Tie colors

Discussion in 'Classic Menswear' started by hopkins_student, Nov 14, 2004.

  1. j

    j (stands for Jerk) Admin

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    Okay, well we'll not allow any mass murderers or members of mass murdering regimes in avatars, okay? I don't care how you feel about him, and if you want you can have his picture all over your room, but here, the discussion is men's clothing, hence the title of the forum, "Men's Clothing".

    Thanks.
     


  2. esquire.

    esquire. Senior member

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    Does this mean I cannnot choose George W. Bush for my avatar?

    But, seriously, what about all those avatars of The Prince of Wales. He was a Nazi sympthathizer, and would have tried to ally Britain with Germany if he had been king.
     


  3. xlhell

    xlhell Member

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    esquire, don't confuse the discussion with facts. Only warm and fuzzy avatars are allowed here. And the use of George Bush as a avatar is allowed because he's our mass murderer (but with only 100,000 Iraq dead he's rather a lightweight).

    The only reason I chose Wittman is because he looked so stately in his uniform. And because somebody beat me to Jude Law's Alfie. If Four-in-Hand hadn't called him a Nazi I doubt many on this board would have cared who the avatar was.

    To tell you the truth j's avatar scares me. Who is that? Death? Holding a weapon? And I certainly hope that's not a dead animal in his other hand as here in SF the PETA people are offended by hunting for sport.
     


  4. gorgekko

    gorgekko Senior member

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    The Duke of Windsor was allegedly sympathetic to the Nazis. Although I personally believe that he, like many Brits at the time, was sympathetic to the Third Reich, no one has produced the evidence that convicts him. Comparing him to a member of the Waffen SS -- even if indirectly -- is a little unfair. Henry Ford actually was sympathetic to the Nazis, did business with them and published a notorious anti-Jewish book. I hope no one drives a Ford.
     


  5. Kaga

    Kaga Senior member

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    I regret the actions of General Tojo and Admiral Ohnishi among others sixty years ago. George W. Bush is a man who may or may not have caused the US to lose a great deal of face in the world, but he does not compare to the Nazis. Evil has orders of magnitude like an earthquake, as does your willful blindness and idiocy, Mr. Hell.

    Why do you venerate a Nazi uniform? Are you like that fellow Chips, the mid-century British aristocrat who was turned on by Nazis and Nazi regalia? Is there no one else who looks as stately in a uniform as your friend Wittman? If it is Prussianism that elates you could you not choose a Weimar general or one of the sad old pre-WWI Kaisers? By your reasoning, should someone post with an avatar of Hitler as, I am sadly forced to admit, he was an effective, perhaps spellbinding orator? Should you instead post an avatar of a Klansman because he happens to be wearing nice 400-count sheets? While this is a styleforum I would respect the forum moderators' decision not to celebrate Nazi style.
     


  6. Zubberah

    Zubberah Senior member

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    I have a couple of Leonard ties that have 18 colours. Most of my Leonard ties have 8-15 colours. Coversely, I have around 60 Richard James ties, mostly 1,2 and up to 6 colours. Really depends on what you want to achieve and how you are dressing.
     


  7. modsquad

    modsquad Senior member

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    The Nazi SS were not ordinary soldiers and they weren't just following orders. They were an elite group that began as a domestic security force established by Hitler as a counterweight to the official security apparatus under the Gestapo (the state security police) and the Wehrmacht (the army), under his control. Eventually, the SS was charged with administering Nazi policy in the East, policy that included the shooting of 1,000,000 Slavs in Russia and the Ukraine where Wittman was apparently active in addition to the death camps. I had never heard of Wittman until his name came up here but it is impossible that he rose to such a high position in the SS without making his bones along the way by planning, directing or participating in some of this violence. Yes, this is a clothing site, but to ask the membership to forget that someone was a powerful instrument in one of the two or three greatest evils in world history and merely admire the cut of his coat or the elegance of his wheeling manuver is a bit much. I don't think we need an avatar policy: I think anyone should be allowed to use whatever they want for an avatar. And I would prefer to confine my discussion of atrocities to mixed plaids. But if a member decides to represent himself with enobling pictures of Nazis, he is going to hear about it, and he should.
     


  8. xlhell

    xlhell Member

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    "I had never heard of Wittman until his name came up here but it is impossible that he rose to such a high position in the SS without making his bones along the way by planning, directing or participating in some of this violence."

