The Tailors' Thread: Fit Feedback and Alteration Suggestions

[Terpo]

Just picked this up on sale at mrporter. Any suggestions/feedback would be appreciated

Trousers are too long, jacket is too short. Shirt sleeves seem too short as well as no cuff is visible on your right hand.

 

[TweedyProf]

@azif
Tailors will point out subtle features but I do think could be a bit longer as you seem visually to have longer legs so might want to give more solidity to top by having a longer jacket. For that reason I am not a fan of the skinny lapels and the high button stance.

Try this. Unbutton top and then pinch below the top button an inch or two as if it had a lower stance, showing more of your shirt and tie. This to me has the appearance of
De emphasizing your mid section and emphasizing you're chest and is visually more pleasing. Isn't it?

The sleeve pitch is off for you and hence the wrinkling in back of sleeve. That can be fixed I think by reattaching sleeve but not simple. Button stance and lapel width cannot be changed. Of course, some like high button stances and skinny lapels so ignore my thoughts if you favor that.

Btw you might try shirts with a higher collar. I'm like you tall and thin and more
Collar height works nicely.

Just my two cents.

 

[SFA]

Apologizes in advance if I'm posting too much as I already started a thread on this, but I know this thread is looked at the tailors here and wouldn't mind getting their opinion (and everyone elses here):

In my attempt to try and find a decently fitting RTW suit (with the assumption that I will be taking this to a tailor to fix any "minor" issues seen in addition to hemming/shortening sleeves), what do you guys think of this Canali suit I just received? I do have the option of returning it if you don't think it is appropriate. This Canali is a size 40.

Some of my problem areas with all my current suits include:

1) Jacket shoulder is too big. I honestly can't tell from the feel, but I do have small/narrow shoulders. My wife did comment that the shoulder do look a little big, but not as bad as my other suit jackets (e.g., my grey pal zileri which I also attached a pic of).

2) Jacket length is too long. This one also confuses me. I have relatively short arms. I've seen some of the best fit pics in other threads and it always appears as the thumb is about 2 inches past the length of jacket. My thumb is hitting right at the jacket itself. I'm leaning towards the jacket being too long, but I know I need to keep in mind that I am not exactly the slimmest guy and I do have a prominent behind and therefore need the jacket to cover me.

3) Button stance. I think the button stance is good. All the pulling/wrinkling on the back I am assuming can be fixed as the vents haven't been opened (incase I need to return it).

4) I didn't wear the pants. But they do fit OK. Just need to let out the seat and hem.

Can anyone give me any advice or input on this. I have attached in comparison my Pal Zileri and also Samulehsohn (M2M) suits which imo fit terribly. I know I've been told to go with the M2M route, but seeing how my Samuelsohn turned out (a disaster), I admit I don't honestly know enough/not educated to go there just yet. I just want a decent fitting RTW.

Canali suit:

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!

Pal Zileri (RTW I bought year ago). Fits like an absolute disaster. I believe it is a size IT 52 which is evident from the way to big shoulders:

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!

Samuelsohn M2M. Again I am not happy with this. I was basically measured wearing my pal zileri thus replicating the same problems I have:

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!

 

[OTCtailor]

Just picked this up on sale at mrporter. Any suggestions/feedback would be appreciated

Is this side profile the way you actually stand or are you leaning your head forward?

 

[OTCtailor]

Apologizes in advance if I'm posting too much as I already started a thread on this, but I know this thread is looked at the tailors here and wouldn't mind getting their opinion (and everyone elses here):

In my attempt to try and find a decently fitting RTW suit (with the assumption that I will be taking this to a tailor to fix any "minor" issues seen in addition to hemming/shortening sleeves), what do you guys think of this Canali suit I just received? I do have the option of returning it if you don't think it is appropriate. This Canali is a size 40.

Some of my problem areas with all my current suits include:

1) Jacket shoulder is too big. I honestly can't tell from the feel, but I do have small/narrow shoulders. My wife did comment that the shoulder do look a little big, but not as bad as my other suit jackets (e.g., my grey pal zileri which I also attached a pic of).

2) Jacket length is too long. This one also confuses me. I have relatively short arms. I've seen some of the best fit pics in other threads and it always appears as the thumb is about 2 inches past the length of jacket. My thumb is hitting right at the jacket itself. I'm leaning towards the jacket being too long, but I know I need to keep in mind that I am not exactly the slimmest guy and I do have a prominent behind and therefore need the jacket to cover me.

3) Button stance. I think the button stance is good. All the pulling/wrinkling on the back I am assuming can be fixed as the vents haven't been opened (incase I need to return it).

4) I didn't wear the pants. But they do fit OK. Just need to let out the seat and hem.

Can anyone give me any advice or input on this. I have attached in comparison my Pal Zileri and also Samulehsohn (M2M) suits which imo fit terribly. I know I've been told to go with the M2M route, but seeing how my Samuelsohn turned out (a disaster), I admit I don't honestly know enough/not educated to go there just yet. I just want a decent fitting RTW.

