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The Watch Appreciation Thread - Part two (Rolex, Patek Philippe, Audemars Piguet, Jaeger LeCoultre,

Discussion in 'Classic Menswear' started by mimo, Feb 12, 2016.

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  1. Nikolaus

    Nikolaus Well-Known Member

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    I like your approach.
    Speaking about substance watches, which ones would be your preference?

    Classical design is not the same as boring; usually the most boring watches are some modern pieces that are attractive at first since a novelty, when the novelty wares off they become wearing on the nerves and then irritating.

    Speaking about the engraved Patek Philippe: (not that I would put it on my wrist, still beautiful as a collection item)
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: May 27, 2016
  2. Keith T

    Keith T Well-Known Member

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    Last edited: May 27, 2016
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  3. Brian SD

    Brian SD Well-Known Member

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    Winter is coming.
     
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  4. Nikolaus

    Nikolaus Well-Known Member

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    actually summer is hitting hard as of yesterday; 30°C.
     
  5. mimo

    mimo Well-Known Member

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    Pansy. 43 for me. Should I consider a linen dial?
     
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  6. Dino944

    Dino944 Well-Known Member

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    I think even watches designed with substance being a primary concern need some element of design that goes beyond substance/function (although, I'm not sure I'd call it design for show). If everything were purely for function, we would probably have a very limited choice of watches, or some very bland pieces. For me the right watches tend to have some design for substance, perhaps some design for show, and maybe a bit of history in the mix.

    Just speaking generally, if one were looking for watches of substance for less money than Patek, AP, VC, or Lange, there are plenty of new and pre-owed options from JLC, Omega, and Rolex, just to name a few. Although, I don't own one yet, I've always been a bit fan of JLC's Reverso. Which if one considers it, started out as a design with a specific purpose in mind, a rugged design that protected its crystal for polo players...yet today, its design is often favored for its art deco style, and for many although its history is one of a sports watch it has crossed over into being a dress watch (depending on the model).

    I agree classical design is not the same as boring. In fact some of my favorite watch designs have been around for many decades or are based on designs from the past. In my own collection the 2 pieces with the youngest origins of design were originally produced 40+ years ago, and the oldest design for a watch in my collection is approaching 100 years.

    I am a firm believer that Patek makes a great product! My father has owned a few over the last 30 years, so its a familiar brand to me. I appreciate their history, and they have produced some really amazing complications, and some lovely time only pieces. However, short of some of their more complicated pieces, I've often struggled to find a design that really spoke to me (although maybe as a watch addict, that means I'm defective [​IMG]). Early on one of my goals as a collector was to have at least 1 piece from each of great houses. However, that hasn't happened as I've purchased more than one piece from some brands and none from others. I suppose sometimes the focus of our collections change. When I've had the opportunity to purchase Pateks, I've always gone with something else. Not because of issues with quality, resale, or cost (although in recent years I think their prices have been harder to justify)...but because at the time I just didn't love the designs that were available. Hopefully, some day I will find just the right piece and add it to my collection, but if not, I'm sure other manufacturers will console that empty part of my collection by offering some other horological temptress.
     
    Last edited: May 28, 2016
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  7. dan'l

    dan'l Well-Known Member

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    @Dino944, some great insights into the Lange 1 discussion and we share many of the same opinions, though you expressed yourself so much more eloquently. :)

    I thought that one of the 1815 models would be my first Lange, but I am getting draw back to the L1. Actually, I've liked it in the past, but sort of discounted it, since it is slightly out of my price range. Plus, if a watch has a date function, I would prefer it to be an automatic. I am such a fickle person!

    Anyways, I read a bit more about the L1 and learned that the case has screwed-on lugs. Never heard of this "feature" before and found it interesting. I guess the idea is that the lugs can be removed in order to polish the case. Not sure how I feel about it, in the sense if it would matter to me that the lugs are not integral to the case. Anyone know if the other ALS models also have screwed-on lugs?
     
  8. Nikolaus

    Nikolaus Well-Known Member

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    Wonderful post! [​IMG]

    as for designs that started with a purpose, the "dive" watches are my absolute favorite since they have that ceramic bezel (that makes away with the metallic rim). Actually I adore the ceramic bezels :D
    For everyday wear I was looking at Blancpain, however, their "history" coupled with their modern marketing positioning has put me a little off; not to mention their lack of innovation (as we can see with Rolex lately). No matter the marketing effort they're putting behind, there is a huge substance hole.
    Omega is more product oriented.

    Patek Philippe, yes high level coupled with over inflated prices as of late (Chinese market bubble). I totally agree; their high end pieces are something to collect, however I personally cannot imagine putting on my wrist their current main line collection.

    I like A. Lange und Söhne a lot; especially how they adorn the mechanism; the dials are however really flat and uninspiring.
    This one is nice to look at: [​IMG]
     
  9. Dino944

    Dino944 Well-Known Member

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    Thank you, and I'm glad you enjoyed my post. Its always nice to share thoughts on watches with like minded people.

    The 1815 is a great watch and I've met many people that really have enjoyed owning them. However, if your heart is pulling you toward the L1, maybe you need to save up a bit longer, and see whether it is a possibility.

    Yes, there are other models from Lange with lugs screwed on, but I don't know if that is true of all of their watches. Personally, I have no issue with the lugs being screwed on as it allows for greater precision, should one choose to have a watch case refinished. Also, as the lugs are substantial and curve along with the case, and are very sturdy compared to when non-integrated lugs are merely soldered on to a case. You are probably already aware that many watch lugs are not "Integral" to the case and are merely welded/soldered on to it. As many here know, I would never consider Patek 5119 (or any Patek) with that style of lug/case design as I have personally seen one that was bumped against something solid and the lug broke right off of the watch. My local AD told me he had seen that happen with that style of Patek in the past (hence if looking at round Pateks, I'd be looking for a case more along the design of the 5115 where the lugs are part of the case).

