The Watch Appreciation Thread - Part two (Rolex, Patek Philippe, Audemars Piguet, Jaeger LeCoultre,

[Newcomer]

Nice! Although I’m not sure about the fit of that western…

The brushed bracelet is v good.

 

[TheFoo]

Nice! Although I’m not sure about the fit of that western…

The brushed bracelet is v good.

Ha, just a denim shirt, not western style.

Yes, this watch should have come fully brushed from the factory. It encourages one to wear it more like a trusty tool and less like a precious luxury item.

 

[Dino944]

Wearing my Cartier Privé Asymmetrique to close out the weekend.

That's a beauty!

 

[Dino944]

I don’t 100% agree. Yes, watch nerds have long acknowledged the importance of the model, but thinking back to Timezone days in the late 90’s and early 00’s, they also viewed it as an ugly, dated design and considered Genta more of a curious footnote than a celebrated designer. Similar story with the Royal Oak.

It wasn’t until after ~2015 that things shifted decisively the other way.

Back in the early 2000s and for decades prior to that, it was considered by Patek collectors to be an ugly entry level Patek. The same of the Aquanaut when those were released. They came out with an MSRP of about $3,000 less than the Nautilus when they were first released, and they became the uglier entry level Patek.

Things started changing for the Nautilus when the 3712A/1 came out and there were rumors Patek wasn't going to make any more steel watches, which we all know was false. However, that is when people started to view the Nautilus differently and demand increased and speculators jumped on them. Even after finding out the rumor wasn't true people's perception of the Nautilus was dramatically different....although insane pricing on the 5711 and 5712A/1 was a more recent phenomena.

 

[Omega Male]

Table next to us at dinner last night (on the patio) was a fit and well-preserved older couple -- I'd say he was 70ish and she was early 60s. He was wearing a 5711 and she had what looked like a CPCP platinum Ronde de Cartier. I was wearing my Nautilus too and, as we were getting up to leave, he clocked it and we did the bro nod. That's what it's all about right?

 

[Neville Southall]

Table next to us at dinner last night (on the patio) was a fit and well-preserved older couple -- I'd say he was 70ish and she was early 60s. He was wearing a 5711 and she had what looked like a CPCP platinum Ronde de Cartier. I was wearing my Nautilus too and, as we were getting up to leave, he clocked it and we did the bro nod. That's what it's all about right?

I mean, I wouldn’t know. I don’t own a 5711, but maybe one day I’ll be that cool.

 

[Deeky]

Ive always liked the Aquanaut and detested the Nautilus. Somehow the Naut looks extremely dated to me, and my mental image of its owner tends to be a conservative guy in his 50s to 60s.

The Aquanaut I would happily buy at retail once this craze (if ever) dies down

 

[Drek Galloche]

Ive always liked the Aquanaut and detested the Nautilus. Somehow the Naut looks extremely dated to me, and my mental image of its owner tends to be a conservative guy in his 50s to 60s.

The Aquanaut I would happily buy at retail once this craze (if ever) dies down

This craze will be over just in time for your 60th birthday.

 

[TheFoo]

Ive always liked the Aquanaut and detested the Nautilus. Somehow the Naut looks extremely dated to me, and my mental image of its owner tends to be a conservative guy in his 50s to 60s.

The Aquanaut I would happily buy at retail once this craze (if ever) dies down

This craze will be over just in time for your 60th birthday.

I actually dropped by Watches of Switzerland at Hudson Yards yesterday with my family to get out of the heat.

First of all, I am such proud dada. Upon entering the store, my 5-year-old daughter pointed at the Patek and Rolex signs and exclaimed: “They have Patek watches and also Rolex! Let’s look at Patek first!”

There were very few Pateks to look at. Obviously, there were no Nautilus or Aquanaut models, but also nothing else other than a few ladies watches. No Calatravas, no smaller complications (annual calendars, travel time, etc.), nothing. Ninety percent of the display slots were empty. This was true last time I was at Wempe in midtown and the Soho Watches of Switzerland as well. Point is, Pateks in general are running scarce.

