The Ultimate "HARDCORE" Shoe Appreciation Thread (Bespoke only)

[j ingevaldsson]

All this talk about wholecuts reminded me of this eccentric take I'd seen before:

...a wholecut over the heel as well -- in shell cordovan! Norman Vilalta made the pair, perhaps for a showpiece only, and he seems to be widening his reach with RTW and several interviews at the moment.

Those are really cool! Yeah Norman is picking up the pace now ahead of his RTW launch. Will be interesting to see the whole set up, and hope it's not only too arty and extravagant stuff. Interesting to see how the Sendra factory manages shoes in the higher quality/price range that he's aiming for too.

You are nevertheless to be admired and congratulated. Just going that far is a huge leap from speculation and imagining shoes in your head. You can read and read and read...I personally own a number of rather hard to find books--Golding, Thornton, Swaysland, Plucknett, Bordoli, Deloney, Garsault, Salaman, Swann...tour factories, even sit at the feet of shoemakers, and yet never truly understand until you've actually done it.

A bit far afield but it reminds me of another discussion we've had here on SF--using leather as a resource...for any reason. It's been my experience that, esp. in this day and age, most people have no idea where leather comes from, nor the meat they pick up so conveniently and euphemistically packaged at the grocery store.

Sure, they know it comes from animals but they resolutely don't want to think about what's entailed in harvesting those products.

I've always contended that in one sense...when you really get down to it...no one has the ethical right to eat meat or use leather until they've actually been a part of that "harvest." Killed an animal, skinned it, etc.. Participated in its death. Seen the "spark" go out of its eyes..

I don't want to argue this particular issue (although I am sure that there are those who do) but it highlights the fact that you can't get real knowledge from reading or day dreaming or repeating what others have said. You can't know what leather really costs until you participate in the taking of life.

--

Well thank you DWF. Regarding the leather story, I see your point. When I made a news story on something with ecological, local meat when I worked at the Swedish National Radio, I witnessed the killing and slaughter of a cow. It was horrible, I hated it. But I would obviously much rather eat that meat and use that skin for my shoes (if I could) than the mistreated, industrialised meat products most cattle are seen as.

We have a tannery here in Sweden, Tärnsjö, who marks every skin with a number, through which you then can go back to which farm, even which calf/cow, that it comes from. I actually have a pair of shoes where we tracked the leather, so I know the name of the animal that I'm wearing (don't remember now, has it written down somewhere). It's a bit freaky, but at the same time interesting, and I do know now that it comes from a decent farm and probably has had a decent life.

 

[DWFII]



...

You have a tannery there in Sweden called Morjarvsskinn, out of Morjarv. In any case they do a reindeer that looks remarkably like it might be Russia Calf.

I don't know how it is tanned but they sent me a black waterproofing / dubbin that is so redolent of birch oil and smoke and pine tar that I sometimes think it would make a great...strictly masculine...cologne/EDT.

Which makes me think they might curry the reindeer with birch tar.

I carry it around the shop sometimes and set it down odd places and now I can't find it.

Oh!! Here it is:

Garvarens Ladersmorningar

Innehaller endast naturproduktor bl a fartalg bjorktjara och bivax

Morjarvs Skinn

tel 0923-501 00

Garveriet 90 42 Morjarv

(umlauts ...or their Swedish equivalents...omitted for lack of keyboard)

 

[j ingevaldsson]

You have a tannery there in Sweden called Morjarvsskinn, out of Morjarv. In any case they do a reindeer that looks remarkably like it might be Russia Calf.

I don't know how it is tanned but they sent me a black waterproofing / dubbin that is so redolent of birch oil and smoke and pine tar that I sometimes think it would make a great...strictly masculine...cologne/EDT.

Which makes me think they might curry the reindeer with birch tar.

I carry it around the shop sometimes and set it down odd places and now I can't find it.

Oh!! Here it is:

Garvarens Ladersmorningar

Innehaller endast naturproduktor bl a fartalg bjorktjara och bivax

Morjarvs Skinn

tel 0923-501 00

Garveriet 90 42 Morjarv

(umlauts ...or their Swedish equivalents...omitted for lack of keyboard)

Haven't heard of Morjärvs Skinn, but there are a couple of small tanneries up north doing old school tanning of reindeer, salmon and stuff. Björktjära is birch tar in Swedish. Might be used in the tanning process, like said, they like old techniques. I know old moose skin with the hair still on are sometimes tanned with birch tar, and although they are decades old they still smell quite hefty.