    So you admit you are assuming that because Wittman held such a high rank he must have been involved in some of the Nazi atrocities. That he could have been promoted solely on his talent in armored warfare never entered your mind?
    By all accounts Wittman made his way to such a high position by being an excellent tanker, possibly the best the world has ever known. He had absolutely nothing to do with the death camps or the execution of civilians in the Soviet Union. The man was in a tank, freezing his ass off probably wishing he was home with his family. To lump him with the atrocities of the Nazis is like saying that every Japanese soldier is guilty of the incredible atrocities of Nanking. Or that every American GI stationed in Iraq is guilty of the crimes at Abu Ghirab.

    During the waning day of the war the Germans dressed 14 and 15 year old boys in SS uniforms and sent them out as fodder to the advancing Red Army. Would you hold them responsible for atrocities committed by others? They were after all SS. You want to group everybody in a neat little box and say they were all monsters when if you would do a little research instead of these knee-jerk responses perhaps you might learn something.

    You know, had the administrator emailed me and said "look man, I've had a complaint about your avatar could you please find something different" I would have happily complied; I'm not on this board to offend anyone, I'm here to learn more about a subject that interests me. But instead I got "Hmm, I thought he looked rather Nazi-like. Well, enough of that."

    So the administrator was judge, jury and executioner. To me censorship is so, well, Nazi-like.

    And Mr. Kaga, nice demogogery. To read the papers I think it is without question that Bush has cause the US to lose face with the rest of the world. While it's true he isn't even in the same ballpark with the Nazi's he still has four more years to go. Perhaps he can match the numbers of Pol Pot. And to suggest posting an avatar of Hitler because he was great orator makes no sense on a clothing board; it's an non-sequeter.

    I do apologise to anyone who was offended by my choice of avatar. Hopefully my new one is neutral enough to escape the attention of the PC police.
     


  9. drizzt3117

    drizzt3117 Senior member

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    The Waffen SS for the most part was not involved with the "Final Solution" as was the Death's Head SS and the Einstatzgruppen. They were a military unit that acquitted itself quite well in combat. Many SS were not members of the Nazi party, especially the aristocracy, of which Wittman was apparently a member of. Fighting for your country is not a crime, and not all German soldiers were war criminals, although a large portion certainly were.
     


  10. gorgekko

    gorgekko Senior member

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    I didn't want to get drawn into this but to say that the Waffen SS didn't become involved in their share of atrocities is ridiculous. Several units were implicated in massacres of civilians and POWs.

    The SS Leibstandarte Adolph Hitler, for example, committed several atrocities during fighting in the Balkans.
     


  11. j

    j (stands for Jerk) Admin

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    Well, it's my forum, and I can and will censor what I want, although I don't often do so. Typically, I try to let the forum go in a sort of self-policing, laissez-faire manner. Calling me Nazi-like, however, is a good way to get kicked off. Even if you meant it as a compliment, given your apparent admiration for Nazis, I take it as an insult.

    Whether or not you 'would happily have complied' is irrelevant; there was no reason to leave it to you to fix the avatar, and have other members continue to be offended while we wait for you to read the message and respond to it. I did send you a message notifying you that I had removed the avatar. I could easily have simply banned you, but I took time out of my day to give you the benefit of the doubt. I am now rethinking that decision.
     


  12. xlhell

    xlhell Member

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    Please, please, please take the time to read my post. I did not call you Nazi-like, I called censorship Nazi-like.

    How do you infer that I like Nazis? Christ, they shot at my father.
    I admire a man who had great skill in an area of warfare. I truly wish he had been an American or an Englishman or Canadian but he was not.

    Were other member that offended that I couldn't have been given, say, 12 hours to change my avatar? If the board is truly '"self-policing" wouldn't that have been keeping with that spirit?

    So you gave me the benefit of the doubt by not banning me from the board simply because I used a avatar a couple of people took exception to? Isn't there a fellow on this board how gets everyone riled up on a regular basis, Marc something or other? Is my crime worse than his?

    Yes it is your forum and you can ban me. Perhaps you can burn my posts too?
     


  13. FIHTies

    FIHTies Senior member

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    How unfortunate that the World had only skilled warrior worthy of your admiration.

    Marc has been banned on more than one occassion, BTW.

    I think that we all admire a man that feels the need to have the last word...
     


  14. drizzt3117

    drizzt3117 Senior member

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    I'm not saying they didn't commit any atrocities, but my point was that the Waffen SS in general weren't the troops people generally associate SS with and many weren't members of the Nazi party.
     


  15. oscarthewild

    oscarthewild Senior member

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    Getting back to tie colors. I remember reading a newsweek or Time in early 1984 that had an article on Giorgio Armani along with some pictures of his clothes. I think he said that he had used 90+ colors in one ensemble.

    Here I struggle with matching 4 patterns.

    -
     


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