The Rolex section was even more ridiculous. All slots were empty except for TWO watches, including a 34mm rose gold Datejust. I don’t remember the other, but it was also a smaller ladies model.

Every other brand’s display area was fully-loaded (e.g. Vacheron, Omega, IWC, JLC, etc.). They had like six Speedmaster moon watches ready for purchase, including a couple of the outgoing version.

In some ways, this is to be expected. Perhaps, the broader watch consumer market is simply catching up to more serious collectors, who began heavily consolidating their collections on Patek and Rolex about ~10 years ago. Before then, it was more common for enthusiasts to dabble across the different makers. These days, it’s Patek, Rolex, independents, or you’re a beginner.

Will this change? For reasons discussed before, Patek and Rolex have unique appeal to collectors. The other brands from Richemont and LVMH tend to feel a lot more anonymous and luxury consumerist oriented. Hard to put a finger on exactly why, but one key element is that their marketing tends to feel a lot more forced and their watches feel a lot more influenced by marketing. In contrast, Patek and Rolex exude somewhat of a “we don’t give a **** what you want” attitude. This reflects their conservativism and reinforces an aura of permanence.

In short, increasingly few people have concentrated collections of watches from the likes of IWC or JLC or even Lange. People who buy those watches tend to be more casual about collecting or will never buy more than one or two. Anecdotally, most of my friends and co-workers who have nice watches from such brands tend to have only that single watch, aren’t serious enthusiasts, and usually bought it because they saw an ad or think the brand is “cool”.

Given the underlying drivers, the current trend toward market bifurcation may be more secular than cyclical, unfortunately.

 

[am55]

I'm waiting for one of the consumerist oriented brands to create a watch that is also a bitcoin wallet and that displays how many bitcoins are in it.

 

[mebiuspower]

I'm waiting for one of the consumerist oriented brands to create a watch that is also a bitcoin wallet and that displays how many bitcoins are in it.

That's TPG and Kevin O'Leary's special project watch...

 

[Deeky]

I dropped by multiple stores in Singapore, and there is pretty much nothing in steel from any brand. Singapore's market is so insane that it's basically impossible to get any desirable steel watches from any high end brand with an established history without huge pre-spending (above $100k).

We have 19 Rolex boutiques in an area 1/4 the size of London, and not one has anything other than TT DJs. Cant even buy a 36/41mm DJ/OP in any colour with the purchase of a TT ladies' model.

The GS white birch has a 1 year backorder. VC has stopped taking orders for any Overseas regardless of colour. Even the Octo Finissimo blue dial is on backorder, Zenith's Chronomaster sport is on 3-6 months backorder. Cartier steel watches are now at 3-7% discount if at all (25% was the standard pre-covid). Nothing at PP/AP (no surprise, but buying a perpetual from patek is not enough to get on a waiting list for an Aquanaut, buying a chrono 11.59 is also not enough to get on a waitlist for 37/41mm ROs).

Sometimes I really despise living here, because from reddit posts you can see people from US/EU getting Overseas/hot GS models just by walking in. 36mm OPs (not in blue) also seem possible in certain areas

 

[Texasmade]

I actually dropped by Watches of Switzerland at Hudson Yards yesterday with my family to get out of the heat.

First of all, I am such proud dada. Upon entering the store, my 5-year-old daughter pointed at the Patek and Rolex signs and exclaimed: “They have Patek watches and also Rolex! Let’s look at Patek first!”

There were very few Pateks to look at. Obviously, there were no Nautilus or Aquanaut models, but also nothing else other than a few ladies watches. No Calatravas, no smaller complications (annual calendars, travel time, etc.), nothing. Ninety percent of the display slots were empty. This was true last time I was at Wempe in midtown and the Soho Watches of Switzerland as well. Point is, Pateks in general are running scarce.

