Thom Browne

[SoCal2NYC]

Originally Posted by edmorel

uses fabrics that are nowhere in the league of what Kiton uses. The cashmere in particular is just not as good as the Kiton stuff. Construction-wise, everyone's opinion will differ depending on whether you prefer the "handmade" touches and flourishes or not. TB's stuff is very obviously machine made, not that there is anything wrong with that. But what I think is no disputable is that his fabrics are not in the same class as the big boys.

The suits in no way are trying to be anywhere close to Kiton/Brioni fabrics, it wouldn't look right if they were in those swatches. So I don't think it's fair to say something is not up to par to another brand when it doesn't claim to be.

However, the cashmere (sweaters...hasn't really been a cashmere suit yet) is years beyond Loro, Brunello and Pellat-Finet. They are also hand framed in the UK. As per the suits, I guess the "Hand Made in New York" tag is a lie according to yourself.

 

[edmorel]

Originally Posted by SoCal2NYC

The suits in no way are trying to be anywhere close to Kiton/Brioni fabrics, it wouldn't look right if they were in those swatches. So I don't think it's fair to say something is not up to par to another brand when it doesn't claim to be.

However, the cashmere (sweaters...hasn't really been a cashmere suit yet) is years beyond Loro, Brunello and Pellat-Finet. They are also hand framed in the UK. As per the suits, I guess the "Hand Made in New York" tag is a lie according to yourself.


1. Never claimed that TB is trying to be Kiton or whoever, just answered a question that was asked about the fabric versus Kiton/Brioni.
2. I didn't compare TB's cashmere to Brunello/LP or anyone other than Kiton in my post.
3.TB's clothing is made in a factory in Queens which makes other brands also. People's hands do touch the machines and the fabrics, but my "handmade" comment (the reason it is in quotes) is that most people equate "handmade" with the stitching on the shoulders/sleeves/chest/lapels that you find on garments from Oxxford/Kiton etc. That stuff is not present on TB, I would guess it is because, as you mentioned, he simply isn't trying to play that game.

 

[SoCal2NYC]

I wasn't saying that you did compare it to the other cashmere makers. It was unclear if you are talking about cashmere knits or swatches for suits. In the case of sweaters you won't find anything better, hands down.

That's great that off of seeing 2 suits you've made a complete review of his manufacturing process.

 

[aportnoy]

Originally Posted by SoCal2NYC

However, the cashmere (sweaters...hasn't really been a cashmere suit yet) is years beyond Loro, Brunello and Pellat-Finet.

Disagree. The TB cashmere is top-notch, but to say that it's light years ahead of LP, Cucinelli, Avon Celli is hyperbolic at best, misinformed at worst.

 

[Artisan Fan]

I think if people like TB then that's fine but I wonder about spending as much as $6K on a suit that may be stylistically dated in a short period of time.

I have not seen a TB suit in a few years but I was not impressed with construction or fabric quality.

 

[edmorel]

Originally Posted by SoCal2NYC

That's great that off of seeing 2 suits you've made a complete review of his manufacturing process.


Fine, you win. I know nothing about where TB's suits are made.

 

[water]

I have never seen a Thom Browne suit in person, only in pictures that have been posted here or on The Sartorialist.

That being said, they tend to appear, to me, as people wearing their suits a size too small. And this is coming from someone who likes a fitted look.

I think GS and his TaT suits get the fitted look right. 60s Roman/Continental... nice.

Save the outrageous ticket price of a Thom Browne, but a TaT and get it right.

 

[Get Smart]

haha thanks water. Justin wears his TB in a way that fits him and it looks good, he doesnt suffer from the "I gotta get a size too small" syndrome that some wearers have. I do get sticker shock at seeing his prices tho, and it's a testiment to *something* that he can sell at that price without any advertising

 

[TheFoo]

I like his color palette and some aspects of his aesthetic (he clearly has some excellent taste), but I don't buy that there's anything substantively innovative about his suits, which I find to be utterly inelegant. To me, his suit designs are as ugly as a flashy tie with cartoon characters on it: both attempt to revolt against a norm, but both are too sheepish to fully reject it.

 

[SoCal2NYC]

I like how people talk about the price and the longevity...not of the suit/quality itself; but, of the style.

It's fashion, it's about image and perception and prestige and even cockyness. Do I like the style of the suits? Yes. Do I like the fit? Yes. Do I like people who are "in the know" knowing what I paid? Yes.

 

[whnay.]

Originally Posted by SoCal2NYC

I like how people talk about the price and the longevity...not of the suit/quality itself; but, of the style.

It's fashion, it's about image and perception and prestige and even cockyness. Do I like the style of the suits? Yes. Do I like the fit? Yes. Do I like people who are "in the know" knowing what I paid? Yes.

SoCal I give you one thing, at least your not afraid to admit it...

 

[TheFoo]

Originally Posted by SoCal2NYC

I like how people talk about the price and the longevity...not of the suit/quality itself; but, of the style.

It's fashion, it's about image and perception and prestige and even cockyness. Do I like the style of the suits? Yes. Do I like the fit? Yes. Do I like people who are "in the know" knowing what I paid? Yes.

There are arguments against the whole notion of fashion itself, but I won't go there. Even assuming fashion is a good thing, Thom Browne is not immune to critique of his designs' logevity. He himself has stated that he thinks men should wear their suits like uniforms and that his purpose is to return to a bygone, more conservatively-dressed era. Hence, longevity and taste come into play, by his own admission.

EDIT: I forgot to point out: one of Thom Browne's design emphases is the anonymity of the masculine figure. He is attempting to celebrate the everyman. If people "in the know" know what you paid for one of his suits (and it's a few thousand bucks), he's contradicted his own theory of how men should dress and appear.

 

[DocHolliday]

Originally Posted by SoCal2NYC

I like how people talk about the price and the longevity...not of the suit/quality itself; but, of the style.

It's fashion, it's about image and perception and prestige and even cockyness. Do I like the style of the suits? Yes. Do I like the fit? Yes. Do I like people who are "in the know" knowing what I paid? Yes.

It's a fashion suit, and that's fine. But why, then, cling to the notion that Thom will have some sort of enduring appeal? Isn't the point that in a few years you'll have a new suit to feel this way about?

 

[SoCal2NYC]

I'm not saying it can't be critiqued or that it shouldn't.

But you always hear something like "...$5,000 for a suit that will be out of style in a year or two..." and not "...$5,000 for a suit that will fall apart in a year or two...".

I think it is just an easy cop out to use for not liking the style/price. I mean if that was the general mentality for clothing in general there wouldn't be $13,000 Oscar de la Renta ball gowns.

 

[SoCal2NYC]

I think my mentality is different in that I was a fashion student, I work in the retail industry and I also think of things as being "curatorial" in some of my purchases (aka the "paper" poly Jil Sander blue rain jacket). I'm aware of fashion being cyclical and if next year I decide to tuck away the Thom Browne suit for 4-5 years then that is fine with me. Or if I have it boxed up and in 30 years donate it to the Costume Institute that is fine by me as well.
Also, with the pricing/market size a very enticing thing to keep buying/wearing is the exclusivity of Thom Browne. The Black Fleece will not has his name on it, he isn't planning on doing a "diffusion line" and thus far after being out for 3-4 years in the fashion limelight the fast fashion retailers like Zara/H&M have not picked up on doing any knock offs. So you have both a preservation of the exclusivty of the "original" Thom Browne by not having cheaper alternatives with the same name nor having something very cheap and inspired by it.