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The Official Wine Thread

Discussion in 'Social Life, Food & Drink, Travel' started by audiophilia, Jul 20, 2009.

  1. venividivicibj

    venividivicibj Senior member

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    Never tried Keller, but heard good things about the limestones
     
  2. Griffyndor

    Griffyndor Senior member

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    ^ ooohh. I can make a strong case that he's the best white wine producer in the world (and the reds are pretty good if you like spaetburgunder). Grab a bottle of the kirchspiel or hubacker GG. They are the lower priced GG's (unfortunately still not cheap), but out of this world. The big guns - morstein, absterde, g-max are on a different level. And the pettenthal is one of the greatest whites I've ever had. The pradikat wines are every bit as good, but tricky to find in the US.
     
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  3. Piobaire

    Piobaire Senior member

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    Can you explain what you mean by this?


    Also, anyone have a Mendoza Malbec rec with very high typicity?
     
    Last edited: Oct 8, 2016
  4. Griffyndor

    Griffyndor Senior member

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    Yes - German wine classification system for wines with residual sugar (as opposed to dry wines). Will find a terry thiese summary and link it after dinner. He's better than I can do.
     
  5. Griffyndor

    Griffyndor Senior member

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  6. Manton

    Manton Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    Chateau Montelena 1986, which had been one of my favorite wines ever, is now seriously over the hill.

    1994 Monte Bello is a fucking masterpiece. :slayer::slayer::slayer:
     
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  7. Piobaire

    Piobaire Senior member

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  8. Griffyndor

    Griffyndor Senior member

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    Oh. Only because you can't find the Keller pradikat wines other than through Dee Vine (and their retailers) on the west coast and vom Boden on the east coast, and they don't get the full range. Like, you can find exactly zero bottles of pradikat pettenthal in the country. Maybe a spattering of other bottles at outrageous prices. But not much.
     
  9. Piobaire

    Piobaire Senior member

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    Ah, gotcha now, makes sense.


    Btw, the QmP system is not about RS but rather about ripeness level at harvest.
     
  10. Griffyndor

    Griffyndor Senior member

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    No, not quite. Ripeness dictates oeschle at harvest and is the first step in the pradikat system. Then comes harvesting technique and a minimum alcohol level. And within oeschle levels producers have enormous ability to differentiate their cuvees with stars, capsules and goldkapsels. My experience is that producers are selecting their offerings based on the final product and the amount of residual sugar.
     
    Last edited: Oct 8, 2016
  11. Piobaire

    Piobaire Senior member

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    Yes, yes, must weight and minimum ETOH, but as no chapitalization is allowed, that's all a function of grape sugar content, i.e. ripeness, at harvest. It is certainly not about RS which is what you said.
     
    Last edited: Oct 8, 2016
  12. venividivicibj

    venividivicibj Senior member

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    Confusing sometimes because you can have sweet auslese and dry auslese (depending on acid) - I've seen some 2015s with 10g+ acid

    And I can only find 3 or 4 different Kellers at my local stores on the west coast, and no 14/15s. Saw a 13 of the kirchspiel, so I'll check it out
     
    Last edited: Oct 8, 2016
  13. Griffyndor

    Griffyndor Senior member

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    Sure, but that isn't what gets you pradikat level. The dry wines can start out with high sugar content. The sweet wines (outside of TBA, some BA and eiswein) result from stopping fermentation before the wine is completely dry. Name a producers who doesn't star or capsule their wines? I can't thing of any producer who would take must weight at auslese level, make an off dry wine and call it auslese. Feinherb auslese 20 years ago, but everyone I interact with sells at the level of the final product. Anything else would be misleading.

    To put it another way: German dry wine = the ripeness level of German sweet wine + allowing fermentation of sugar to continue. Both the sweet and dry wine were picked at the same ripeness level. That is why the sweet wines are low alcohol: fermentation of sugar into alcohol is stopped. Ripeness level at harvest is the same.
     
    Last edited: Oct 8, 2016
  14. Piobaire

    Piobaire Senior member

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    All wines with high RS and low ETOH have had their fermentation stopped.

    I've had more than one bone dry Auslese and many Feinherb.

    But this is all just beyond the point that QmP is not about RS...which again...is what you said.
     
    Last edited: Oct 8, 2016
  15. Griffyndor

    Griffyndor Senior member

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    I think the bulk of the Keller dry wines have yet to hit the states. The sweet wines generally won't. 90% of my buying is in London but I've tried to add Keller and haven't had success. The 14s are well worth drinking and readily available (but no sweet wines of course).
     
  16. Griffyndor

    Griffyndor Senior member

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    What bone dry auslese

    No I didn't. I didn't say that at all. Read the quote. I said the pradikat system is the classification that governs wines with residual sugar. Show me a pradikat wine with no residual sugar?
     
  17. Piobaire

    Piobaire Senior member

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    Show you a pradikat wine with no RS? There's a crapton of trocken Kabinett. What you said is just wrong.
     
  18. Piobaire

    Piobaire Senior member

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    Also, sorry, I misspoke. Bone dry spatlese. I've had off-dry (haltrocken) auslese.
     
  19. Griffyndor

    Griffyndor Senior member

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    That is a good example of the pradikat system naming the wine based on residual sugar rather than must weight. Not sure it is used much any more now that there is a separate classification for dry wines...
     
    Last edited: Oct 8, 2016
  20. Griffyndor

    Griffyndor Senior member

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    There is bone dry auslese. It's labeled auslese feinherb and no one does it anymore as far as I know now that they can label it under the dry designation.
     

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