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The official CELINE thread

Fuuma

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I wonder if Saint Laurent is also getting hit, then it would help clue us in to how Hedi's style overall is not being well received with their customers. If customers were selectively buying Saint Laurent over Celine, then it would mean they specifically do not like Hedi's Celine aesthetic or Celine as a brand. Which would then lead to the answer to why Hedi is not motivated to create his own brand. Hedi acknowledges that commercial success is usually only possible when he is attached to an already established brand. In addition to a softer more androgynous style pushed at Celine compared to Saint Laurent, the name of the brand Celine is quite feminine. Celine, as a name, is a lot more ubiquitous as a girl's name and I suspect many men won't relate it to being a luxurious sexy fashion brand. For superficial people, "I'm wearing Celine" just doesn't have the same feeling as "I'm wearing Saint Laurent" or "I'm wearing Dior" to them. I'm almost 100% sure there wouldn't be this problem with Chanel. For most people, the first thing that comes to mind when you hear Chanel is the fashion brand. It is incredible tacky and trashy to name your daughter Chanel...but this is not true for Celine. LOL imagine if Hedi was at Chloé... I think removing the accent is absolutely vital. CÉLINE looks even more feminine than CELINE.


I have learned that a little friction helps to incentivize some passion and elevate the quality of discussion. I've learned interesting info from Deonfate, so I look forward to his replies. It helps me better contextualize Hedi's work and allows me to better understand why I like what I like from Hedi.
Céline is a girl name while Chanel (Chasnel in reality) is a surname. He first name was Gabrielle which happens to be the female version of a boy's name (written differently but pronounced the same) and somewhat uncommon as a girl name right now.

As for Céline it doesn't seem to be doing very well (pandemic put aside) because three times might not be the charm when repeating the same aesthetic with slight variations. I was already tired of Hedi at SL but keep checking what he's doing from time to time because I used to love DH, wish he'd let go of boyish rocker style and explored something else but hey, whatever.
 

SirGrotius

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Fuuma is a super high-quality poster, but yes, maybe a little removed (as he admits) from the Hedi universe, haha!

It does bring up somewhat of a divide, there are those here who welcome and embrace the softer, bourgeois, almost feminine touches at Celine and those who pine for the boyish rocker style. I lean a little more to the latter, not on the idea level, but because of fit. I've had many more issues with fit and Celine that Hedi's other lines.
 

thorns

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Céline is a girl name while Chanel (Chasnel in reality) is a surname. He first name was Gabrielle which happens to be the female version of a boy's name (written differently but pronounced the same) and somewhat uncommon as a girl name right now.
I always appreciate good info, thanks!

I used to love DH, wish he'd let go of boyish rocker style and explored something else but hey, whatever.
I'm so thankful Hedi grew out of the more experimental vibes he was pushing out in early Dior Homme seasons. I think what attracts me so much to Hedi's vision is how real it is. It is the antithesis of CCP and Rick Owens etc. The last thing I want to look like is some fashion victim trying to wear stage wear in everyday life. Many archive fashion boys' grail is the fw03 Napoleon jacket...but to me it just looks incredibly tacky to wear day-to-day. It is almost impossible to not look like a poseur in experimental avant-garde clothing. It looks affected and far removed from any semblance of being effortlessly cool.

1603304765661.png


Perhaps it is just a sign of the times. Looking like you put a lot of effort into things is not "cool". Seeing someone do cool things without seeming like they're trying is perceived as something much better and "authentic".
1603305442326.png
 
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kieran84

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Exactly. It may sound ignorant and I know it's only my opinion but looking like some kind of futuristic Edward scissorhands just isn't the thing and the reason I didn't start buying DH until VOTC. Aw 2004 onwards DH, Saint Laurent and Celine are clothes you can wear without looking stupid to normal people, and actually look cool / and or attractive.

I remember back in 2005 all the message boards were full of people that hated the indie style stuff and loved Luster and strip. I can't imagine where someone would actually wear those type of clothes.
 

GG Allin

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I always appreciate good info, thanks!


I'm so thankful Hedi grew out of the more experimental vibes he was pushing out in early Dior Homme seasons. I think what attracts me so much to Hedi's vision is how real it is. It is the antithesis of CCP and Rick Owens etc. The last thing I want to look like is some fashion victim trying to wear stage wear in everyday life. Many archive fashion boys' grail is the fw03 Napoleon jacket...but to me it just looks incredibly tacky to wear day-to-day. It is almost impossible to not look like a poseur in experimental avant-garde clothing. It looks affected and far removed from any semblance of being effortlessly cool.

View attachment 1481642

Perhaps it is just a sign of the times. Looking like you put a lot of effort into things is not "cool". Seeing someone do cool things without seeming like they're trying is perceived as something much better and "authentic".
View attachment 1481648
You obviously haven't seen this new rick Owens
 

Jabbathecunt

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Hedi makes me look and smell amazing and yes I watched Rick Owens but I'm definitely not wearing that.
 

thorns

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Throwback to another Hedi back shot with his slightly saggy skinny jeans during Saint Laurent era. Perhaps it is a remnant of his penchant for saggy jeans in his Dior Homme days.

