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The State of Black Tie: Your Observations

psb

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Agreed on the low odds to get 4 on 1 peak right.

Have seen one or two WW Chan works which are very satisfying though: Lower gorge flow down to wide lapels that have more-or-less horizontal peaks, minimum to no belly, stopping at the lower row of buttons aligned to the jetted pockets.

View attachment 1343817
This looks wonderful.
 

Royal_Airforce

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Th

the 4x1 peak is a funny animal for me. I have tried three times bespoke times get one and always ended throwing them out. They really look good on a mannequin but rarely on a person. Put one side by side a 6x2 with the exception of a 4x1 shawl and id pick the 6x2 any day
I have never commissioned any 4 on 1 (shawl or peak), so it would help if I see more of those in action. Care sharing some of your previous commissions?

Having said that, your shawl argument stands strong.

(On a separate note, I am not yet determined whether I should be bothered by the potential 'cropping effect' of a DB DJ in a different colour from the dinner trousers. Being 5'10" and being Asian, height and body proportion isn't something I am massively gifted with)
 
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Royal_Airforce

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This looks wonderful.
It does! WW Chan is indeed the pinnacle of Hong Kong bespoke tailoring, having the technical skills (in terms of getting fit, construction and finishing right) and the classic yet modern aesthetics.
 
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The Chai

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I have never commissioned any 4 on 1 (shawl or peak), so it would help if I see more of those in action. Care sharing some of your previous commissions?

Having said that, your shawl argument stands strong.

(On a separate note, I am not yet determined whether I should be bothered by the potential 'cropping effect' of a DB DJ in a different colour from the dinner trousers. Being 5'10" and being Asian, height and body proportion isn't something I am massively gifted with)
Im 5ft 7 and asían...i wear whatever I want...if u feel natural in it by all means do so...safety, comfort and fun....I think I posted my cream 4x1 shawl a few pages back in the black tie thread if u wanna go for abit of a trawl
 

The Chai

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That said I have many conservative suits made and many dinner jackets. The cream 4x1 is not my favourite but it’s by far the one I’m most comfortable in
 

Royal_Airforce

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I'd steer clear from a DJ that is not black or cream (or allowing midnight if I were to be a tad more forgiving, tartan to follow), and in particular this shocking orange. Black tie means formality (esp when white tie is close to non-existent nowadays), and formality calls for monotony, contrast and lustre. This is anything but (save for the sheen of silk).

Have you seen the Duke of Windsor (who is famed for being on the playful and rebellious side of the sartorial spectrum) in a bright coloured DJ? Prince Philip? Prince Charles?
If they are too English, what about 'King of sprezziness' Gianni Agnelli? Montezemolo?
What about American fellas such as Fred Adstire? Cary Grant? Gregory Peck?

Moreover the RL jacket is way too short and a bit too tight. In black tie, where everyone dresses similarly, those with a better cut and a more sophisticated combination of texture and lustre (and of course, a more regarded gravitas) will outshine others.
 

Royal_Airforce

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Im 5ft 7 and asían...i wear whatever I want...if u feel natural in it by all means do so...safety, comfort and fun....I think I posted my cream 4x1 shawl a few pages back in the black tie thread if u wanna go for abit of a trawl
Spotted :cool:

Guess I would have the shawls wider and rounder were I to commission one.
 

The Chai

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Spotted :cool:

Guess I would have the shawls wider and rounder were I to commission one.
For me with peaks...I would err on the wider side. Even if it’s too wide for your proportions it fits in. Shawls imo are the opposite. Better to err on the narrow side of things than the wide. Shaping a shawl is again very hard to get right. I think for a first mtm commission with a new operator that shawl 4x1 of mine came out rather nice. Proportion wise it fits in. Maybe a little wider perhaps but that’s really risking it. Wide shawls imo look goofy. I think you would fine my proportion wise is similar to bogarts casablanca dj
 

Royal_Airforce

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For me with peaks...I would err on the wider side. Even if it’s too wide for your proportions it fits in. Shawls imo are the opposite. Better to err on the narrow side of things than the wide. Shaping a shawl is again very hard to get right. I think for a first mtm commission with a new operator that shawl 4x1 of mine came out rather nice. Proportion wise it fits in. Maybe a little wider perhaps but that’s really risking it. Wide shawls imo look goofy. I think you would fine my proportion wise is similar to bogarts casablanca dj
The shapes are indeed quite similar, and meanwhile his has a fatter belly (at a width similar to the overlapping of the DB) if you look closer. But again the ideal shawl shape is quite subjective, and never the easiest to get right.
 

cweeks91

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I do enjoy lurking in this thread, it's one of my favourites on SF.

