Discussion in 'Classic Menswear' started by Manton, Jul 31, 2012.
this thread needs piob; he has some kilt experience.
What he said! Carry on!
please not to ruin this thread
I think I can top this. I saw a man wearing two identical ties at the last wedding I attended. One around his neck, and one protruding at least 4-5" out of his jacket pocket as a pocket square. And we complain about matchy-matchy combinations here.....
I think that is the DKNY tie-and-pocket-square-in-a-bag combo from Macy's. Was he wearing a green shirt?
Well, out here in the west, cargo shorts and flip flops have made there way into this law firm....Its sad.
I have pet peeves with these kinds. Here in SE Asia it's hot and humid all year round but will full air conditioning indoors so it's a dual condition. But let's comment at the general public. Somehow the generic uniform for CBD has become superslimfit dress shirt w/o tie, cuffs buttoned, with superslimfit dress pants that sits too low that it further elongate the already skinny torso.. also creating the appearance of protruding butt. And then the shoes are the usual suspects of Aldo.. Aldo, everywhere. Slip-ons. Square-toed lace-ups.
For me it looks neither here nor there. Generally I do feel that a dress/business shirt by itself is an incomplete garment; it needs a jacket and tie or some other coverings. No tie, if you're Tom Ford. When ditching the jacket and tie, please take some more steps and roll your sleeves or untuck your shirts, though the latter might not be preferable if the shirt's tail's too long. But no one shares the same view; to them the tucked unrolled look is THE business look. Ugly.
I have been trying to think what sort of solution can be applied- unstructured jackets required skilled tailoring. Or go jacket-less and opting for the mandarin collar? Majority here is Chinese, why not?
For shoes, I've been thinking that black Chelseas can be a good option. Generally people who opt for black slip-ons a la Gucci loafers are the comfort chasers so the ease of putting on Chelsea boots is attractive. At first I thought they were told during grooming class at business schools (those exist) to wear laced shoes, but apparently they were only told to wear heeled black shoes.
So yeah go go chelsea boots
True - throughout my teaching career my daily wear was sports jacket and slacks (NOT a suit) but ALWAYS with a tie.
It seems to me that there are basically 2 examples that pop up in these kinds of discussions. There's those that just don't care (velcro sandals at a wedding for example) and those that have a complete lack of self awareness. Not much can be done about the former (can't make someone care about how they look) but the latter is a different story.
How much improvement would there be if people looked in the mirror before stepping outside? Or in a not unrelated note, how much space could be saved in WAYWRN if people actually looked at their photos before posting? Developing a critical eye when looking at yourself is probably one of the most important skills to develop when learning to dress well. For me, this is one of the biggest takeaways from Manton's recent threads.
If the biggest hindrance to wearing an oxford is laces, SE Asia might be in worst shape than western Canada.
Not sure if I agree that untucking is the best way to pull off a shirt without the jacket but as it is there, it is also the uniform here. Shirt with a collar (used liberally) some sort of khaki or dress pant. If I wear a jacket (which I do a couple of times a week) I will get looks. If I wear a tie and a jacket, I will get comments. Not severe scrutiny so much as the general ribbing that accompanies the general public trying to alleviate their inner guilt to dress sloppy.
I've always hated business casual with a pasion. so, thinking of what you wore in San Fran, and what you wrote to start the thread, I understand that the correct take is
1. striped or colored BD shirt
2. fabric belt
4. brown shoes, possibly boat type shoes?
is that about right? can you give us some guidance as to the right way ?
If I had to do business casual, I would dress no differently than I do on weekends and holidays when I have to look semi nice. Basically, I only have three speeds.
1) Classic tailored jacket & tie
2) ratty chinos/shorts + cal or wharf to whart or cactus league t-shirt
3) tailored odd trousers + BD (OCBD for cold weather, linen for warm).
So, I would do #3, with loafers or bucks.
Yeap, slippers are big here, people are that lazy and they are proud of it. Havaianas makes big bucks. Hence when these people go to work they opt for those Aldo or Bata black rubber-soled duck bill loafers.
I dressed business casual all the time as a lawyer. That just meant odd jacket and tie instead of a full-on suit.
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