    Wishing you luck with whatever you decide.[​IMG]
     
  10. Dino944

    Dino944 Well-Known Member

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    Thanks! Yes, I like diving watches also. Its another example of a purpose designed watch that has become mainstream. They tend to be a great choice for active people as they can be worn for almost any activity or event, other than when one may really want a true dress watch.

    Blancpain, makes a very nice product, but for what they cost there is almost always something else I would rather own. Not to mention, I do not like the Bathyscaphe, which I find very generic looking. Around here, BP is a very tough watch to sell, or resell. Most of my former local ADs were discounting them heavily as they just couldn't move them, and eventually they stopped carrying BP.

    I like GO products, provided its not the Pano model, which I won't go into here, as many people here already know of my lack of love for that model. However, they do make great products that are very competitively priced. Cheers!
     
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  11. mimo

    mimo Well-Known Member

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    They are priced competitively after the inevitable 30 per cent discount.
     
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  12. Dino944

    Dino944 Well-Known Member

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    Yes, I wouldn't pay retail for one, but after a discount some of their pieces are reasonably priced.
     
  13. Keith T

    Keith T Well-Known Member

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    I keep telling myself (and you guys): one of these days they're going to bring the 50 Fathoms down to a more reasonable size, right? If that thing was more like 40-42mm I would be all over it.

    And I know the Bathyscaphe gets a lot of love, but it's never done anything for me, either. (Though I think generic-looking might be harsh, dino :happy: )

    To me, it's mainly just that the hour markers seem too small for the dial space, and I find the bezel a bit thin as well. But personally, I kinda like the hands and the dial itself. And when I tried one on at the AD, I was also impressed with the quality of the NATO-style strap. It was a big step up from some of the cheaper ones that I have used over the years (and still frequently employ).

    Also, just to keep it real... that piece is probably over-priced by a considerable margin vs. say, a Sub or Planet Ocean (to name a couple).

    Having said all that, would welcome any owners' thoughts or impressions after some reasonable amount of wrist time.
     
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  14. Nikolaus

    Nikolaus Well-Known Member

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    it they would bring it down to 43-44mm it would be quite acceptable; instead of that current satellite dish :))

    the "generic" looks of Bathyscaphe are exactly the reason why I did not get it :)) I like the thinner case of it compared to other dive watches; this was the prime reason I gave it a look. The Rolex and Omega dive-watches are too massive; I'm buying a watch not a thick protruding bracelet.
    The new Master Planet Ocean (market start in August) should be better; great mechanism coupled with a new case size.
     
  15. mimo

    mimo Well-Known Member

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    But all of Rolex's divers are smaller than 44mm, and can be worn on a strap...is a Submariner ever wrong? And the Planet Ocean comes in 42mm as well as 45mm anyway, doesn't it?

    I'm still very taken by the Tudor Black Bay in its (modern) original burgundy form, and a pretty reasonable price too that seems to have dropped another ten per cent (used) since the black one came out.

    Perhaps if you want something in the Bathyscaphe price range that's a bit more individual, you might want to look at the JLC Deep Sea Chronograph. About the right size, very good looking and on a cool strap.
     
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  16. Nikolaus

    Nikolaus Well-Known Member

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    For me Tudor is a Rolex spin-off; or how to make money with less substance. I'm not saying Tudor is not a great watch, it's just that I would go for the original (Rolex).
    Rolex Submariner is a fantastic product; if only it would be a fraction bigger (42 or 43mm; thus having a bigger dial compared to the massive bracelet). Second thing; I love transparent backs, to see the mechanism :D after all, I'm buying a mechanical watch :))

    I very much dislike chronographs; I find them littered and totally without function.
     
    Last edited: May 29, 2016
  17. OmarDubaibanker

    OmarDubaibanker Well-Known Member

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    Guys thoughts on the Tudor Bronze? Being offered it from jewelers for just over 2k GBP which is a great price! Comes with canvas and leather strap
     
  18. mimo

    mimo Well-Known Member

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    It is a good price, but I do have a couple of issues with the bronze: making the dial and the bezel brown, plus the unusual case, plus the unusual strap, and the size inflation...it's perhaps one or two steps too many at the same time. I like the idea of a bronze BB a lot. But this feels just a shade overdone. Bronze also makes me think Helson, which isn't a bad thing, or Archimede, or something. Perhaps that's just me.

    I don't hate it, and I almost really like it, but I'd have to give it a wrist test first and I think $2k for a mint used red or blue BB looks like better value.
     
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  19. mimo

    mimo Well-Known Member

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    Tudor is a third of the price, and the size you want. But I get you on the "Rolex but not" thing - it's why I can't quite love the Pelagos, or even the great-looking BB Black. The red one sings to me as being more its own man. The one Rolex that meets your spec is the Deep Sea then, with a bracelet considered by some to be too small for its larger case. No looking inside though.

    But, I think this is an interesting challenge: apart from the Bathyscaphe, I'm struggling to think of a diver with a transparent case back - an inherent contradiction in engineering terms, but I can empathise with your desire to reconcile it. Still leading back to a 42mm Planet Ocean then? $3800 new, available on a strap...what else?

    OK, now I'm looking:

    Tissot Seastar (man that's cheap!)
    PAM 392? Love that 1950 case.
     
    Last edited: May 29, 2016
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  20. Nikolaus

    Nikolaus Well-Known Member

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    now you have motivated me to look through the offer; actually I've got so hungry doing it, I need a snack now :D :)) (it's 11:17 AM here)
     

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