Canali suit:

The Canali jacket is obviously too long in the sleeves. A good 1.5-2" too long. The total jacket length is passable. A little longer might be better for you but I wouldn't say this jacket is necessarily too short. Depends on your preferences. Also, if you went to the next size longer in this jacket, the body might be right on or perhaps a hair too long but the sleeves would be SO LONG that altering them to correct length will ruin the sleeve balance.
What I'm saying is that you may very be a better candidate for good made to measure. If you're buying canali or aforementioned brands, you're already at the MTM sticker price for most makers anyway.
If you do go MTM again, the key is not just quality measurements, but also your posture. In your case, the more sloping shoulders, prominent seat, and sway back (lower back curve)are just some of the areas that need to be properly accounted for. Having a suit to guide off of is helpful but if it fits poorly and they just copy it, what's the point?

 

[SFA]



The Canali jacket is obviously too long in the sleeves. A good 1.5-2" too long. The total jacket length is passable. A little longer might be better for you but I wouldn't say this jacket is necessarily too short. Depends on your preferences. Also, if you went to the next size longer in this jacket, the body might be right on or perhaps a hair too long but the sleeves would be SO LONG that altering them to correct length will ruin the sleeve balance.
What I'm saying is that you may very be a better candidate for good made to measure. If you're buying canali or aforementioned brands, you're already at the MTM sticker price for most makers anyway.
If you do go MTM again, the key is not just quality measurements, but also your posture. In your case, the more sloping shoulders, prominent seat, and sway back (lower back curve)are just some of the areas that need to be properly accounted for. Having a suit to guide off of is helpful but if it fits poorly and they just copy it, what's the point?

Thanks for the reply. Unforuntately, I haven't found one trusted M2M tailor here in Toronto that I believe can help with the issues you described above. The Canali suit I purchased was at a decent discount, something I can live with even though I agree I am probably in the low-end M2M. The total cost excluding alterations (which I estimate will be $200) is $1600. Keeping in mind that these are cdn prices.

 

[SFA]

Forgot to ask - Do you think the shoulders are too big on the Canali jacket? I'm almost considering returning the suit jacket and waiting/researching other M2M programs if the end result is me spending close to $2k on something that is poorly fitting.

 

[TweedyProf]

Despos, OTC and other tailors

Take a jacket that you want to lower the button stance on in the next iteration.

Must you also lengthen the jacket correspondingly?

Is there a ratio between button location and pockets and jacket hem? What are the basic constraints.

I'd be interested in knowing the theory/convention. Whenever I find an ability to get an MTM with one supplier, I'd like to lower my button stance about an inch but not necessary increase the length that much.

Many thanks

 

[Sean McKee]

Some good comment above. I agree that the sleeves are probably 1 1/5 2" too long. Get them taken in to the break of your wrist. Usually you want the sleeves to be 4.5" - 4: from the tip of your thumb.

You ned to have a sway back adjustment to help correct the lower back area. Also need to note prominent seat if thats what you have. It's nor easy to tell exactly looking at pictures. These note should be given with any made to measure order submitted by your haberdasher.

You do have wrinkles across the upper back, Possible causes maybe be incline measurement to collar too long so needs to be shortened, increase half back to give more room or prominent blades.

Point to Point probably a little big fusing shoulders to be larger than needed.

Nothing you can do on the button placement. Next time have a tailor measure where you would like it based on a coat you currently have that you like. Or have them measure and put the button at the most prominent part of your abdomen.

With your body build I wouldn't be buying clothing OTR, especially the type of money you're spending for Canali.



Again, these are my observations from the pics but it's hard to tell from that. Hopefully you can find a good tailor to fix your issues. I would return it and find a good MTM program in your area.

Good Luck,

S

 

[madoxoflondon]

Hi Tweedyprof,

You can certainly lower the button stance on a future iteration of a jacket without increasing the overall length. Naturally how much will depend to some degree on where it sits currently and your personal preferences but this is just a question of proportion and something that is quite malleable.

You can consider a dinner jacket and a blazer : whilst the blocks may be the same length the dinner jacket will almost certainly have a far lower button stance, producing a different fit and aesthetic.

If you do lower (or raise) one element of the jacket - in this case the button stance - then you would definitely wish to take other elements such as the pocket placement into account so as to achieve a balanced result ... although these adjustments are not linear.

A lot will depend on your body shape and the style of the jacket. Here is one of ours below which we'd consider a fairly regular button stance (around the natural waist). You could probably move the button up or down an inch without throwing the silhouette too much and for each full inch you move the button I'd move the pockets 3/5" or so.

 

[Chopper88]

Dear tailors,

First of all let me say thank you for this great thread and all it's info, I'm reading it from the first to the last post and think it's awesome you do this!

I do have a question, which kind of a cross post from the 'ask a question get an answer' thread, someone over there suggested I'd ask here.
I apologise myself for the fact that this isn't a fitting related question, but you might have an answer for me after asking in several places.
When more info is needed, please ask!

