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The Look goes on...

Kingstonian

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Well, what can I say? There I was thinking that second place in that esteemed company was a tolerably good outcome and you bring me back down to earth with a bump!

So, what do you advise? Should I sit out the next one?
It’s only one opinion and you got lots of votes.

Maybe try to dress it up a bit ? No jeans good footwear.

Harrington is strictly defined so an upmarket blouson would not qualify if you have one.
 

Clouseau

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It’s only one opinion and you got lots of votes.

Maybe try to dress it up a bit ? No jeans good footwear.

Harrington is strictly defined so an upmarket blouson would not qualify if you have one.
Well, and that's the interesting point, you have some cheap Harringtons and also very 'Upmarket' ones. That's why i think this new FC is very open and 'broad'...
 

Kingstonian

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So, what do you advise? Should I sit out the next one?
Maybe a photo on the golf course at the end of your swing as you just hit a really nice seven iron. Cap, nice jumper, clean pair of footjoys . Must be a really nice day on a course that drains well. No mud.
 

Mr Knightley

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I was reflecting further on the comments by @Kingstonian about the Harrington not being my forte. I noted too that similar views were expressed on the new FC thread relative to Frank Sinatra. And having reflected on the point I do now have some sympathy with that view.

Growing up in the late 1960s it was an aspiration to look just as good in your casual gear on Friday night at the local as it was to shine in your mohair on a Saturday at Ilford Palais. Never off duty.

But can a blouson and jeans or cotton trousers ever look as good as a three-piece bespoke suit or blazer and POW trou? It might appear more appropriate in certain casual settings, but to use Kingstonian's words it may lack the gravitas of a more formal fit. The structure and cut of a really good jacket can help to disguise imperfections and want of proportion in our bodies.

Whatever the quality of a Harrington, it is unlikely to achieve this same effect. Most Harringtons are too short on me but the sleeves always feel long. Add to that the complete lack of structure and the issues start to mount up.

So, maybe all we can look for in casual wear is the very best quality and cut we can afford (perhaps spending a little more than we can really afford) and rely on those qualities to carry the day. Casual wear is important. We only have to look at some igents who spurn casual clothes to see just how ‘wrong’ they can look in certain settings. But will it ever bring us, the wearers, the same satisfaction as a really good suit or tailored jacket and trousers and will it ever convey the same visual appeal to onlookers?
 
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Clouseau

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But can a blouson and jeans or cotton trousers ever look as good as a three-piece bespoke suit or blazer and POW trou?
Yes certainly. TBH i never see a "three-piece bespoke suit or blazer and POW troy" elsewhere than on SF.
And most of the people wearing them look dated.
The guys on the CM WAYWRN live in their own world that is not our world.
I even doubt they go out dressed like that, especially those who only take indoors pics.
There is also a question of money, i mean each to his own anall that, but frankly who can only wear bespoke or show-off a new suit every week ?
Ok you've got the ones that thrift too, but they usually look odd.
You've got to live with your time...so now i think smart casual is the way to go. There is a clear evolution. When i was a kid in the Paris streets almost every men wore suit and tie. Today they almost disappeared ! Unless if you go in the business areas, and even there you don't see many.
Some look good in casual, others in CM, some in both, other look bad in both.
Ageing is a factor, but not the only one.
Can't generalize...
 

cerneabbas

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I have liked MrK and Clouseau's posts because I think that this could be a good and necessary debate.

Work apart there seem very few occasions now in my life where wearing a suit would be necessary or even appropriate,sad but true I suspect for 99% of the UK population.

With the rise of central heating I feel that virtually any gathering will see the blokes in shirt sleeves in no time.

I think that (unfortunately) Clouseau is correct that times have changed,I wish that it wasnt so but we have to make the best of the time that we are in.

As for Clouseau's point about business men wearing suits,the majority of suits that I see being worn by people in their workplace are ill fitting and look like they were bought in Matalan etc,just look at most politicians here...or rather dont look at them.
Even in the late 60s early 70s Bowler hats could be seen but again times have changed.
There seem to be few places that enforce a dress code now and I suspect that any place that tried to enforce smart dress would not last very long (sadly).
So I think that the dreaded 'smart casual' is probably as 'dressed up' as 99% of people are going to get 99% of the time.