I'd be interested to hear some opinions on knitwear with black tie, specifically substituting in a roll neck?

To a proper black tie event i would always stick to black bow, SB black dinner suit, proper marcella or pleated shirt, cuffs & studs, cummerbund for the waist, and patent opera pumps / patent oxfords.

However these events are rare for me, it is much more common that I attend events where black tie is appropriate or 'encouraged', however i know people will be wearing suits of all shapes, sizes, and colours. For example some charity events and boxing events. Classic black tie just feels a little overdone on these occasions, so i'm considering switching in a nice fine black rollback with a bit of lustre to it and perhaps my evening wear Rake x B&L Sagans (patent with a small bow up top, suede down below) to soften things up a bit.

A bit confused about a waist covering though, if there is no white shirt to peep out and look untidy I'd think it wouldn't be required? Also my trousers are set for suspenders, i usually wear white moire ones and would probably switch those out for black moire with black leather loops.

I personally like the look, in my minds eye at least. What are your thoughts? Any good pictures?
 

The Chai

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I do enjoy lurking in this thread, it's one of my favourites on SF.

I'd be interested to hear some opinions on knitwear with black tie, specifically substituting in a roll neck?

To a proper black tie event i would always stick to black bow, SB black dinner suit, proper marcella or pleated shirt, cuffs & studs, cummerbund for the waist, and patent opera pumps / patent oxfords.

However these events are rare for me, it is much more common that I attend events where black tie is appropriate or 'encouraged', however i know people will be wearing suits of all shapes, sizes, and colours. For example some charity events and boxing events. Classic black tie just feels a little overdone on these occasions, so i'm considering switching in a nice fine black rollback with a bit of lustre to it and perhaps my evening wear Rake x B&L Sagans (patent with a small bow up top, suede down below) to soften things up a bit.

A bit confused about a waist covering though, if there is no white shirt to peep out and look untidy I'd think it wouldn't be required? Also my trousers are set for suspenders, i usually wear white moire ones and would probably switch those out for black moire with black leather loops.

I personally like the look, in my minds eye at least. What are your thoughts? Any good pictures?
If you’re gonna go for the rollneck look...which is something I do quite often I would just ditch the tux and wear a midnight blue suit or a dark equivalent. I have quite a few sbpl 1b and dbs for such an occasion
 

The Chai

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...I do occasionally wear my leather pumps with a grosgrain bow with this as they are my dancing shoes but I think a black suede or leather loafer/slippers would be more sf orthodoxy
 

Big A

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I do enjoy lurking in this thread, it's one of my favourites on SF.

I'd be interested to hear some opinions on knitwear with black tie, specifically substituting in a roll neck?

To a proper black tie event i would always stick to black bow, SB black dinner suit, proper marcella or pleated shirt, cuffs & studs, cummerbund for the waist, and patent opera pumps / patent oxfords.

However these events are rare for me, it is much more common that I attend events where black tie is appropriate or 'encouraged', however i know people will be wearing suits of all shapes, sizes, and colours. For example some charity events and boxing events. Classic black tie just feels a little overdone on these occasions, so i'm considering switching in a nice fine black rollback with a bit of lustre to it and perhaps my evening wear Rake x B&L Sagans (patent with a small bow up top, suede down below) to soften things up a bit.

A bit confused about a waist covering though, if there is no white shirt to peep out and look untidy I'd think it wouldn't be required? Also my trousers are set for suspenders, i usually wear white moire ones and would probably switch those out for black moire with black leather loops.

I personally like the look, in my minds eye at least. What are your thoughts? Any good pictures?
I think if you’re going to wear a tuxedo (Or any jacket with different facing on the lapels like velvet or grosgrain) a roll neck might look out of place. With a dinner jacket, maybe not but it still seems odd to me.

If you are going with a roll-neck, I’d go with a black suit instead
 

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