Here's the deal:

I sent someone off to pick up a jacket I had dry cleaned a while ago, and somehow the sleeves look weird when I got it back. It does disappear to some extent, but not fully when wearing...
What could have caused the rippling/puckering on the sleeves? And how do I get rid of it? I've been told it can be done by hand pressing on a pressing board with an iron and a cloth in between, but thought I'd rather ask about it here first.

 

[TweedyProf]

Hi Tweedyprof,

You can certainly lower the button stance on a future iteration of a jacket without increasing the overall length. Naturally how much will depend to some degree on where it sits currently and your personal preferences but this is just a question of proportion and something that is quite malleable.

You can consider a dinner jacket and a blazer : whilst the blocks may be the same length the dinner jacket will almost certainly have a far lower button stance, producing a different fit and aesthetic.

If you do lower (or raise) one element of the jacket - in this case the button stance - then you would definitely wish to take other elements such as the pocket placement into account so as to achieve a balanced result ... although these adjustments are not linear.

A lot will depend on your body shape and the style of the jacket. Here is one of ours below which we'd consider a fairly regular button stance (around the natural waist). You could probably move the button up or down an inch without throwing the silhouette too much and for each full inch you move the button I'd move the pockets 3/5" or so.

Thanks for response. For a blazer, (1) is there not a minimum distance from bottom of jacket to bottom button, and (2) ideal relation between lowest button and top of the pocket, and (3) a standard distance between buttons? I'd like the top button (or the middle of a 3 roll 2) to be at my natural waist.

I'm curious how much of this is rigidly set by convention and how much is an allowance for flexibility.

 

[OTCtailor]

Forgot to ask - Do you think the shoulders are too big on the Canali jacket? I'm almost considering returning the suit jacket and waiting/researching other M2M programs if the end result is me spending close to $2k on something that is poorly fitting.

The bigger problem you'll deal with when looking at anything OTR in the shoulder department isn't so much that they're too big but that they're not sloped enough for your shoulders. When that is the case, the result is that they may feel and appear to be too big. So you have sloping and forward pitching shoulders, swayback, and perhaps a larger blade on the right than left. Yes, prominent seat but more importantly affecting the fit in that area is the swayback.

Altering shoulders for more slope is a rather complicated procedure and has its limitations. A good MTM program would/should correct most of these issues.

 

[OTCtailor]

Thanks for response. For a blazer, (1) is there not a minimum distance from bottom of jacket to bottom button, and (2) ideal relation between lowest button and top of the pocket, and (3) a standard distance between buttons? I'd like the top button (or the middle of a 3 roll 2) to be at my natural waist.

I'm curious how much of this is rigidly set by convention and how much is an allowance for flexibility.

There are really no absolutes in the discussion of buttonstance. In my experience, it is almost entirely based on client's preference/comfort for where they button the coat. Going a bit high or a bit low would raise a warning flag that, as a tailor, you present to client and see what the response is. We can make anything, but should we?

on a 3R2, it is best to think about designing it as a 2btn because it essentially is. That top button is obviously not meant to function.
Also, when it comes to balancing out a short torso, you can lower the stance slightly but you have less flex than with a longer torso. Better to adjust the gorge height in conjunction with a slightly lower stance. Then, roll that lapel right to the first button.
On a longer torso, you can have the button stance in a more 'neutral' location or slightly lower by preference and roll the lapel higher. That allows the wearer to have the best combo for button point comfort and torso length balance.
If you're lowering the stance so much that you have to consider lengthening the coat, then it's probably too far.

 

[TweedyProf]

There are really no absolutes in the discussion of buttonstance. In my experience, it is almost entirely based on client's preference/comfort for where they button the coat. Going a bit high or a bit low would raise a warning flag that, as a tailor, you present to client and see what the response is. We can make anything, but should we?

on a 3R2, it is best to think about designing it as a 2btn because it essentially is. That top button is obviously not meant to function.
Also, when it comes to balancing out a short torso, you can lower the stance slightly but you have less flex than with a longer torso. Better to adjust the gorge height in conjunction with a slightly lower stance. Then, roll that lapel right to the first button.
On a longer torso, you can have the button stance in a more 'neutral' location or slightly lower by preference and roll the lapel higher. That allows the wearer to have the best combo for button point comfort and torso length balance.
If you're lowering the stance so much that you have to consider lengthening the coat, then it's probably too far.

Thanks OTC. Maybe pics will help (again, I'm grateful if any of the other tailors weigh in)

This was in fact a remake of an MTM. I asked for a lower button stance the second time round and while it is lower than before, it still ended up higher than I would like. I think about one more button width down (about one inch) would put it near or at my natural waist. As to length, I think it could be a touch longer, but I'd be ok where it is (it covers my seat). I wouldn't lengthen more than half an inch. The higher button stance makes the quarters open slightly more aggressively than I would like, but it's wearable for sure. Otherwise, it's pretty clean, shoulders, back, sleeve pitch. THings that I would notice seem ok otherwise. I'd go with them again if I could change the button stance and length.

OK, so I might lengthen it half an inch and lower the stance about an inch. Do I have to lower the second button one inch as well but then what about its relation to the pockets? That's my question.