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The Ultimate "HARDCORE" Shoe Porn Thread (Bespoke only)

Discussion in 'Classic Menswear' started by luk-cha, Jul 3, 2010.

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  1. bengal-stripe

    bengal-stripe Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    I was informed some time ago that they have gone to gemming in some models and I am not a fan.

    I am relatively sure (hopeful, anyway) that all of G&G bespoke work is hand welted.

    All G&G bespoke shoes are fully handmade: individual last, individual patterns, uppers made for that particular last, hand welted, hand stitched. (Just like all the bespoke work from John Lobb, Fosters or Cleverley.}

    All G&G ready-to-wear, bench-made or made-to-order shoes, are machine made (with hand finish for certain production steps) and utilize gemming, just like all other English shoes (bespoke excepted) for the last fifty years. JLP, Cleverley and Fosters (or previous Alan McAffee) use also gemming for their RTW ranges.

    The difference is in the price: a pair of bespoke shoes (from any of the companies mentioned) costs about three times as much as a RTW or MTO pair. Every customer can decide for himself, whether he wants one or three pairs of shoes for the same amount of money.

    It's horses for courses.
     
    1 person likes this.
  2. DWFII

    DWFII Bespoke Boot and Shoemaker Dubiously Honored

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    All G&G bespoke shoes are fully handmade: individual last, individual patterns, uppers made for that particular last, hand welted, hand stitched. (Just like all the bespoke work from John Lobb, Fosters or Cleverley.} All G&G ready-to-wear, bench-made or made-to-order shoes, are machine made (with hand finish for certain production steps) and utilize gemming, just like all other English shoes (bespoke excepted) for the last fifty years. JLP, Cleverley and Fosters (or previous Alan McAffee) use also gemming for their RTW ranges. The difference is in the price: a pair of bespoke shoes (from any of the companies mentioned) costs about three times as much as a RTW or MTO pair. Every customer can decide for himself, whether he wants one or three pairs of shoes for the same amount of money. It's horses for courses.
    Thank you for that clarification...pretty much what I thought. That said, while not intending to revive a brouhaha that hits all the tender parts for some folks...there is an objectively demonstrable difference in the quality--the superiority--of handwelted versus gemmed/goodyear techniques. That's my take as a maker.
     
  3. bengal-stripe

    bengal-stripe Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    That said, while not intending to revive a brouhaha......

    Of course not! - You wouldn't......[​IMG]

    ......there is an objectively demonstrable difference in the quality--the superiority--of handwelted versus gemmed/goodyear techniques.

    There is also a demonstrable superiority in the price. [​IMG]

    That's my take as a maker.

    Only a maker/manufacturer who employs and has experience with both methods can evaluate the two and give his reasons,
    why they have made the choices they've made.

    So far Messrs. Gaziano, Corthey, Cleverley(Glasgow) have not been forthcoming to give their side of the coin.
     
  4. DWFII

    DWFII Bespoke Boot and Shoemaker Dubiously Honored

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    Of course not! - You wouldn't......[​IMG] There is also a demonstrable superiority in the price. [​IMG] Only a maker/manufacturer who employs and has experience with both methods can evaluate the two and give his reasons, why they have made the choices they've made. So far Messrs. Gaziano, Corthey, Cleverley(Glasgow) have not been forthcoming to give their side of the coin.
    Well, I'm not ever gonna forswear mentioning gemming, nor even placing lower on the hierarchy of quality than GY welted. But I wouldn't have pursued it any further than a mention if cdmoore hadn't asked about it. When I was a young man and doing repair, I saw a lot of problems with gemming. But never in life would I have thought that I would need to document those issues. So I don't have photos from that time. That said,I do have a few photos...taken just in the last couple of months...that document a lot of the same problems I saw thirty years ago...one photo in particular taken of a pair of "famous name" English shoes that have been worn as part of a rotation and on "rose-petal strewn carpets", as who should say. Striking photo, that one. Beyond all that I will say...in passing because I don't want to hijack this thread...that the real question posed by your response (when you burrow down to the real substance and meat of the discussion) is what constitutes "superiority in the price"? Your comments suggest...imply...that a low price is superior. And to be preferred. I disagree but that's one perspective. But once you take that tack you can't escape the logical conclusion--that the lower the price the more superior. Soon we're at Walmart looking for shoes. I might add, also in passing...and to get us back to bespoke shoes and these G&G's...that we have heard from Gaziano and Corthay and Lobb and Delos: The very fact that they offer...indeed insist on...hand-welted in their premier lines, speaks volumes. As much or more than a post on SF. And far more than my...obviously biased...explanations.
     
