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**The Official Shoe Care Thread: Tutorials, Photos, etc.**

Discussion in 'Classic Menswear' started by Mr. Moo, Feb 28, 2011.

  1. Munky

    Munky Senior member

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    DWF, thank you for your steady hand on the tiller and for your wise words. Others would do well to read them. Chogall is also a long-time member of this thread and I have also learned much from him in the past. Best to get back to shoes and turn the heat down a little, perhaps.
     
  2. Stirling

    Stirling Senior member

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    We'll apparently I am a troll, nitpicking and not discussing shoe care and since others are long term members my opinions are of diminished value.

    Very we'll gents good day to you too.
     
    Last edited: Mar 2, 2014
  3. patrickBOOTH

    patrickBOOTH Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    Stirling, I don't think you're a troll and I understand that you work in the leather industry in some respect. That said, you have great knowledge few of us have here. I think the backlash that you got isn't as much about your experience or opinions, but rather your delivery and attack on others. Let's look at what you initially said: "Pretty bold statements there. Do you have any experience of the aforementioned products or do you just enjoy making outlandish posts?"

    How do you expect people to react to that? Either that's your intention, which is fine, but fact is, it is kind of douchey. That isn't even arguable. I think somebody with your experience (which is few and far between here) could be used to teach and instruct rather than "troll". If something was said that isn't correct in your experience correct and offer other insight rather than poking at the hornet's nest with such quips.

    I think I remember you saying you use Nivea after shave balm on leather when it needs conditioning. Not sure if that was in jest, but I'm curious to hear more about it.
     
    Last edited: Mar 2, 2014
    2 people like this.
  4. BootSpell

    BootSpell Senior member

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  5. Crat

    Crat Senior member

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    The shoe care wars continue I see. Debate without rudeness would make this thread so much nicer.
     
  6. patrickBOOTH

    patrickBOOTH Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    I don't mind rude as long as it's productive: "stop using so much renomat, you prick! You're killing your shoes!"
     
    1 person likes this.
  7. DWFII

    DWFII Bespoke Boot and Shoemaker Dubiously Honored

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    +1

    Well, it's hard to tell what's intended. Forums are notoriously poor at clear communications simply because communication is, for most human beings, more than just words on paper or on a screen.

    Maybe because of that, any time people are talking about issues of substance, instead of just stroking each others...ahem, egos...in response to yet another photo in an endless string of someones latest, and often mindless, acquisition, you're going to have disagreements. Frankly, I get bored..and even somewhat disgusted...with such gratuitous obsequiousness and puffery.

    That said, I haven't seen any outright trolling here. And, having been the target in the not so recent past, I feel that I know trolling when I see it.

    Beyond that, any time we become more concerned with how something is being said as opposed to what is being said, the stage is set for disagreement.
     
    Last edited: Mar 2, 2014
    1 person likes this.
  8. Crat

    Crat Senior member

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    Not always correctly though, as our previous discussion made clear.

    I agree with you that forums offer poor communication clarity which is why being less rude might be more productive than being more rude. Even, or especially, if you think that you are right.

    There is nothing wrong with disagreements but they can go without name-calling etc. Too often it seems that underlying emotions guide members' posts instead of logic but that is the same on all forums. The joys of typing angrily.

    Oh well, I'll let you guys get back to your little fights ;) shoe care.
     
  9. DWFII

    DWFII Bespoke Boot and Shoemaker Dubiously Honored

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    Actually, IMO, your strike-outs might be more provocative than all the more honest frustration that occasionally manifests itself in this thread. I didn't realize who you were til I just now saw your avatar (or I might have passed) but again, in my opinion, trolling begins and ends with people making divisive and contrary statements about things they really have no objective experience or knowledge upon which to comment.

