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clee1982

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so to follow up with that tank solo (now tank must?)

didn't know they made a solar version

"The light for the photovoltaic charging system reaches the movement through the dial – specifically, through the Roman numerals."

Additional Details: Photovoltaic charging system; expected life before requiring service, 16 years

though strap is non leather, some apple beats..., think I would want to change out that for her, too bad it's on stainless only, would think rosegold with brown strap would be good, but guess this solarbeat thing is only on stainless and with non leather strap...

 

Journeyman

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I think @Phileas Fogg hit a few of the issues that resonate with some people. Inhouse movements have become one of the biggest issues of the last 20 years. Prior to that, it was rather commonplace for most companies even the most respected brands such as PP, AP, VC, Rolex, etc were using movements from other companies and finishing/modifying them to their own standards.
Thank you to @Phileas Fogg @Dino944 @Kaplan @Ambulance Chaser and anyone else who chimed in, for your thoughtful responses.

I was actually being a bit tongue-in-cheek, as I already have strong views about the recent trend for in-house movements, so I was deliberately asking the question in the hope of eliciting some thoughtful responses - which it did!

Similar to Kaplan, I tend to prefer non-in-house movements or, at the very least, I am not swayed by in-house movements. This is particularly so with new ones that have been created due to the trend for in-house movements - many brands seem to think that they must use in-house movements so as to be thought of as a true, or proper, watch-maker and so they develop (or, probably more commonly, pay another company to develop) a movement.

Sites like Hodinkee have, I think, really been responsible for this push towards "in house = better/more authentic" and so a lot of people who are now collecting watches seem to parrot that line without really thinking about whether that is actually the case - and also without thinking about the implications of in-house movements.

As an example, I have a late 1990s Omega that has an ETA-based movement. It's a really reliable movement that has stood the test of time. I also have a Heuer Carrera with a Lemania chronograph movement. Once again, it's a reliable, commonly-used movement that has stood the test of time. Parts are commonly available and my local watchmaker can service the watches for a fraction of what Omega or TAG Heuer would charge - and in far less time, too. I'd far rather have a tried-and-tested movement that can be quickly and cheaply serviced and repaired, than a newly-developed movement without a time-tested reputation that has to go back to the dealer to service.

Of course, if I really, really liked a watch that had a recently-developed in-house movement, I may still buy it (although I tend to buy one watch per decade at my current rate, so that probably won't happen for a while!), but I certainly wouldn't buy it *because* it has an in-house movement. Rather, I'd buy it in spite of the in-house movement.

Anyway, that's just my view! Again, thanks for the responses.
 

Journeyman

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"The light for the photovoltaic charging system reaches the movement through the dial – specifically, through the Roman numerals."
I find it hilarious - although perhaps not surprising - that people are going crazy over a Cartier model that has this feature and hailing it as wonderful. Seiko introduced it to their range of dress watches about 20 years back, but I guess a $200 Seiko with that precise feature isn't as exciting or cool as a $4000 Cartier...

Another feature that both Seiko and Casio introduced for their quartz watches a couple of decades back was a "snooze" function to save battery power - if the watch was not moved for 30 minutes or an hour, the hands would stop moving, but the movement would still count the passing of time so when the owner picked up the watch again, days or weeks later, the hands would snap back to the correct time and carry on as before. Once again, that feature passed un-noticed by watch bloggers - but when FP Journe introduced the feature on a $13,000 quartz watch a few years back, it was marketed as a technological marvel!
 

Phileas Fogg

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^ that’s a great analysis.

I watch Formula 1. Formula 1 cars use parts and components made by many different sources. Team Red Bull does not make its own engine or its own tires. I’m not sure they could or would want to. I’m also unconvinced that if they did, they would project themselves into the winners circle with every race.

At some point, all of this in-house movement stuff becomes marketing. Sort of like “full canvassed” has become so with tailored clothing.
 

Phileas Fogg

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I find it hilarious - although perhaps not surprising - that people are going crazy over a Cartier model that has this feature and hailing it as wonderful. Seiko introduced it to their range of dress watches about 20 years back, but I guess a $200 Seiko with that precise feature isn't as exciting or cool as a $4000 Cartier...

Another feature that both Seiko and Casio introduced for their quartz watches a couple of decades back was a "snooze" function to save battery power - if the watch was not moved for 30 minutes or an hour, the hands would stop moving, but the movement would still count the passing of time so when the owner picked up the watch again, days or weeks later, the hands would snap back to the correct time and carry on as before. Once again, that feature passed un-noticed by watch bloggers - but when FP Journe introduced the feature on a $13,000 quartz watch a few years back, it was marketed as a technological marvel!
Cartier is coming out with some exciting new technology actually. In the pipeline is a method for creating fire from rubbing two sticks together.
 

Dino944

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I find it hilarious - although perhaps not surprising - that people are going crazy over a Cartier model that has this feature and hailing it as wonderful. Seiko introduced it to their range of dress watches about 20 years back, but I guess a $200 Seiko with that precise feature isn't as exciting or cool as a $4000 Cartier...

