The Watch Appreciation Thread - Part two (Rolex, Patek Philippe, Audemars Piguet, Jaeger LeCoultre,

[am55]

Nothing better than a communist poet lamenting Lenin's death to write ad copy that Rolex could use 100 years later. The copyright is almost certainly expired. But until the AD has a Rolex GMT available, I guess I will continue to be part of the Richemont trash attached to the side of the (Rolex/Patek) craft.

"...The son
Of Macedonian Philip had ere these
Won Asia, and the throne of Cyrus held
At his dispose; young Scipio had brought down
The Carthaginian pride; young Pompey quelled
The Pontic king, and in triumph' had rode.
Yet years, and to ripe years judgment mature,
Quench not the thirst of glory, but augment.
Great Julius, whom now all the world admires,
The more he grew in years, the more inflamed
With glory, wept that he had lived so long
Inglorious. But thou yet art not too late."

 

[Newcomer]

I've been thinking seriously of a picking up a Patek 5205G in the original two-tone silver dial recently. And it got me thinking about the overall direction of Patek as a brand. Personally, the 5205 and its brethren are for me the best recent Patek watches. They are modern yet timeless versions to me of what a Patek watch should be. Whereas watches that use the 96 style case or Breguet numerals, while beautiful, are uninteresting (having owned one that feature both). Same goes for a classic minute repeater. I'd rather have a futuristic JLC minute repeater similar in aesthetic to that JLC chrono another member posted a few pages back.

I think with some of the more recent Patek models like the 5522, 5226, or 6007, they've done OK, but none really feel like a truly modern version of a Patek to me. The 5226 is such a mishmash especially with that Clous de Paris midband. It's like Patek merged elements of the AP Code 11:59 (the octagon midband) with Hamilton numerals (joking, but not joking?).

Would appreciate thoughts from @Newcomer or any other Patek fans or owners. I think I can piece together where Foo will come out given his previous posting so no need to flame me, bud.

I don't think this same criticism applies to Rolex who unapologetically makes tiny changes year after year to great fanfare and lament.

In my view, the 5205 is one of the best watches introduced by Patek in the past decade or longer under, perhaps, six figures. I think the 5230P and 5231J/G are some of the other great watches in the, ahem, introductory price range. However, I agree that the 5205 is the greatest candidate for "truly modern version of a Patek" that you speak of.

Otherwise, I share your perspective. A lot of the current catalogue does not excite me very much. I think they have fully transitioned to the age of Thierry and, in my view, he has not fully hit his stride or reached his apex. Personally, I am excited/interested to see where he goes, because I believe his vision is different from his father's vision, but I am not certain that his vision is fully realized (personally, I think there was a shift in Patek starting in 2015, with the Pilot's watch - but I do not believe that shift is complete). I do not know if any watch released in the last decade is destined to be an all-time great - but maybe that perspective will change in time. By way of example, a PC and PCC is on the dream list for me, but I would not purchase this generation of PC or PCC.

I wonder, however, if this feeling is spurred by our miopic view of the current catalogue. Not all Pateks are destined to be Greats - in fact, over the past 30-40 years, there are not very many "Great" references. There are some fantastic watches, certainly, but an all-time classic will not be released every year, year after year. I also think, just like the watch industry on the whole, that drop culture, and the expectation of numerous yearly novelties, means that there is less time to develop novel watches that are well-designed. I am sure that there is considerable design fatigue. I would be fascinated to see what the watch industry would look like if the companies were not expected to churn out novelties year-after-year - and instead, released novelties when an idea was fully baked. We all know this, but you see similar fatigue with designers.

Personally, I do like the 5226, but you are right that it does not feel like a "truly modern version of a Patek". I am not sure what it feels like. I really expected to hate it, and wanted to hate it, but it is nonetheless pretty awesome in the flesh.

Rolex, particularly in the last 20-30 years, has become an extremely iterative company. Patek, however, does not feel nearly as iterative. I cannot tell if this is a recent phenomena, or whether Patek has always been nonrepetitive.

I am a Patek fan but I am also a difficult customer of Patek. I love their watches, and the brand is very impressive, but I am not an unabashed fanboy who believes Patek takes no missteps.

 

[Newcomer]

Shifting gears entirely, I saw this come up on ACM - I struggle to understand the appeal of FPJ at current prices (if I could get one, I would love to buy an FPJ and I do respect the brand), but $1.2 million for something with a dial printing mistake, this is craziness. The finishing of the dial is rough.

 

[Scuppers]

Whether you end up practicing law or otherwise, you’ve got a talent for understatement. And fine taste In watches. If I recall you were also looking at that gorgeous Tank Normale with the bracelet. Good luck in your studies. Upon passing the bar or whatever it’s called in your jurisdiction, you can gleefully join the ranks of the many degenerate lawyers on this thread. Most of whom seemingly don’t work very hard. And I don’t even frequent other corners of this forum.

Have degrees in Economics; Engineering; & Physics. On top of which, MSC Eng; & Phd in Physics. Studies are my work (Well, hobby).
And thanks, Chocomallo.

