The State of Black Tie: Your Observations

[TimelesStyle]



If black tie is optional, I am wearing black tie. Not because of any complex social calculus, but because I like to make use of my tux. I could not care less if no one else wears one.

Maybe I'm the wrong sort, but I would never wear black tie to an evening wedding without being told to. And I do think it would look incredibly odd if you were the only one outside the wedding party wearing a dinner suit. In fact, I think it would be construed as very rude. For the same reason, I would never wear a flower in my lapel to a wedding unless I was in the party.

This seems somewhat contradictory. In one post you say you don't care if you're the only one in black tie but then you say that you'd feel odd if you were. In the first quoted post are you talking about events other than weddings while the second is specific to weddings? Or is the idea that once the invite says BTO you're assuming there will be at least some other people in black tie and it's just fine to bust out the tux?

 

[TheFoo]

If black tie is stated as optional, I'm wearing it. My point about not being the only one outside the wedding part wearing a tux was is in regards to situations where no attire has been specified.

 

[recondite]

You have to go back to the '50s to find an invite with no dress code.

Thank you for posting this. As a point in fact, the one invite quoted above is the only formal invitation that was provided and as is proper with formal invitations, it doesn't mention the dress code. There are two invitations above that appear to be formal, or give the appearance of being formal, that fail as truly formal invitations for one or more technical or formal reasons, i.e., they lack the proper form.

The rest of the examples appear largely to be tickets for admission and not invitations at all.

With informal invitations or tickets for admission, it is entirely proper to list the dress code if any or not, such as the very last one dated 1949.

The sad fact is that in order to expect proper attire from guests nowadays, one needs to find some way to communicate the dress code to them and the invite or attending documents such as RSVP cards are probably as good a place as any, formal invite or not.

 

[Moloch38]

I think eveyone here knows the times and occasions for appropriate formality, but this is SF. Out in the rest of the world I feel it is best to state requested attire on the invitation, because you cannot ASSUME your guests will know.
And we all know what happens when we assume, we make and ass out of you and me.

 

[culverwood]



I think eveyone here knows the times and occasions for appropriate formality, but this is SF.  Out in the rest of the world I feel it is best to state requested attire on the invitation, because you cannot ASSUME your guests will know. 

I prefer the SkinnyGoomba granny method for weddings. If people do not know what to wear they only have to ask, if granny or mum has not told them already.

I acknowledge that now for diplomatic and other such invitations people will not know what is correct to wear unless it is spelt out for them.

 

[msulinski]

I prefer the SkinnyGoomba granny method for weddings. If people do not know what to wear they only have to ask, if granny or mum has not told them already.

I acknowledge that now for diplomatic and other such invitations people will not know what is correct to wear unless it is spelt out for them.

This is usually the recommended method suggested by etiquette experts as well.

 

[Veremund]

Perfectly fine, though a wasted opportunity to sport some truly special / snazzy shirt studs.

On an unrelated note, I'm curious what SF'rs think about the appropriateness of a formal fly front shirt where the buttons are hidden, as opposed to wearing studs.

 

[dopey]



. . . .
On an unrelated note, I'm curious what SF'rs think about the appropriateness of a formal fly front shirt where the buttons are hidden, as opposed to wearing studs.

 

Perfectly fine, though a wasted opportunity to sport some truly special / snazzy shirt studs.

I ordered my last shirt this way. I like it because it is easier to deal with, but I like the more classic look of studs as well.

 

[musicmax]



On an unrelated note, I'm curious what SF'rs think about the appropriateness of a formal fly front shirt where the buttons are hidden, as opposed to wearing studs.

 

BlackTieGuide approves:

"Of all the attempts to improve black tie since its heyday in the 1930s there is only one innovation I would endorse unconditionally: the fly-front shirt."

http://blog.blacktieguide.com/2012/01/09/fly-front-shirt/

Magnoli does a more affordable take on the discontinued T&A Casino Royale number, down to the mitred cuffs. Macy's has a Boss with plissé bosom for $75.

 

[Manton]



But what would you wear to an evening wedding at the Pierre if the invitation didn't say anything?

Navy DB, white FC shirt, wedding tie, black stitch caps.

Would you be surprised if some people were in black tie?

Actually, I would be. Maybe it's because I haven't been to all that many NYC weddings.

 

[dopey]



Navy DB, white FC shirt, wedding tie, black stitch caps.
Actually, I would be. Maybe it's because I haven't been to all that many NYC weddings.

The wedding I went to before this last one was at the NY Public Library. The invitation didn't specify dress. My wife called and we were told black tie. I don't know how many other people called, but 80% of the guests were in black tie. I wouldn't be surprised if a large number of the guests assumed it would be black tie from the venue (or their knowledge of the hosts). I think that is typical - you can usually make a good guess. Some are easy - fancy hotels or other big name spaces means black-tie will be seen, whether specified or not. Synagogue banquet halls (I know Churches don't so evening weddings) or restaurants. The tougher ones are clubs or event spaces. If there is nothing on the invitation, I would always wear a suit or call.

You know what is scary? My daughter has been invited to Bar and Bat Mitzvas that were black-tie. According to my daughter, black-tie was only for the adults. None of the kids wore black-tie, though some girls wore fancier dresses. Not being friendly with the parents, I wasn't invited to any of those; the school ones that I was invited to were not black-tie (which is the overwhelming norm).

 

[TimelesStyle]



On an unrelated note, I'm curious what SF'rs think about the appropriateness of a formal fly front shirt where the buttons are hidden, as opposed to wearing studs.

 

Not only do I think it's acceptable, I'd recommend it if one chooses to go sans waist covering. IMO the biggest problem with going without a waistcoat or cummerbund is the transition from bib to plain fabric and studs to buttons. However if the entire shirt is the same texture and there is no studs-to-buttons transition then I think this looks considerably less awkward.

 

[recondite]

Navy DB, white FC shirt, wedding tie, black stitch caps.
Actually, I would be. Maybe it's because I haven't been to all that many NYC weddings.

A wedding tie is classic daywear and best in direct sunlight, but not the best choice for an evening wedding since it lacks proper contrast and doesn't look great in camera. I am sure you know this, but don't care.

 

[sugarbutch]

 

[aravenel]