  5. onix

    onix Senior member

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    That said,I do have a few photos...taken just in the last couple of months...that document a lot of the same problems I saw thirty years ago...one photo in particular taken of a pair of "famous name" English shoes that have been worn as part of a rotation and on "rose-petal strewn carpets", as who should say. Striking photo, that one.

    Would love to see those photos.
     
  6. patrickBOOTH

    patrickBOOTH Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    I've decided since I don't want to spend the money on bespoke shoes and I also hate gemming that I am no longer wearing shoes.
     
  7. imatlas

    imatlas Senior member

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    In that case may I recommend this alternative for an affordable, handsewn and bespoke option:

    [​IMG]

    No gemming here!
     
  8. upnorth

    upnorth Senior member

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    ^Exactly.

    I still wear socks and handmade flip flops made with organic coconut husk, which is naturally anti-microbial. I also wear goggles all the time now too as I was informed that gemmed shoes from wearers nearby would fail unpredictably and explode and the shards of leather and more importantly the synthetic fiberboard could blind me.
     
  9. bengal-stripe

    bengal-stripe Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    [​IMG]

    No gemming here!


    Obviously the 'Darling Clementine' range of footwear:

     
  10. ohm

    ohm Senior member

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    Discussions of gemming should go in the Official Gemming thread. Let's get this thread back on track.

    All from here.

    Koji Suzuki (boots included just for DWFII [​IMG]).
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
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    Edward Green bespoke
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
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    [​IMG]
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    Lobb
    [​IMG]
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    Cleverley
    [​IMG]
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    G&G
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
  11. HORNS

    HORNS Senior member

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    Jesus Christ . . . [​IMG]
     
  12. DWFII

    DWFII Bespoke Boot and Shoemaker Dubiously Honored

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    Would love to see those photos.
    Well, I can post them...but where?
     
  13. Sterling Gillette

    Sterling Gillette Senior member

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    Jesus Christ . . . [​IMG]

    Agreed, wonderful work of art!
     
  14. srivats

    srivats Senior member

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    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]


    [​IMG] [​IMG]
     
  15. SouthPhillyMan

    SouthPhillyMan Well-Known Member

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    damn the stingrays almost made me orgasm. i'll try to remember to post my pics tonight
     
  16. patrickBOOTH

    patrickBOOTH Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    Discussions of gemming should go in the Official Gemming thread. Let's get this thread back on track.

    All from here.

    Koji Suzuki (boots included just for DWFII [​IMG]).
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    Edward Green bespoke
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    Lobb
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    Cleverley
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    G&G
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]


    I think I just came. That's normal, right?
     
  17. rebel222

    rebel222 Senior member

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    Am I the only one who thinks these look terrible? Like some kind of reject model. [​IMG]
     
  18. patrickBOOTH

    patrickBOOTH Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    The way the waist meets the heel is really sloppy, it is like the outsole doesn't extend to the heel with the heel on top. Plus, it looks like the trees are stretching them a bit.
     
  19. SpooPoker

    SpooPoker Internet Bigtimer and Most Popular Man on Campus Dubiously Honored Affiliate Vendor

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    Wanting. Hunter. Green. Shoes.
     
  20. emptym

    emptym Senior member Moderator

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    Thank you. They are ridiculously comfortable. I am uncertain about the heel, though. I am thinking about having it heightened ever so slightly and tapered a bit more. We'll see when the maker wants to see me again, after a short break-in-period.
    I prefer the wider, shorter heels. The tall, narrow ones make me twist my ankle on occasion.
    These RL Norwegians are in my opinion beautifully made and the stiching is extremely well executed, I was wearing them when I went to see a trunk show by Paulo Scafora, nice guy but he had the cheek to run his fingers over them and say they were not as well made as RTW Edward Greens. I was not overly impressed with what he was offering as a handmade bespoke shoe for the same price, you could not tell the difference between his bespoke and RTW. I think its not only the personal last, you need to really up your game in terms of leather quality and finishing to really produce a something worthy of being called true bespoke.
    I love how you shot the exotics "in the wild."
    ... But I have always loved the way they finish the sole and heel. The waist work is really impeccable...especially the clean way in which the heel joints the edge of the sole. There's that "notch" at the breast that not only separates and sets off the heel...and, at the same time, accentuates the waist...but makes it look taller than it really is...
    [​IMG] FW(little)IW, I'm not a big fan. Maybe because I'm already tall and thin enough as it is. Plus, I like the stability of a wide, short heel, particularly when backing up on the motorcycle.
    Well, I can post them...but where?
    A new thread! Or the old gemming one.
     

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