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Stylish Dinosaur
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Cartier is coming out with some exciting new technology actually. In the pipeline is a method for creating fire from rubbing two sticks together.
But ... they ARE diamond pavé sticks!
 

Newcomer

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I have sincerely enjoyed the in-house movement discussion. I may be a little tardy to the discussion, but I wanted to offer my 2c.

I think the proliferation and focus on so-called in-house movements is annoying at best, and disingenuous at worst. The vast majority of "in-house" movements are either ETA-clones, or purchased via some sort of exclusivity agreement with another manufacturer, or are made in-part in-house, or are made through some subsidiary that the manufacturer owns a part of, or are shared among brands within the same umbrella, etc. The whole dog-and-pony-show kind of absurd. And, for in-house movements in the, say, $2,000 - $10,000 range, many of these movements are not as reliable or accurate or easy-to-service as an ETA or other standard movement. I'll take a slightly modified ETA that is accurate -4/+6 over an "in-house" movement that is not COSC-certified and needs to be sent back to the manufacturer.

Further, of the in-house movements that are made, a lot of them are way, way, way too thick. I just do not understand this phenomena - it is like they are designed to look pretty through a case back instead of fit comfortably. The B01 movement is absolutely massive. All of the Omega movements are also absolutely massive. New =/= better if it is not as wearable, IMO. Give me a svelte off-the-rack movement any day of the week.

Really, the only time I care about in-house v. outsourced is in the Patek/VC/Lange/AP range, and I am still fine with an outsourced movement as long as it fits the case and design of the watch. Where I draw the line is using an outsourced movement that does not fit the case / impedes design.
 

Viral

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In-house or not, doesn't really sway me all that much. If I was dropping serious money (like $20k plus) on a watch, I would expect that the movement was beautiful, but otherwise as long as it's a quality movement I'm not all that worried either way.

What *does* bother me though is when brands stick a basic/common movement in a watch and then still charge a bundle for it. I realize there are different levels of ETAs for example, but they're still basically the same. Why would I buy a watch for $3k with an ETA or Sellita when there are equally attractive options at under $1k with the same movement?
What bothers me is the fact that steel watches are pushing over $20K for no merit-based reason. Shit, the submariner will be over $10K in less than 5 years for essentially the same watch when it sold for $5K less
 

jamesnyc

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Hi gents, just out of curiosity, how hard to get Rolex batman from boutique these days? Is it much harder than before due to shortage of production?
 

sinnedk

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Hi gents, just out of curiosity, how hard to get Rolex batman from boutique these days? Is it much harder than before due to shortage of production?
AD game is a joke these days. But you can go buy a date just or whatever is on the counter and put name down on waitlist then see what happens. I would be surprised if you get a call before 1 year.
 

brax

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Hi gents, just out of curiosity, how hard to get Rolex batman from boutique these days? Is it much harder than before due to shortage of production?
I had to resort to the grey market of sorts (Monaco Legends auction) to get mine. It’s pretty darn tough to get from AD.
P.S. Through my own damn fault, the watch was stolen after less than six months on my wrist.
 

Journeyman

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What *does* bother me though is when brands stick a basic/common movement in a watch and then still charge a bundle for it. I realize there are different levels of ETAs for example, but they're still basically the same. Why would I buy a watch for $3k with an ETA or Sellita when there are equally attractive options at under $1k with the same movement?
I suppose the answer is that an ETA movement is not always just an ETA (or Sellita etc) movement.

ETA and other such suppliers sell "ebauches" to watch companies. They can be supplied with various levels of finishing and, of course, the higher the level of finishing, the higher the price per ebauche. Brands also add finishing and individual touches to movements - upgrading some of the components, decorating or 'skeletonising' some of the parts and so on.

So, as a result, simply because one watch has an ETA movement, it doesn't mean that it should be the same price as another watch that has an ETA movement, because the latter movement may have had multiple parts upgraded and considerable time spent on decoration.

To give a really extreme (and extremely rare) example, take a look at this IWC from 1993 - the movement is based upon the tried-and-tested Valjoux/ETA 7750 calibre, with much work to the basic, underlying movement:



Hi gents, just out of curiosity, how hard to get Rolex batman from boutique these days? Is it much harder than before due to shortage of production?
I don't think there's a shortage of production, as such, as Rolex still produces more watches than most other Swiss watch companies, churning out 900,000 or more watches per year. Only Swatch (as in the actual Swatch watches), Longines and Tissot make more. All other Swiss watchmakers are lower than Rolex by hundreds of thousands of units.

So the problem isn't Rolex's production - it's the ridiculous increase in demand over the past five or so years. I'd estimate that for every steel sports watch that a Rolex authorised dealer gets in the shop, they've probably got 30, 40 or more people who want to buy that watch.
 

bdavro23

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To me, the in-house movement debate is about value. Or said another way, what am I paying for? For a simple three hander, its hard for me to pay $4-10k for a steel watch that uses the same movement thats available in a Hamilton that sells for $650. I suppose there can be some level of movement decoration that will raise the value, but there is a limit to that.

As an aside, my wife got me a watch building class several years ago for my birthday and it was a lot of fun. It was much more difficult than I expected as well! In any event, you actually assemble the watch, case, dial, etc, and leave with an actual watch you can wear. The movement we used is the same movement used in some current Panerai watches, which has made it difficult for me to see Panerai as a viable purchase for me in the future. That might just be a perception thing for me, but perception of what you're getting for your money is kind of a big thing with watches.

Anyway, theres gonna be lots of opinions about this, so you can now add mine to the pile of things you dont care about :)
 

Phileas Fogg

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To me, the in-house movement debate is about value. Or said another way, what am I paying for? For a simple three hander, its hard for me to pay $4-10k for a steel watch that uses the same movement thats available in a Hamilton that sells for $650. I suppose there can be some level of movement decoration that will raise the value, but there is a limit to that.

As an aside, my wife got me a watch building class several years ago for my birthday and it was a lot of fun. It was much more difficult than I expected as well! In any event, you actually assemble the watch, case, dial, etc, and leave with an actual watch you can wear. The movement we used is the same movement used in some current Panerai watches, which has made it difficult for me to see Panerai as a viable purchase for me in the future. That might just be a perception thing for me, but perception of what you're getting for your money is kind of a big thing with watches.

Anyway, theres gonna be lots of opinions about this, so you can now add mine to the pile of things you dont care about :)
when Mercedes still made an E550, it used the same power plant as the S550.

Would you say the additional cost of the S class was superfluous given both cars used the same engine?
 

bdavro23

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when Mercedes still made an E550, it used the same power plant as the S550.

Would you say the additional cost of the S class was superfluous given both cars used the same engine?
I don't think this is even close to a valid comparison. Now, if you said the E550 had a Ford Duratec 2.0 engine, but MB was still charging $90k for it, that's a closer comparison.
 

brax

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sorry to hear that.May I ask how it was stolen from your wrist?
It wasn’t. I put it in the center console of my car (along with my wallet) when I was at the gym. Like a dumbass I forgot to take them out that night and, just my luck, someone broke into my car that night.
 

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