Discussion in 'General Chat' started by tiecollector, Jul 3, 2009.
I leave the house at 8 am. Most nights I don't get home til like 11-12.
That's horrible. You should quit your job while you are in school.
I don't get the dumb racial stereotypes about blacks loving fried chicken, grape koolaid, watermelon etc. Who the hell doesn't love these things?? If it was collard greens and chitlins, I could understand.
I don't understand the disdain for a lot of harmless racial stereotypes to begin with. It isn't racist, it is identifying a trend.
I'm you on the deliciousness of the first three, but I can't just stand idly by and let you besmirch the good name of collards.
Uh, maybe because they're not harmless? Or maybe because it's not OK to assume one person acts a certain way based upon the behavior of others? Or maybe because of the origin of those stereotypes?
Mr. Booth, stop being racist. It's only acceptable when we're shitting on our token scapegoats.
You're being obtuse. We take samples from populations, observe, analyze and apply those assumptions to populations all of the time. Any type of forecasting does this, science and the medical industry do it all of the time. Plus, saying that black people like grape drink doesn't hurt anybody and has nothing to do with the way anybody acts. People in the south like country music, black people like rap and hip hop. So what? It is about how you treat people based on these stereotypes, not indentifying a mode in a cross section. That, in fact, is a sign of intelligence.
You're comparing stereotyping to scientific analysis, and I'm the one who is being obtuse? There is a vast difference between breaking down trends in an (ostensibly) unbiased model and going, "man, a lot of xxxxx people do yyyyyy. Thus, this is a trait we can assume is exhibited by xxxxx people so often that we can assume the average xxxxx person does it."
Do you even know where the stereotypes listed above originated? Perhaps you should explore that before you declare them "harmless" and pretend they're not inherently offensive.
Yet another thing we must disagree on. If you witness a large group of people doing something like consuming a drink and make a remark about it, it has nothing to do with where "classical" stereotypes originated from. It is an observation and a harmless one. I really, don't understand how upset people get over making observations it has nothing to do with people's character.
You're validating Sociobiology while attempting to invalidate its core foundation: observation. Denial of SB was popular for a while, but that train of thought dominated before SB's acceptance and not long after the academic establishment and the press did everything they could to censor E.O. Wilson. That didn't last long, and it was a brutal struggle of science over politics. Tread lightly.
Let's all stop before this becomes that conversation. Let's not let this get out of hand. We all seem to agree that racism is gross. We just disagree about the nature of its application. This type of conversation is nauseating, especially considering how rooted it is in politics (which are rarely a reflection of truth within the human condition, but rather a distortion of it as means to a predetermined end). Let's also not forget that when an observation like that is made by a "member" of a self-contained group, it is identified as "cultural" in origin. When an "outsider" makes that same observation, we end up with conversations like this.
That's not what the origin of this conversation was. BP made a joke about certain stereotypes and you went on to say that you don't understand why people get bothered by them. My point is that there is a legitimate reason to be bothered by these stereotypes, given their origin, and they're not just harmless groupings based upon observable trends. You can't just decide that there's no legitimate grounds for being offended simply because you aren't alluding to the history of the stereotypes when you use them. Words, behaviors, and such have meaning. What you're saying is equivalent to arguing it's OK to use racial slurs because you hear a lot of people from the group doing it, and you don't have any connection to the prior, pejorative, meaning.
That's why I included "(ostensibly) unbiased" in my statement. I'm aware that there are people who manipulate science for their own gains, and those are not the people to whom I'm referring.
WRT my signature, I assume you're referring to the Colbert quote, unless you have some weird racially-based objection to DBT or OCMS song lyrics. The quote has more to do with me being a Jimmy Buffett fan than whiteness. It's tied to a minor meme about me here, and it's not meant to be some sort of statement. It's a joke that was being made long before you joined, so I don't fault you for being confused. However, even if it were meant as some political statement, there's a vast difference between making fun of people who use stereotypes and arguing that they're harmless.
Fuck, you replied before my multiple edits. I reworded that a million times as not to be taken the wrong way. I understand totally and I'm not looking to flame. I understood the innocent nature of your sig and I was just taking a light jab. No harm meant.
I am not saying it is ok to call a black man the "N" word. That has a clear trace to hatred for black people. But to actually observe a group of people drinking a drink and saying something about it is not the same thing. I feel like a lot of the reasons people feel it is so wrong is because they are afraid of being called a racist, and so many people believe that something like that actually is racist, when it really isn't. To say that some stereotypes are so unbelievable, and don't exist and it is all racism is pure ignorance and a product of our society that loves to call anybody racist and feels superior for having done so.
We have threads for this stuff. Use them guiz!
Things I don't get: wait staff that do not write down orders and then fuck them up. One would think that since they take orders all day long they would recognize they need to write things down if they can't remember the properly.
Corollary: wait staff that are surprised when they fuck up the table's orders and do not receive a good tip.
Mine - why people wonder when I don't tip well. Well, if your sole purpose is to get me what I ask for, and you spectacularly fuck that up (not if its the kitchen's fault), then why do you deserve my money?
Separate names with a comma.