I have said before that I dont mind wearing a Harrington,OCBD,wool trousers and decent shoes together,the jacket will probably come off soon after arrival at destination anyway and it is practical for wearing in the car and probably a bit better protection against cold or wet weather than a Blazer.

I think that 'smart casual' is probably the type of dress most relevant to TLGO.
 

Clouseau

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As for Clouseau's point about business men wearing suits,the majority of suits that I see being worn by people in their workplace are ill fitting and look like they were bought in Matalan etc,just look at most politicians here...or rather dont look at them.
Yes i totally agree with that. Only a few men know how to dress in CM now, and usually they are old. Once again, have a look at the CM WAYWRN. I often comment in PM with a certain French friend who is on the board, and frankly we are usually desperate about the wrong looks, the lack of taste, the color combinations, the clash of materials, the lapels, etc… So we prefer to laugh. :-D

On the contrary, the CM casual thread is usually full of good surprises (not always though), i noticed that posters from both CM and SW&D threads converge on that thread, probably because smart casual is now the way to go indeed, more than often appropriate, in a work environment included.
If i take the example of my work, when i started more than 30 years ago, suit and tie was almost obligatory when you went to the office (in my case rarely, most of my work is done at home). Today i never see a suit, never see a tie, and when you wear a blazer and a shirt you almost look overdressed !
 

Thin White Duke

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On another non style related forum I look at, whenever someone asks for advice along the lines of needing a suit for a wedding or other event, there is always a plethora of people advising to get one from George at Asda as you can throw it out afterwards. Even my brother - hardly a sartorial icon but he knows me well enough - when I told him that last time I went home to England I took one dark navy suit plus shirt and tie just in case there was a funeral or impromptu wedding invitation, he replied that if it was him he would have just bought a cheap one if necessary and then thrown it out later.

This seems to be the modern mentality, that more formal clothing is used so rarely it’s now disposable like a Bic razor.

Anyway as for smart casual - here’s a cross post from the MC casual thread. Details on the blog ...

81401AC6-434D-4057-82D3-243165170ED4.jpeg
835B50FD-9ECB-4C0D-8309-AD6BDDDACC6B.jpeg
 
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cerneabbas

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I have seen similar advice about suits TWD.
As you say it is a modern mentality and not just about clothes,they will buy a tent etc for a camping holiday and chuck it in the campsite skip when they leave...look on YouTube for the aftermath of Glastonbury field after field of tents,mattress's etc etc waiting to be bulldozed.
 

Clouseau

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On another non style related forum I look at, whenever someone asks for advice along the lines of needing a suit for a wedding or other event, there is always a plethora of people advising to get one from George at Asda as you can throw it out afterwards. Even my brother - hardly a sartorial icon but he knows me well enough - when I told him that last time I went home I took one dark navy suit plus shirt and tie just in case there was a funeral or impromptu weeding invitation, he replied that if it was him he would have just bought a cheap one if necessary and thrown it out.

This seems to be the modern mentality, that more formal clothing is used so rarely it’s now disposable like a Bic razor.

Anyway as for smart casual - here’s a cross post from the MC casual thread. Details on the blog ...

View attachment 1283733View attachment 1283734
I think there is a new concept that is 'Junk clothing'. Like junk food : cheap, wear it a couple of times, then flush the toilets.
 

Yorky

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I have liked MrK and Clouseau's posts because I think that this could be a good and necessary debate.

Work apart there seem very few occasions now in my life where wearing a suit would be necessary or even appropriate,sad but true I suspect for 99% of the UK population.

With the rise of central heating I feel that virtually any gathering will see the blokes in shirt sleeves in no time.

I think that (unfortunately) Clouseau is correct that times have changed,I wish that it wasnt so but we have to make the best of the time that we are in.

