The Rise of Style Forum-born Entrepreneurs and their Impact on Style

[poorsod]

Vox,
I think it is the SF "group think" / aesthetic that drives business, not the other way around. I am much more influenced by what people are talking about, "the buzz" and when I see how they wear it. It is easier for me to like what a regular person is wearing than a model - a model will look good no matter what they wear.

E.g.
1) For the longest time I thought knit ties were crap until I saw how well PG/EGW was wearing them, and now I have many.
2) Recently I bought a length of the Simonnot-Godard chambray because I was curious about what you guys were waxing poetic.
3) G&G benefited from the huge buzz generated when they were starting up. I remember reading a quote from Tony that it would have otherwise taken them 10 years to build up their business.
4) I have EG Cappelli thanks to Manton's reports and the Soporific Tie Thread.
etc.

Now, I'm not buying stuff simply because other people are buying it . Rather they give me a lead as to what I might like to try. I can't judge a piece of clothing until I've used it for a while. So I buy one, see if I like it before buying more.

Originally Posted by aportnoy

Honestly I fail to see how looking at photos of clothing made by tailors in Naples (or Steed) can possibly be applied to RTW or MTM decision making. I am a bespoke customer and I can't think of a single time I've ever said to myself (or my tailor) "let's go for what Mariano or Mina did" for whomever nor would I expect someone to do likewise with what Raphael or Despos has made for me.

Whoopee posted this Chan a few years ago and I had Chan make it for me.

YMMV because it is not easy to for me to figure out what looks good just by the swatch. Edmorel and Eustace Tilley have been warming me up on the gunclub check. Now I have one in the works via NSM. I have the airforce blue Minnis flannel on my list thanks to Slewfoot.

That said, I do think highly of opinions tailors such as Despos. Recently I got matching trousers for a mohair jacket because Despos thinks that mohair is formal cloth and is best as a suit. Now I have a mohair BlazerSuit (TM). Shattuck (old henry) over at LL also seems quite insightful, particularly about the handling characteristics of particular cloth as he has to shape them. Manton's experience with different fabric books seems encyclopedic. Manton happens to be opinionated which is helpful when having to make decisions.

For me, most of my thinking is done before going to my tailor appointment.

 

[F. Corbera]

Originally Posted by JohnsNotHere

I actually meant the "great group of guys"... true for everyone on the list but Steve. I assumed deceased meant defunct. The guy did a disappearing act leaving buyers in the dark on orders for months.

The unfortunate Steve Aver saga

You're right to point that out...I'll take the reference out since it's not an active business anyway.

 

[T4phage]

Originally Posted by aportnoy

... Yes, you can tell me what you like to wear and what experience you have had with a particular fabric or the relationship that you had with a tailor but beyond that, perhaps you need to learn more?

seems as if my comment went over your head
one would have thought that owning so many shoes
from different makers
that you would have noticed and felt differences
apparently not

compare this to bengal stripe
whose knowledge is well appreciated.

 

[aportnoy]

Originally Posted by T4phage

seems as if my comment went over your head one would have thought that owning so many shoes from different makers that you would have noticed and felt differences apparently not compare this to bengal stripe whose knowledge is well appreciated.
Fine, you're a bespoke genius. Now we can all sleep better at night.

 

[eg1]

Originally Posted by Despos

First thought was "what a dopey response" but now I think "brilliant".

I see what you did there. Well played.

 

[SpallaCamiccia]

I have bought and learnt things on the forum that are not available on my country .

 

[sonlegoman]

Originally Posted by SpallaCamiccia

I have bought and learnt things on the forum that are not available on my country .

Damn the socialists!!! They do not let you learn how to dress properly and with style.

 

[DocHolliday]

As much as I'm enjoying the various discussions in this thread, I'll toss out what i think is a fairly simple explanation. For most posters, SF is their primary exposure to men's style. They are far more likely to see something new and interesting here than in real life. And not only might they see it once, as they might in a GQ ad, they might well see it over and over again, such as when PG adopted the bicolor knit. It's an advertiser's dream -- targeted, repeated product placement to a niche audience with money to spend and needs they didn't know they had. Suddenly, the forum's created its own market for bicolor knits, at least until PG moves onto his next fad.

In short, groupthink as it exists here isn't just a case of mindless sheep copying trends, but a reflection of the relatively little exposure most guys have to the world of men's style.

It's only natural, then, that sellers would spring up to meet the forum-created demand, especially when -- as in Kent's case -- the seller is part of that demand.