1603347991814.png


One of his signature templates is all black + vintage brown belt.
1603348070831.png
 

SirGrotius

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I like that Hedi is often pictured carrying his sketchbook. I think that I mentioned earlier that I read an excellent book earlier this year called Meet Me in the Bathroom about the early 2000s NY art-rock scene (think the Strokes, Yeah Yeah Yeahs, Interpol, et al) and Hedi had a cameo in that he was mentioned as coming to a lot of shows in Brooklyn before it was the Brooklyn we know now, and always with a sketchbook in hand.
 

thorns

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I like that Hedi is often pictured carrying his sketchbook. I think that I mentioned earlier that I read an excellent book earlier this year called Meet Me in the Bathroom about the early 2000s NY art-rock scene (think the Strokes, Yeah Yeah Yeahs, Interpol, et al) and Hedi had a cameo in that he was mentioned as coming to a lot of shows in Brooklyn before it was the Brooklyn we know now, and always with a sketchbook in hand.
Not mentioned often, but one thing I am in awe of Hedi is how incredibly diligent he is in balancing so many things he does, and how he takes pride in making sure collections are done in advance instead of rushing things to the last minute. I feel like Hedi epitomizes the axion that if you love what you do, you never work a day in your life. You see him combine his passions of photography, art, fashion, and music all together.
 

GG Allin

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I like that Hedi is often pictured carrying his sketchbook. I think that I mentioned earlier that I read an excellent book earlier this year called Meet Me in the Bathroom about the early 2000s NY art-rock scene (think the Strokes, Yeah Yeah Yeahs, Interpol, et al) and Hedi had a cameo in that he was mentioned as coming to a lot of shows in Brooklyn before it was the Brooklyn we know now, and always with a sketchbook in hand.
One thing I've been thinking about the last couple days regarding the poor sales at Celine (pandemic aside) is whether there's less demand for these types of clothes at this moment. It's a little bit hard for us in this thread, who are pretty much all mad into the look with its slight variations, to look at this objectively. Granted, it's not the full-blown rocker look he was invoking at SLP, but it's not that far off.

I think when he was at SLP these types of clothes were much more popular than they are now in the mainstream. Think of all the bands at that time who would wear the rocker look (even boy bands were incorporating it). I wonder if this is just not the thing anymore; and that his success at SLP was just serendipitous.

I don't think this is the only reason for the lackluster performance. I think the point brought up earlier about how there's no clear pictures of how the clothes look on people is crucial. I still don't know how the classic pants look. Surely teh marketing people who work there aren't fools, and know that this absence is the kiss of death for your e-commence. I don't understand why he doesn't just do what the SLP website does and post an online lookbook for each season.

Finally, the fact that Celine isn't as well known as Saint Laurent has to be at play as well. I think everyone grasps this. Most normal people (who are looking at what Harry Styles or Lisa are wearing, and trying to emulate that) don't know or care about who the designer of a certain brand is. For them the clothes come before the designer, whereas for us it's sorta the opposite, if that makes sense.
 

thorns

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I think when he was at SLP these types of clothes were much more popular than they are now in the mainstream. Think of all the bands at that time who would wear the rocker look (even boy bands were incorporating it). I wonder if this is just not the thing anymore; and that his success at SLP was just serendipitous.
To me, Hedi's style can be broadly categorized as mainstream edgy. Because the clothes aren't experimental, they're "classics". Which also is the source of the main criticism against Hedi. People who are into "fashion" are bored of classical looking pieces. They crave novelty for novelty's sake. I feel like Hedi caters to a wide mainstream demographic. Here is a list of styles off the top of my head that Celine offers:
- black and skinny indie look
- black and more voluminous look that is on trend currently
- loud playful logos and more youthful streetwear
- bourgeois/prep/dark academia
- stage wear
- formal outfit for the red carpet or a formal event/work

It is difficult for me to imagine that Hedi's approach will ever go out of style. That said, he is not the only one offering these. Those who buy from Hedi either want the label, want something from Hedi, or want a specific detail/quality from the item that can't be found elsewhere. I think success is a combination of hard work and luck. Hard work and effort alone is not enough.

Finally, the fact that Celine isn't as well known as Saint Laurent has to be at play as well. I think everyone grasps this. Most normal people (who are looking at what Harry Styles or Lisa are wearing, and trying to emulate that) don't know or care about who the designer of a certain brand is. For them the clothes come before the designer, whereas for us it's sorta the opposite, if that makes sense.
I think there is truth in how some just want to replicate the look using other brands, but I also believe some are OCD enough to need the specific item. I remember there was a lot of internet hype around the Saint Laurent items Kanye wore and how it hyped them up. I think there are some people who would want Lisa's item just to feel closer to Lisa. I'm not too sure if there are a lot of North American celebrities rocking Celine besides G-Eazy. I don't sense a lot of online hype beast activity around Celine. Besides Lisa, Hedi and his team have been tapping into actors/actresses that are less mainstream/Hollywood. They were using a lot of French actors and actresses if I remember correctly. I think he's really trying hard to associate the brand as being unmistakably French, rather than LA.

 
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