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The State of Black Tie: Your Observations

Discussion in 'Classic Menswear' started by mafoofan, Nov 22, 2011.

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  1. Van Veen

    Van Veen Senior member

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    I attended a wedding w/ 300+ guests that had a fancy invitation in copperplate script, it was at your typical chintzy wedding mill, the web site said "the dress code is formal attire", yet no one wore black tie except the wedding party.* The bride and groom are both rednecks.... errr, I mean doctors, he an MD and she an MD/Ph.D, both from an Ivy League school (and not f'n Cornell). I guess that's a sad commentary on our culture today...?

    * Of course, "black tie" is taken with a grain of salt since the ties were not black and neither were the tuxedos.
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2013
  2. mafoofan

    mafoofan Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    Not necessarily. If the invite had said "black tie" I bet you'd have a very different turnout. A big thing is that words just don't mean what they used to. Anyway, "formal" would never have meant black tie, right? It should be "semi-formal"--but then everyone would have showed up in blazers.
     
  3. EriQ009

    EriQ009 Senior member

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    What color were the ties and tuxedos?
     
  4. poorsod

    poorsod Senior member

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    Virtually everyone I see at a black tie event is in black tie. I go to about 4-6 per year and I suspect the circuit in NYC is more by the book.
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2013
  5. EriQ009

    EriQ009 Senior member

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    I suppose the bride and groom ought to be thankful that the definition of 'formal' is lost on the average person. Otherwise they'd have a guest list attired in white-tie and a wedding party in black tie. That would be... interesting.

     
  6. mafoofan

    mafoofan Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    Sure, but of those events, how many specifically stipulated "black tie?"
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2013
  7. sugarbutch

    sugarbutch Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    Do you not understand that there are different degrees of offensiveness? Are you just looking to be offended? Have you taken this up with Jeff Foxworthy?
     
  8. aravenel

    aravenel Senior member

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    There is a huge, huge difference between something being "derogatory", "pejorative", "disparaging" and "generally considered offensive" and being bigoted.

    You just called several people here idiots. By any measure, that would be "derogatory", "pejorative", "disparaging" and "generally considered offensive". It certainly doesn't make you a bigot.
     
    1 person likes this.
  9. SkinnyGoomba

    SkinnyGoomba Senior member

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    My wedding is coming up in about 5 months, a lot of the guests have actually requested to wear their black tie rigs. They do understand that black tie has nothing to do with a neck tie, one is wearing a cream dinner jacket.

    My finance' told me it is not appropriate to put the attire on the invite.
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2013
  10. mafoofan

    mafoofan Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    Fellas, fellas, this "redneck" debate is all moot. Please inspect my original statement. It should be read to be identifying "rednecks" only from the perspective of the statement's target (people who make judgments of character based on adherence to traditional rules of formality), and hence does not itself validate the term's application.
     
  11. mafoofan

    mafoofan Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    Like I said, I was invited to a banquet at the Italian Embassy in London. The invitation stipulated "black tie." I don't think anything is wrong or uncouth about that. At this point, my guess is that people are simply trying to out-snob each other by pretending they would never have to be told to wear black tie, because they would just know.
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2013
  12. msulinski

    msulinski Senior member

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    Every etiquette source I checked indicated that "black tie" or "black tie requested" on an invitation is completely fine.

    The only potential etiquette breach is that you may risk offending/alienating some who may not have the means to rent or buy the appropriate attire. If you don't think this would be a problem for those on your guest list, then go for it.

    Edit: don't put your registry info in the invitation or in the envelope.
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2013
  13. SkinnyGoomba

    SkinnyGoomba Senior member

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    I've always thought it was fine, since the reality of it is that today most people dont know what to wear unless they're told. Even if you know what's correct, you're still unsure if you will be completely out of place dressed appropriately and have to deal with a very angry bride.

    There is no bride or groomzilla for my wedding, but my friends/family generally like to be more formal for weddings and it will be after 6.
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2013
  14. Blackhood

    Blackhood Senior member

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    +1. Telling people what you expect is the only way to have your expectations met. Since when has being on the same page as your friends been a bad thing?
     
  15. SkinnyGoomba

    SkinnyGoomba Senior member

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    My mother and grandmother are Italian, if you tell them it's black tie everyone will know within an hour or so.
     
  16. aravenel

    aravenel Senior member

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    I agree. It may have been uncouth at one time, but at this point, you pretty much have to clarify.
     
  17. aravenel

    aravenel Senior member

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    :lol:
     
  18. poorsod

    poorsod Senior member

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    All of them.
     
  19. Van Veen

    Van Veen Senior member

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    The tuxes were those gray CK things with the satin edged lapels that are super popular nowadays. I think the ties were silver.

    [​IMG]
     
  20. poorsod

    poorsod Senior member

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    That's considered a tux?
     

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