The Rolex section was even more ridiculous. All slots were empty except for TWO watches, including a 34mm rose gold Datejust. I don’t remember the other, but it was also a smaller ladies model.

Every other brand’s display area was fully-loaded (e.g. Vacheron, Omega, IWC, JLC, etc.). They had like six Speedmaster moon watches ready for purchase, including a couple of the outgoing version.

In some ways, this is to be expected. Perhaps, the broader watch consumer market is simply catching up to more serious collectors, who began heavily consolidating their collections on Patek and Rolex about ~10 years ago. Before then, it was more common for enthusiasts to dabble across the different makers. These days, it’s Patek, Rolex, independents, or you’re a beginner.

Will this change? For reasons discussed before, Patek and Rolex have unique appeal to collectors. The other brands from Richemont and LVMH tend to feel a lot more anonymous and luxury consumerist oriented. Hard to put a finger on exactly why, but one key element is that their marketing tends to feel a lot more forced and their watches feel a lot more influenced by marketing. In contrast, Patek and Rolex exude somewhat of a “we don’t give a **** what you want” attitude. This reflects their conservativism and reinforces an aura of permanence.

In short, increasingly few people have concentrated collections of watches from the likes of IWC or JLC or even Lange. People who buy those watches tend to be more casual about collecting or will never buy more than one or two. Anecdotally, most of my friends and co-workers who have nice watches from such brands tend to have only that single watch, aren’t serious enthusiasts, and usually bought it because they saw an ad or think the brand is “cool”.

Given the underlying drivers, the current trend toward market bifurcation may be more secular than cyclical, unfortunately.

Yeah, I was there the weekend before. The Patek section was a joke and the Rolex section was an even bigger joke. It's like what's the point to have that much Rolex floor space dedicated to 2 or 3 watches.

Also tbf, the fully loaded Vacheron section was like 4 watches. I remember there was a 1921 and a CdV on the wall display case but don't remember what was in the floor display.

 

[TheFoo]

I dropped by multiple stores in Singapore, and there is pretty much nothing in steel from any brand. Singapore's market is so insane that it's basically impossible to get any desirable steel watches from any high end brand with an established history without huge pre-spending (above $100k).

We have 19 Rolex boutiques in an area 1/4 the size of London, and not one has anything other than TT DJs. Cant even buy a 36/41mm DJ/OP in any colour with the purchase of a TT ladies' model.

The GS white birch has a 1 year backorder. VC has stopped taking orders for any Overseas regardless of colour. Even the Octo Finissimo blue dial is on backorder, Zenith's Chronomaster sport is on 3-6 months backorder. Cartier steel watches are now at 3-7% discount if at all (25% was the standard pre-covid). Nothing at PP/AP (no surprise, but buying a perpetual from patek is not enough to get on a waiting list for an Aquanaut, buying a chrono 11.59 is also not enough to get on a waitlist for 37/41mm ROs).

Sometimes I really despise living here, because from reddit posts you can see people from US/EU getting Overseas/hot GS models just by walking in. 36mm OPs (not in blue) also seem possible in certain areas

Who in the US is doing better than this? Sounds like same situation, except with respect to GS.

 

[Deeky]

Who in the US is doing better than this? Sounds like same situation, except with respect to GS.

From what I've read (reddit, rolexforums, watchuseek etc), Bvlgari is ready stock, GS is ready stock, Chronomaster is ready stock, VC Overseas can be bought (as long as one is not aiming for a blue dial, and apparently some ADs/boutiques are still willing to take deposits for a blue dial), and getting a 11.59 chrono should also land you on a waiting list for 37/41mm ROs (not blue dials).

This is a pretty big diff from here, where basically everything is on backorder with a 6 month - 1 year wait (even LVMH brands) or just outright impossible without massive purchase histories/bundling.