Another feature that both Seiko and Casio introduced for their quartz watches a couple of decades back was a "snooze" function to save battery power - if the watch was not moved for 30 minutes or an hour, the hands would stop moving, but the movement would still count the passing of time so when the owner picked up the watch again, days or weeks later, the hands would snap back to the correct time and carry on as before. Once again, that feature passed un-noticed by watch bloggers - but when FP Journe introduced the feature on a $13,000 quartz watch a few years back, it was marketed as a technological marvel!
I agree the "Inhouse mentality" of if its made in house they are a serious manufacturer or if made inhouse it must be better (something newbies fall for), is a relatively new phenomena. Would people say PP, AP, and VC were not serious manufacturers because they didn't always make the movements for every watch they produced?

Even in thinking about it, within my small collection, only about half my watches use inhouse movements. Some of them I bought because their outsourced movement is special or beautiful.

^ that’s a great analysis.

I watch Formula 1. Formula 1 cars use parts and components made by many different sources. Team Red Bull does not make its own engine or its own tires. I’m not sure they could or would want to. I’m also unconvinced that if they did, they would project themselves into the winners circle with every race.

At some point, all of this in-house movement stuff becomes marketing. Sort of like “full canvassed” has become so with tailored clothing.
I do have to admit, with F1 its a bit different, but with a road car, I struggled with that idea. Years ago, I test drove a Lotus Elise. A lot of fun to drive, but at that money, I just struggled with the idea of it having a Toyota engine. Yes, reliability and ease of parts at least with the engine, but it just bothered me...well that and I'm not very tall and each time I tried to get in and out wit the roof panel in place I pulled a muscle in my neck. I decided, that if every time I tried getting in and out it was literally a pain in the neck it wasn't for me. :rotflmao:
 

clee1982

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I find it hilarious - although perhaps not surprising - that people are going crazy over a Cartier model that has this feature and hailing it as wonderful. Seiko introduced it to their range of dress watches about 20 years back, but I guess a $200 Seiko with that precise feature isn't as exciting or cool as a $4000 Cartier...

Another feature that both Seiko and Casio introduced for their quartz watches a couple of decades back was a "snooze" function to save battery power - if the watch was not moved for 30 minutes or an hour, the hands would stop moving, but the movement would still count the passing of time so when the owner picked up the watch again, days or weeks later, the hands would snap back to the correct time and carry on as before. Once again, that feature passed un-noticed by watch bloggers - but when FP Journe introduced the feature on a $13,000 quartz watch a few years back, it was marketed as a technological marvel!
So wife is a non watch person, i’m 100% sure my wife is considering watch as jewelry stand point. The no need for servicing for 16 years is really just bonus (if she got a manual wind she might never bother to wind it beyond first day)
 

Ambulance Chaser

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Years ago, I test drove a Lotus Elise. A lot of fun to drive, but at that money, I just struggled with the idea of it having a Toyota engine.
Kind of like a Rolex Daytona with a Zenith movement? :devil:

(The lack of an in-house "engine" would not dissuade me from either if I had the money.)
 

Texasmade

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Even in thinking about it, within my small collection, only about half my watches use inhouse movements. Some of them I bought because their outsourced movement is special or beautiful.
My collection of Omega Seamaster, Omega Speedmaster, AP RO, and Cartier Tank Americaine only the AP has an in-house movement.
 

mak1277

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In-house or not, doesn't really sway me all that much. If I was dropping serious money (like $20k plus) on a watch, I would expect that the movement was beautiful, but otherwise as long as it's a quality movement I'm not all that worried either way.

What *does* bother me though is when brands stick a basic/common movement in a watch and then still charge a bundle for it. I realize there are different levels of ETAs for example, but they're still basically the same. Why would I buy a watch for $3k with an ETA or Sellita when there are equally attractive options at under $1k with the same movement?
 

Leiker

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^ that’s a great analysis.

I watch Formula 1. Formula 1 cars use parts and components made by many different sources. Team Red Bull does not make its own engine or its own tires. I’m not sure they could or would want to. I’m also unconvinced that if they did, they would project themselves into the winners circle with every race.

At some point, all of this in-house movement stuff becomes marketing. Sort of like “full canvassed” has become so with tailored clothing.
Interestingly enough, that will change over the next couple of years.

 

pmeis

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Most of my watches have inhouse movements, the only one where I'm not sure I see the benefit is actually my Santos. I'm not sure if the 1847MC inside is giving me anything over a 2892? Given that it's a closed caseback I can't even make a case for being able appreciate any possible unique finishing (though I understand its pretty plain). As far as I understand it, its built for stability and robustness, a workhorse for Cartier to use in a wide variety of applications and to not be reliant on ETA.

Could or would Cartier cut 20% off the sales price if it used a 2892? Dunno. Did the inhouse movement effect my willingness to pay the asking price? Maybe 🤷‍♂️. I bought it because I thought it was the most versatile and coolest looking watch I had experienced within my price range. Maybe I would have thought twice about it if it had been using an ETA movement, but I'm not sure the in house movement really figured into my rationale.
 

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