    You have to ask yourself "why!?" If they so obviously know nothing...and it is obvious...and they so obviously are contributing nothing but hearsay and fundamentally singular or baseless opinion--nothing positive or constructive, at any rate--what is the purpose? Just to get their 2 cents in? Just to be heard? Just to be contrary? Just for the sake of provocation? (post 8326?) Or maybe just to run their post count up as high as they can in as short a time as they can.

    I took no offense but I wonder, frankly, what the strike-outs contributed? Other than....well, nothing positive, not that I can see.

    --
     
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2014
    1 person likes this.
  10. patrickBOOTH

    patrickBOOTH Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    To some degree I think people need to be ruffed up a bit. A shame, but the truth. Like I said, if it's productive. In the end some people need to be told.
     
  11. venividivicibj

    venividivicibj Senior member

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    interesting that all of a sudden Stirling is gone rather than trying to argue the "facts"
     
  12. cbfn

    cbfn Senior member

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    Great post on the roles of a conditioner, DW! However, I am not fully aware of the effect from over-doncitioning the leather? I am personally a fan of Lexol and, to some degree, coconut oil. Nonetheless, I usually apply Obenauf's leather oil on heav-weather footwear and appreciate it's water repelling effect. Obenauf's does darken the leather, it does probably suffocate the leather to a certain degree; but what are the long-term effects on the leather itself without regarding aesthetics? Does it loosen the fiber mat leading to premature cracking? Does the over-conditioned leather attract harmful objects like sand that leads to cracking?
     
  13. Stirling

    Stirling Senior member

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    Never my intent to cause offence, but evidently my way of writing things through this medium is not effective.
     
  14. Stirling

    Stirling Senior member

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    No actually I am here. If you have a question please ask and I'll try to answer to the best of my ability.


    I can see why you'd ask dwf about this but don't see where in his post he mentioned over conditioning. I mentioned that in my post.

    I'm done having my rant now.
     
  15. DWFII

    DWFII Bespoke Boot and Shoemaker Dubiously Honored

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    As you might expect, it depends on the conditioner.

    Currently, I like Bick4. Aside from a thin, dry, almost paraffin-like (?) residue that results from excess being left on the leather, I don't see how you could over-condition with it. And in normal use, it never darkens the leather...any colour leather.

    But I said "currently," because these products change. A respected member of SF told me that Lexol had recently decided to add more water to its formula. Sometimes such changes are as a result of EPA regs., sometimes just economies of scale.

    I don't know. I'm not a chemist...I'm just going on my experience with lots of different products and leathers and environmental conditions over the years.

    Naturally, any conditioner with heavy un-homgenozed oils or fats will leave a residue in/on the leather...and in the leather. And yes, it is possible to so overwhelm the fiber mat with oil that it becomes a rag. I've seen logger's boots that had no more body or resilience than chamois despite the boots beginning life with a firm 8-10 ounce cow hide. Beyond that, as the leather loosens and oils build up, yes, dirt and other fines accumulate and even work their way into the corium. And yes, that contributes to the breakdown of the leather structure and cracking.

    If you don't care about darkening the leather then I don't suppose it makes much difference how much of an oil based conditioner you apply. But the darkening is a sure tell-tale that the leather is becoming overloaded. If you think about it...when a leather darkens like that what you're seeing is the oil, not the leather.

    --
     
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2014
    1 person likes this.
  16. The Shoe Snob

    The Shoe Snob Senior member Affiliate Vendor

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    1 person likes this.
  17. tifosi

    tifosi Senior member

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  18. rutabaga

    rutabaga Senior member

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    Loads for me, now.
     
  19. The Shoe Snob

    The Shoe Snob Senior member Affiliate Vendor

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    Do you use Chrome? There is a setting in Chrome that for some reason makes my site not load...used to have this problem myself...

    If so, you have to un-tick "Predict network actions to improve page load performance" under Privacy, under advanced options in the settings...
     
  20. tifosi

    tifosi Senior member

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    No, I'm IE9 I think. I'll try it agin on my lunch break.
     

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