The State of Black Tie: Your Observations

Discussion in 'Classic Menswear' started by mafoofan, Nov 22, 2011.

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  1. jeff13007

    jeff13007 Senior member

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    Im not really an expert on the rules of Black Tie but what does his trousers being finished with a silk band have to do with a cummerbund or vest? I was under the impression that the cummerbund was there to catch bread crumbs, and a vest was required traditionally because shirts were considered under garments.
     


  2. unbelragazzo

    unbelragazzo Jewfro Dubiously Honored

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    As long as no shirt is showing under where the tux buttons, you're good. Waistcoat, cummerbund, silk band all serve that purpose.
     


  3. harry2quinn

    harry2quinn Senior member

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    I asked this on the quick question thread, thought this would be a good place to get more opinions.

    I have a black tie optional holiday party for work tomorrow. Of course, owning a dinner suit (single button, peak lapel, silk facings, patent leather, etc), I'm going to wear it.

    But since a) it's black tie optional and b) since most people twice my age will be wearing suits and I want be not too stuffy (while staying relatively true to the black tie uniform), I thought I'd add a tiny bit of creativity. I have a black watch tartan bow tie and cummerbund that I'm planning on, instead of a black bow tie and waistcoat.

    Thoughts? I've always thought of BW tartan as a very formal pattern (e.g., trews acceptable in black tie), so would this be considered an "acceptable" creative deviation as a part of an otherwise traditional outfit?

    (Note - I also have BW tartan wool pants, but thought that would be overkill)
     


  4. harry2quinn

    harry2quinn Senior member

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    I'm with you on the problems with 2 buttons and the high stance, but isn't every exposed button hole supposed to have a stud? Do you mean they're spaced too closely, hence showing three (which is too many)?
     


  5. Bradford

    Bradford Current Events Moderator

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    I think that would be perfecly acceptable and not nearly as obnoxious as the Royal Stewart tartan that you often see people wear at the holidays.
     


  6. jeff13007

    jeff13007 Senior member

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    Yup i get that, but my question was what does the silk band on the trousers have to do with any of that?
     


  7. unbelragazzo

    unbelragazzo Jewfro Dubiously Honored

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    When I've seen this done the silk band is wide enough that it serves as a waist covering. It's basically a cummerbund that's attached to the pants.
     


  8. unbelragazzo

    unbelragazzo Jewfro Dubiously Honored

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    It looks like from other pictures like his isn't like that though...to me it should be wider.
     


  9. jeff13007

    jeff13007 Senior member

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    ahhh got it. Thanks
     


  10. TimelesStyle

    TimelesStyle Senior member

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    That makes sense about the buttoning stance; were that a suit I don't think that high a stance would look right on anything but a 3-button. That being said, my tux is reasonably high buttoning, which is why I go cummerbund instead of waistcoat (waistcoat would peek out a little but not enough to look "right" without being too high).

    Agree with your other points as well.
     


  11. Testudo_Aubreii

    Testudo_Aubreii Senior member

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    My worry is that the contrast between a solid black/midnight blue SBPL with silk facings and a tartan bow tie is extremely strong, even if it's a subdued dark pattern like Black Watch. My father wears a subdued dark maroon paisley bow tie and cummerbund with his black SB shawl: it just looks odd. Remember that the focus of black tie is the triangle sitting inside the tie and jacket lapels. The tie and lapels are the triangle's borders.

    I think blacktieguide is on to something when it says:
    "[With a dark dinner jacket] Unlike the waistcoat, cummerbund or handkerchief, a contrasting bow tie is not framed by a dark color and therefore stands out as a glaring distraction."
    http://www.blacktieguide.com/Classic/Classic_Alternatives.htm

    But I think that's a little too strong. I'd say that a solid true maroon or solid dark indigo tie could work with a dark DJ.

    What about just wearing the Black Watch cummerbund with a regular black bow?

    Edit: Whoa! Missed that you have Black Watch trews! Why not wear those instead? Regular black cummerbund or vest, regular black tie. Will look perfectly appropriate for black tie optional.

    This, minus the tartan vest and Prince Charlie
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Jan 21, 2012


  12. mordecai

    mordecai Immoderator

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    More to come soon, but I will say that people in Los Angeles love you when you're in a tux.
     


  13. Digmenow

    Digmenow Senior member

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    [VIDEO]![/VIDEO]

    Wait. That's Vegas.
     
    Last edited: Jan 29, 2012


  14. gyalos

    gyalos Senior member

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    This is from his twittr account, not very clear photo but coat looks correct , bow-tie untidily tied as it should be, and overall nice which is peculiar for a hollywood star anyway.

    [​IMG]
     


  15. mrmax

    mrmax Senior member

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    Gents, what is your experience with midnight vs black facings (grosgrain) with midnight mohair/wool as the base? I believe midnight is preferable for the facings but it seems tailors, at least here in HK, have difficulty obtaining the color. Any ideas on a source for the facings?

    I have seen many pics of black facings on a blue coat but none with blue facings. If anyone could oblige or comment it would be much appreciated.
     


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