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To all you German speaking forum members out there

Discussion in 'General Chat' started by ccffm1, May 19, 2006.

  1. skalogre

    skalogre Senior member

    Messages:
    6,324
    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2006
    Btw, Hanseat, thank you for that link! Very entertaining [​IMG]
     
  2. muelleran

    muelleran Senior member

    Messages:
    242
    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2006
    Location:
    Zurich
    Germans are a romantic people - romanticism knows no moderation.
    I could sit here all day thinking about the past... then again we know about history as opposed to most americans I've talked to (AP US History 5 points; AP US and Comp. Government 5 points). But we had a bit of learning from our history to do... I guess it's just in our genes [​IMG]
    [​IMG] Well it certainly has a bit to do with history if you look at it: Start out with one of the greater German contributions, the reformation, causing uprisings that Luther himself did not even anticipate. The Uprisings were brutally put down. The spread of the reformation and the restoration that followed caused a shift in the power balance in Germany that was one of the reasons for the greatest catastrophe in German history, the 30 year war(1618-1648), that devastated large parts of the country. Looting armies and the plague that followed them elliminated about 20% of the population - the village my parents live in had a population of 200 before the war and a population of 20 after the war, some parts of the country were void of a population for some time afterwards. Since the war was not won by any party, Germany could not develop into a nation-state as France and England did, the loose federation of German states became ever weaker and after the French revolution could not defend itself. So the French eventually did away with the Reich (the first Reich) and Napoleon established a system af alliances with local rulers in western Germany. That time marks the beginning of German nationalism. However, these were also the times of Goethe, and especially Schiller, so after the defeat of Napoleon, and after once again a period of restoration, the ideas of the French revolution stayed. This eventually led to another failed revolution, in 1848, followed by yet another restoration that caused the population to withdraw into privacy (Biedermeier). The ideas of the enlighment were pushed back in Germany as a result, replaced by a more romantic view of the world, less based on thinking or studying and more on feeling and experiencing, feeling sentimental one could say. Eventually Prussia dominated Germany and a new Reich (the second one) could be established. (The by now well established idea of nationalism prevented the multi-ethnic Austria to be included). We are now in 1871, France was just defeated by Prussia. The establishment of the 2nd Reich, however, lead to a power shift in Europe: Suddenly a united German empire comes into play. As European leaders tried to balance it out by a system of alliances an enourmously complicated system evolved. (the time of Bismarck's Realpolitik that oddly enough G.W. Bush became interested in lately.) That system of alliances of course turned the ethnic uprisings in the Austro-Ungarian Empire into WW I, as suddely a chain reaction of declarations of war was triggered. I don't see Germany as the country that started it, I suppose the decision to attack France quickly was seen as dictated by the geographic position of Germany: The war will come anyway, if Germany wants to win she has to attack (move to Paris with all forces, then shift to the east and repell the attacking Russians - a plan that was drawn up well before the war (Schliefen Plan)). Did not work, Germans lost their nerve when the Russians indeed did attack in the east and moved forces to the east prematurely. Also the meaning of new weapon technology on the battlefield was misinterpreted (no, you cannot use mashine guns to just mow down defending troops). After WW I we have two revolutions at the same time, finally a democracy, but also huge inflation, the revenge of the victors, a democracy that most people despise - western liberal ideas (of the victors) don't have much of a foothold in the general population so again it is these romantic, illogical, sentimental, ideas that take hold. You all know what followed then: the celebration of that mystical, sentimental aspect, this time modernised and disguised as science, excecuted without moderation, there is no place for moderation in mystical romaticism. To make a long story short I believe Germans are a sentimental people because - The 30 year war halted political progress and political unity in Germany - The political ideas of the French revolution were supressed after the defeat of Napoleon and replaced by romanticism. - Germany was either too weak or too strong most of the time and as a result Germans never feel secure. - A united Germany rarely happens - Most revolutions, most attempts of the population to gain freedom, failed. - an enlighned view of the world is sometimes seen as superficial, not connected to the knowledge of a mystical depth (little example to German students: "Die Amerikanischen Studenten lernen ja nur anwendungsbezogenes Wissen - in Deutschland bohren wir dickere Bretter.....") It's a refuge: picture members of the old Germanic tribes sitting in the woods at night, in touch with their pagan gods, tourches light the clearing, Wagner music in the background, mourning the death of their king. That feeling, I believe, is indeed in our genes. [​IMG]
     
  3. globetrotter

    globetrotter Senior member

    Messages:
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    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2004
    Location:
    greater chicago
    That feeling, I believe, is indeed in our genes.


