntary or forced isolation. Opposition to what is forbidden, inability to deal with frustration. I suppose a stressful family situation or a lack of affection might make those manifestations more frequent.

    All children fight, but some make it their preferred means of expression. And that behavior leads them to be excluded. Isolation is unbearable to them, which in turn leads them to be even more aggressive. Pretending indifference is the worst of solutions, as children need to be listened to, recognized. A child needs to be protected from his/her own violence, and it is up to the adults to set the limits so that they can better adapt to the real world.

    Language acquisition helps. But aggressivity must always be expressed, as damage from repressed feelings can cause deeper suffering.
     

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