As for Clouseau's point about business men wearing suits,the majority of suits that I see being worn by people in their workplace are ill fitting and look like they were bought in Matalan etc,just look at most politicians here...or rather dont look at them.
Even in the late 60s early 70s Bowler hats could be seen but again times have changed.
There seem to be few places that enforce a dress code now and I suspect that any place that tried to enforce smart dress would not last very long (sadly).
So I think that the dreaded 'smart casual' is probably as 'dressed up' as 99% of people are going to get 99% of the time.

I have said before that I dont mind wearing a Harrington,OCBD,wool trousers and decent shoes together,the jacket will probably come off soon after arrival at destination anyway and it is practical for wearing in the car and probably a bit better protection against cold or wet weather than a Blazer.

I think that 'smart casual' is probably the type of dress most relevant to TLGO.
I tend to agree with your comments, although when I go out to a decent place for dinner with the wife, I will still wear a suit or blazer/jacket and trousers combo. But unfortunately the other Patrons do not adhere to my own personal tastes. The same applies to my better half,who has never been into my style but dresses to the nines in clothes by her favourite designers, Chloe, Stella McCartney, Joseph, etc etc.
Having said that we often get compliments from other people, and find it a bit sad that they have to conform to what is now the norm.
I have never worked in a place that required a business dress e.g. a coal mine, but have worn many a Donkey Jacket. When I was made redundant I went into lecturing/ assessing in Electrical engineering, where I predominately wore smart casual, and possibly a jacket and tie to meetings with clients.
Going to a New Years meal at Harvey Nics Leeds and have bought a dark blue Velvet Double Breasted jacket to wear to it from TK Maxx by Feraud, still considering the rest of the outfit.
 

Jimmy Balantyne

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I was reflecting further on the comments by @Kingstonian about the Harrington not being my forte. I noted too that similar views were expressed on the new FC thread relative to Frank Sinatra. And having reflected on the point I do now have some sympathy with that view.

Growing up in the late 1960s it was an aspiration to look just as good in your casual gear on Friday night at the local as it was to shine in your mohair on a Saturday at Ilford Palais. Never off duty.

But can a blouson and jeans or cotton trousers ever look as good as a three-piece bespoke suit or blazer and POW trou? It might appear more appropriate in certain casual settings, but to use Kingstonian's words it may lack the gravitas of a more formal fit. The structure and cut of a really good jacket can help to disguise imperfections and want of proportion in our bodies.

Whatever the quality of a Harrington, it is unlikely to achieve this same effect. Most Harringtons are too short on me but the sleeves always feel long. Add to that the complete lack of structure and the issues start to mount up.

So, maybe all we can look for in casual wear is the very best quality and cut we can afford (perhaps spending a little more than we can really afford) and rely on those qualities to carry the day. Casual wear is important. We only have to look at some igents who spurn casual clothes to see just how ‘wrong’ they can look in certain settings. But will it ever bring us, the wearers, the same satisfaction as a really good suit or tailored jacket and trousers and will it ever convey the same visual appeal to onlookers?
The two are very different vibes and each has its place but for me, there's nothing quite like a well-tailored sports jacket with a good shirt. I've never been one for suits, I've had a few but they very rarely get worn and often, by the time they do, they're out of date. The myth of the suit that won't go out of style, is exactly that, a myth. The confidence inspired by a good sports jacket/blazer is incredible. For me, clothes, like manners, are armour. Peace Mr, Knightly.
 

Kingstonian

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I must confess that I do own two Harringtons including a beige one. Used to have three - gave one to my brother.

They are handy at times but I do find they are commonplace and a bit boring now. If someone of my vintage is wearing them I wonder if they wore one in the 60s.

As regards collar and tie and suits, it is nice to go up town because I can wear my old kit and fit in like I have just come from work. No questions asked. Local Wetherspoon is a bit more problematic unless I pop in on the way back from town.

Raynes Park Wetherspoon even has one customer who wears a cravat. Looks like a former academic or civil servant type. Drinks shorts until his large, overbearing wife comes in for him.

More typical is the retired chap who seems to wear PE kit all year round shorts, trainers etc but with a flat cap also worn indoors. All human life is there as one of the newspaper straplines used to say.
 

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