 

[DWFII]



I didn't say, however, that those bootmakers were bound to adhere to one specific length calculated relative to my foot length.

No hard feelings, let's just leave it at that.

I'm fine with that and I'm equally fine to leave it at that but this has been bugging me...

WADR, it doesn't matter what you or "those bootmakers" say about "specific length calculated relative to...foot length." Nor does it even matter what I say.

What matters is what the foot says, what the mechanics of the shoe says, what contingent aesthetics dictate and to a lesser extent what Traditions say. Those bootmakers, me...anyone who is serious and objective about shoes...is indeed "bound to adhere" to them. "Best practices" is not open to interpretations divorced from logic or the reality of context. It's not Art (with a capital "A").

 

[Tony Montana]

I'm fine with that and I'm equally fine to leave it at that but this has been bugging me...

WADR, it doesn't matter what you or "those bootmakers" say about "specific length calculated relative to...foot length." Nor does it even matter what I say.

What matters is what the foot says, what the mechanics of the shoe says, what contingent aesthetics dictate and to a lesser extent what Traditions say. Those bootmakers, me...anyone who is serious and objective about shoes...is indeed "bound to adhere" to them. "Best practices" is not open to interpretations divorced from logic or the reality of context. It's not Art (with a capital "A").

I was referring to the 1/11 of total foot length rule you mentioned. All I was trying to say is that all the bootmakers I have used, no matter their location and tradition, were free in choosing excess length for the various toe shapes they have created for me. So if I asked them to make the toe shape on an existing last narrower for a subsequent commission they would just increase length by a bit so that I still get a proper fit.

 

[DWFII]



I was referring to the 1/11 of total foot length rule you mentioned. All I was trying to say is that all the bootmakers I have used, no matter their location and tradition, were free in choosing excess length for the various toe shapes they have created for me. So if I asked them to make the toe shape on an existing last narrower for a subsequent commission they would just increase length by a bit so that I still get a proper fit.

Of course, every bespoke maker does that. But even if the metaphor of Crakows doesn't resonate, there is a point where the foot loses control of too long a "toe box"...simply because the flex of the foot is at least 3/11 of the LOF behind the end of the toes--where control begins and ends. To what degree...and whether you can tolerate your toes curling up...is the issue.

Sabbage says 1/11 of LOF is for a medium round toe. It's also roughly equivalent to 3 barley corns or three full sizes (each of which is approx. equal to 1/3"). Three full sizes is already an inch in mid range lasts --8, 9, 10, 11. How many more sizes are acceptable for a narrow pointed toe? If you had a blunt foot with three or more toes of equal length, how far would you have to extend it if the customer wanted a narrow pointed toe? I'd guess that in some cases it might be five or even six...just to preserve the "lines" of the last.. That's approaching 2 inches at any size of last

Any responsible boot/shoemaker will encounter customers where, in all honesty and honour, he must tell the them "I can't do that for you without distorting the look and the function of the boot."

 

[patrickBOOTH]

 

[JubeiSpiegel]

...and suddenly, my decision to skip lunch proves to be the correct one...

 

[DWFII]



Interesting. Caution is recommended.

It might be noted at this juncture that the LOMA--the "line of muscular action" runs right between the first metatarsal and the second...on a healthy foot. So the toe of the last will usually center itself on that line...on a healthy foot. That means the end of your second toe would be bumping the inside of the toebox on a narrow toe.

 

[DWFII]



...and suddenly, my decision to skip lunch proves to be the correct one...

That's a pretty healthy foot....

And I'm looking forward to a nice veal (pale white) bratwurst.

 

[JubeiSpiegel]



That's a pretty healthy foot....

And I'm looking forward to a nice veal (pale white) bratwurst.

It's too early in the day for nude phalanges IMO...

 

[sugarbutch]

That's unlikely to be pB's toe: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morton's_toe

 

[patrickBOOTH]

Yeah, it's morton's toe.

 

[DWFII]



Yeah, it's morton's toe.

I have a Morton's Neuroma but I've never heard of a Morton's Toe--old Morton must have been damn near crippled to have so many disorders named after him.

Probably from eating too much salt.

 

[bengal-stripe]



..........I've never heard of a Morton's Toe--old Morton must have been damn near crippled to have so many disorders named after him.

It's also called a 'Greek foot' and is considered a sign of beauty. Do you know whose foot that is?