    [​IMG]


    I don't believe it is in the genes, but I think that it is deeply ingrained in the very material of the culture. I have been to hundreds of small german festivals and celebrations, as well as a dozen or so big ones, and spent quite a bit of time in differnt parts of germany (as well as living there for a while), it seems to me that there is definatly something mystical in the culture.
     
  4. tarotsternchen

    tarotsternchen Member

    Messages:
    17
    Joined:
    Nov 2, 2007
    Location:
    germany
    [​IMG]
    ok the german wine riesling müller thurgau domina usw its ok but dangerous,for the next day .
    my location is würzburg in germany a winetwown,so i can help you for questions and anything.
    i have good adresses for wine and winzers (the winemakers )
    lovley greets from unterfranken
     
  5. Joel_Cairo

    Joel_Cairo Senior member

    Messages:
    5,589
    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2006
    Location:
    Cambridge, MA
    [​IMG]
    ok the german wine riesling müller thurgau domina usw its ok but dangerous,for the next day .
    my location is würzburg in germany a winetwown,so i can help you for questions and anything.
    i have good adresses for wine and winzers (the winemakers )
    lovley greets from unterfranken


    Was soll das, eigentlich? Diese komische Meldung vom Astro-Hotline-genannter Würzburgerin laesst sich entweder als wahnungslose Necroposting oder einfacher Spam gelesen werden.

    Dieser Diskussionsfaden ist nicht mehr auf dem Laufenden, tarotsternchen. Bitte beachten sie den Zeitstempel!
     
  6. tarotsternchen

    tarotsternchen Member

    Messages:
    17
    Joined:
    Nov 2, 2007
    Location:
    germany
    oh sorry im new here !!!
    tut mir leid aber ich habe nichts mit einer astroline zu tun,bin nur ein aufgeschlossener mensch mit hang zum styling.
    ich wollte nicht provozieren und möchte nur eine ansändige kommunikation
    sorry joel_cairo[​IMG]
     
  7. j

    j Senior member Admin

    Messages:
    14,914
    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2002
    Location:
    Seattle, WA
    Was soll das, eigentlich? Diese komische Meldung vom Astro-Hotline-genannter Würzburgerin laesst sich entweder als wahnungslose Necroposting oder einfacher Spam gelesen werden.

    Dieser Diskussionsfaden ist nicht mehr auf dem Laufenden, tarotsternchen. Bitte beachten sie den Zeitstempel!

    Laughen auf lauden

    I can't read it exactly, but I get the drift...
     
  8. tarotsternchen

    tarotsternchen Member

    Messages:
    17
    Joined:
    Nov 2, 2007
    Location:
    germany
    no im not a spam ......................im a normal women ;-)
     
  9. lakewolf

    lakewolf Senior member

    Messages:
    5,166
    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2006
    Location:
    Zurich, Switzerland
    How easy it will be for a person to learn German will greatly depend on their native tongue. Dutch speakers always amaze me in that. As a native French speaker, I found it much harder than English, but less so than Russian, for example. It's infuriating that I can understand 80% of Spanish or Italian without ever having studied these languages, whereas Russian still evades me after 5 years of study.

    ...


    Chère Fabienne, we are latins so it is easier for us to learn or understand without formal study latin languages.

    I do speak French, Spanish, Italian and have good understanding of Portuguese and even Romanian.

    The germanic languages are harder to learn for us as their grammar and vocabulary are different, being english a mix of germanic and latin languages .

    However I find Germanic grammar very logic and once when you learned the basic building blocks of the language and understood the 4 grammatical modes ( nominativ, dativ, genitiv, akusativ, that exist also in our latin languages but we don't notice it as the declensions are not that evident ) it gets fairly easy to understand, after that the vocabulary learning take a little time but it comes little by little well.

    I do speak High German, but alas here were I live now the people speak the "Swiss German" that is not as many people believe a regional german, but a whole language on itself with different basics, ( the basic verbs, conjugations, prepositions and adverbs are different from high German). I have a basic understanding of the dialect now as I am inmersed in this environment I am learning it fast anyway.

    Slavic languages, on the other hand are the most difficult language to learn. With 7 grammatical cases, all of them with declension by gender, number and case, applied to nouns, adjectives and adverbs. It is a real nightmare to learn, without even mention the vocabulary that is completely different from latin and germanic languages.

    I did started to learn Czech/Slovak with more emphasys on Slovak ( as I had a girlfriend at Bratislava at that time ). and I now understand the very basics. Russian interest me, but the different alphabet ( Cyrillic ) discouraged me. The same as with Greek.

    Anyway, once you have learned one language or two, the next ones come easier as you then understand how languages are structured. Something that I never put my interest on when I was a monoglot. I allways found language and grammar studies boring at that time.

    I think most native english speakers have more difficulty learning other languages as their language has an oversimplified grammar.
     

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