I do believe that sooner or later someone will win forum converts to something other than the soft-shouldered SF house style. Whether that person will be a Huntsman bespeaker who posts often enough in WAYW or the likes of RL/Tom Ford, we'll have to see.

It'll help, of course, when the winds of RTW shift enough that some new styles are available on deep discount.

 

[Kent Wang]

Originally Posted by Master Squirrel

The last "tailor's fete" was held in an architectural salvage yard. It was a blast.
These actually happen? Tell us more.

Originally Posted by F. Corbera

1. Brooks Brothers dressed the American urban WASP class from the mid 19th century until nearly the end of the 20th. It pioneered standardized sizing for gentlemen and high quality RTW. Brooks dressed politicians, it dressed business leaders, and it dressed American military officers (and still does, although not as commandingly.)
I'm curious about this. I saw the plate a while back of Brooks Brothers's work for Civil War officers. I assume the current business is MTM only, and costing at least $2000. I find it amusing that military officers would spend so much on a uniform while the top politicians these days stick to awful RTW costing much less.

 

[Threadbearer]

Originally Posted by DocHolliday

...a niche audience with money to spend and needs they didn't know they had.
Worth a requote because it might get missed in the longer post.

 

[JayJay]

Good post, Doc.

 

[Sam Hober]

"If you are one of these guys, and you are willing to chat in this thread, it would be great to hear what stylistically and aesthetically (rather than from business perspective) you wanted to do when you founded your business, and where you think you would like to take things from the standpoint of the style you promote."

Sam Hober does not fit the OP's profile as my father started the business 50 years ago before the internet but the internet has been a lot of fun and useful to us so my thoughts may possibly be of some interest.

When we started to focus on ties we used a lot of handwoven Thai silk which was a very small niche market then and now. We wanted to do this because of my wife's family background in weaving silk and my own appreciation of handwoven silk. We were not influenced by the internet.

We have always relied on gentlemen telling their friends about us and do not advertise at all. Now more and more the internet is speeding up the process of someone being happy with an order and telling a friend or in the case of clothing forums a fellow forum visitor what their thoughts are.

The growth of our silk collection into more conservative and mainstream silks was influenced by the internet yet - I have always felt comfortable wearing classic conservative clothes and this was reinforced by friendships which arose from the clothing forums.

Note I say friendships which means that I need to ask questions in an ongoing discussion.

Will who is mentioned in this thread, is one friend whose opinion is both very good and one whose ideas matched my own.

Mark Hober my father who is 82 is also an advisor if he were to meet Will they would agree on many aspects of ties in general. Especially an interest in grenadines and solid ties with texture.

In the future I see more of the same for us - classic clothing.

We have hundreds of new designs in the works but they are mostly based on traditional designs and colorways. This is both what I personally like and what our clients like - so I do not see clothing forums as a strong influence for us.

One future dream that I have is to expand our vertical integration.

We have farmed Mulberry leaves - fed silk worms - reeled and dyed (with natural dye) silk - finally weaving and after receiving an order making the tie. but recently our focus has been only on making ties as time has not allowed much farming (Our farmland is 5 hours away).

I would love to have all our raw materials made in house so that we can control every step of production completely. We would not save money but vertical integration would allow more designs and doing them faster and in smaller numbers.

So in summary, the internet helps us with a global reach but does not influence what we design and make that much. Instead we rely on my interests and the ideas of friends.

 

[philosophe]

Originally Posted by Slewfoot

From a buyer's perspective, a lot of it comes down to trust. I wholeheartedly trust that guys like Jamison and Ed and Mark and Alan are going to take the time and attention to source only top fabrics products and make them in a style that is in line with my own. That type of trust is valuable and something that cannot be duplicated at larger department stores. Also, they're simply great guys. Keep up the good work!

I agree with this wholeheartedly. I've bought a lot from Jamison and Ed, and each of them is a pleasure to deal with. I'd add that Carl (Shirtmaven) is terrific, too.

For me, SF is a chance to learn a lot from tailors (Jefferyd, Despos, et al), see a lot of interesting clothing combinations, and get ideas for what might look good on me. I'm sure that I'm influenced by what I see. In the end, though, each of us has to look in mirror and decide what looks good.

 

[JPHardy]

I'll toss out what i think is a fairly simple explanation.

Great post Doc.

 

[radicaldog]

Yes, Doc's post makes a lot of sense. It will be fun to watch when the Vox/Foo/Phat Guido of the structured look finally arrives, especially if he is vociferous as well as a good self-photographer: how will the various prominent posters coexist? Will the forum split up? Will the current sellers introduce structured stuff (well, accessories that go with that look) or will new sellers spring up?