 

[Scuppers]

In my view, the 5205 is one of the best watches introduced by Patek in the past decade or longer under, perhaps, six figures. I think the 5230P and 5231J/G are some of the other great watches in the, ahem, introductory price range. However, I agree that the 5205 is the greatest candidate for "truly modern version of a Patek" that you speak of.

Otherwise, I share your perspective. A lot of the current catalogue does not excite me very much. I think they have fully transitioned to the age of Thierry and, in my view, he has not fully hit his stride or reached his apex. Personally, I am excited/interested to see where he goes, because I believe his vision is different from his father's vision, but I am not certain that his vision is fully realized (personally, I think there was a shift in Patek starting in 2015, with the Pilot's watch - but I do not believe that shift is complete). I do not know if any watch released in the last decade is destined to be an all-time great - but maybe that perspective will change in time. By way of example, a PC and PCC is on the dream list for me, but I would not purchase this generation of PC or PCC.

I wonder, however, if this feeling is spurred by our miopic view of the current catalogue. Not all Pateks are destined to be Greats - in fact, over the past 30-40 years, there are not very many "Great" references. There are some fantastic watches, certainly, but an all-time classic will not be released every year, year after year. I also think, just like the watch industry on the whole, that drop culture, and the expectation of numerous yearly novelties, means that there is less time to develop novel watches that are well-designed. I am sure that there is considerable design fatigue. I would be fascinated to see what the watch industry would look like if the companies were not expected to churn out novelties year-after-year - and instead, released novelties when an idea was fully baked. We all know this, but you see similar fatigue with designers.

Personally, I do like the 5226, but you are right that it does not feel like a "truly modern version of a Patek". I am not sure what it feels like. I really expected to hate it, and wanted to hate it, but it is nonetheless pretty awesome in the flesh.

Rolex, particularly in the last 20-30 years, has become an extremely iterative company. Patek, however, does not feel nearly as iterative. I cannot tell if this is a recent phenomena, or whether Patek has always been nonrepetitive.

I am a Patek fan but I am also a difficult customer of Patek. I love their watches, and the brand is very impressive, but I am not an unabashed fanboy who believes Patek takes no missteps.

5205 is a beaut. 38mm would of made it a must own.

 

[Texasmade]

Have degrees in Economics; Engineering; & Physics. On top of which, MSC Eng; & Phd in Physics. Studies are my work (Well, hobby).
And thanks, Chocomallo.

Did you ever get a real job or just study forever?

 

[smittycl]

Have degrees in Economics; Engineering; & Physics. On top of which, MSC Eng; & Phd in Physics. Studies are my work (Well, hobby).
And thanks, Chocomallo.

and lots of empty wall space just begging for more diplomas?

 

[Scuppers]

Shifting gears entirely, I saw this come up on ACM - I struggle to understand the appeal of FPJ at current prices (if I could get one, I would love to buy an FPJ and I do respect the brand), but $1.2 million for something with a dial printing mistake, this is craziness. The finishing of the dial is rough.

View attachment 1810046

Was it you that posted a series of questions regarding current and past aspirations (10yrs)?
if it was, and to whomever it was, this F.P. Journe was on my “if only” 10 year ago watch list.
Yup, finishing is rather rubbish, across the board with journe, but the insight would of been priceless!

 

[Scuppers]

Did you ever get a real job or just study forever?

LMAO! Worked from 25 to 33. BTW, thats years of age. Not the 1900s.

 

[Newcomer]

5205 is a beaut. 38mm would of made it a must own.

You know, the 5205 in 40mm, in my opinion, is about as small as I would want to go. It wears way smaller than 40mm. I'd be curious to know what the dial measures (as opposed to dial and case). The biggest impediment to wearing this watch is the lugs. The lugs are super long, pushing the L2L close to 50mm.

If I could redesign the watch, I'd make the lugs a little shorter.

Fortunately, my wrist is just big enough that it is not an issue.

Was it you that posted a series of questions regarding current and past aspirations (10yrs)?
if it was, and to whomever it was, this F.P. Journe was on my “if only” 10 year ago watch list.
Yup, finishing is rather rubbish, across the board with journe, but the insight would of been priceless!

Yes, that was me. Yeah, I wish I had jumped on several FPJ, if only so I could unload them and be a millionaire.

 

[Scuppers]

Furthering your point @Newcomer re: Thierry, appointing his wife to the head of creative has proven a less than masterful stroke. Hindering his own legacy as-well as the brands.

 

[Newcomer]

Furthering your point @Newcomer re: Thierry, appointing his wife to the head of creative has proven a less than masterful stroke. Hindering his own legacy as-well as the brands.

Does she remain in that role? I thought T&S divorced.

 

[Scuppers]

Does she remain in that role? I thought T&S divorced.

Actually, thats a good question. It was certainly never announced in th PP Mag/newsletter! However, whether she does or not, the tracks were laid by her. Sandrine blew up decades of doctorine in her approach to modernising PP. Unsuccessfully, IMO.

 

[Neville Southall]

If you want to stay in your wife’s good books, don’t forget to take out the trash!

View attachment 1809983

What’s worse - a two tone Cartier or an Invicta? It’s close.

 

[AeneasQuebecois]

If you want to stay in your wife’s good books, don’t forget to take out the trash!

View attachment 1809983

I usually do not like two-tone, but that is honestly quite attractive.