• Hi, I am the owner and main administrator of Styleforum. If you find the forum useful and fun, please help support it by buying through the posted links on the forum. Our main, very popular sales thread, where the latest and best sales are listed, are posted HERE

    Purchases made through some of our links earns a commission for the forum and allows us to do the work of maintaining and improving it. Finally, thanks for being a part of this community. We realize that there are many choices today on the internet, and we have all of you to thank for making Styleforum the foremost destination for discussions of menswear.
  • This site contains affiliate links for which Styleforum may be compensated.
  • LuxeSwap Auctions will be ending soon!

    LuxeSwap is the original consignor for Styleforum, and has weekly auctions that show the diversity of our community, with hundreds lof starting at $0.99 every week, ending starting at 5:30 Eastern Time. Please take the time to check them out here. You may find something that fits your wardrobe exactly

    Good luck!.

  • STYLE. COMMUNITY. GREAT CLOTHING.

    Bored of counting likes on social networks? At Styleforum, you’ll find rousing discussions that go beyond strings of emojis.

    Click Here to join Styleforum's thousands of style enthusiasts today!

    Styleforum is supported in part by commission earning affiliate links sitewide. Please support us by using them. You may learn more here.

The End of the Sartorial Road

RSS

Stylish Dinosaur
Joined
Apr 1, 2008
Messages
11,554
Reaction score
4,517
I’m thinking back to having talked about this back when. A number of members suggested depression.

I’m much less depressed now realizing it wasn’t depression then but rather the natural order of things. ;)
 
Last edited:

Texasmade

Stylish Dinosaur
Supporting Member
Joined
Apr 26, 2008
Messages
28,869
Reaction score
37,990
I’ve worn lederhosen for Oktoberfest in Munich. It felt like a costume for Oktoberfest that everyone else was wearing so I didn’t feel weird wearing it.
 

FlyingMonkey

Distinguished Member
Joined
Sep 5, 2011
Messages
7,131
Reaction score
11,036
This is just bullshit. I made no such claim. My statement was branching off Texas' statement that as an Asian he thought it was weird to wear another nation's dress. I was pointing out that even very Japanese-adjacent but not Japanese Asians felt the same, despite arguably feeling more culturally attached to Japan than they do to Taiwan (or certainly China).

This makes no claim about them or I having "special insight" into Japanese culture.

I wouldn't protest too much if I were you. I can read what you wrote. I also know my East Asian history (being a sometime scholar of the area), and your family-in-laws Japanese imperial connections are a really very odd thing upon which to base an appeal to authority - and that's definitely what it reads like. Had my wife been drinking tea when I read it to her she would have spat it out, she could scarcely believe it. As well as being Japanese, she's also a scholar by the way, and works on colonialism and indigenous peoples, so she was even more gobsmacked. I gave you a European analogy to help you out and I think it's a pretty good one - @gs77 got it. If you still don't realise how odd it your post was then there's very little I can do for you. See you in the funny papers...
 

ValidusLA

Distinguished Member
Supporting Member
Joined
Mar 14, 2019
Messages
4,095
Reaction score
5,996
I wouldn't protest too much if I were you. I can read what you wrote. I also know my East Asian history (being a sometime scholar of the area), and your family-in-laws Japanese imperial connections are a really very odd thing upon which to base an appeal to authority - and that's definitely what it reads like. Had my wife been drinking tea when I read it to her she would have spat it out, she could scarcely believe it. As well as being Japanese, she's also a scholar by the way, and works on colonialism and indigenous peoples, so she was even more gobsmacked. I gave you a European analogy to help you out and I think it's a pretty good one - @gs77 got it. If you still don't realise how odd it your post was then there's very little I can do for you. See you in the funny papers...

But you are saying I made claims I never made.

My point was non Japanese wearing kimono around the streets of Japan is costumey and weird, and white guys wearing it look like weebs. I responded with views about my in laws and how they would respond to the habit in response to another Asian gentleman saying he agreed it was weird.

I know this type of baiting is catnip to the Professoriat.

Considering what I've seen of you throwing around accusations bordering on racism charges on this board, I'm surprised you don't view white guys wearing yukata as cultural appropriation.
 
Last edited:

dieworkwear

Mahatma Jawndi
Dubiously Honored
Joined
Apr 10, 2011
Messages
27,320
Reaction score
69,995
I'm not Japanese and don't know anything about living in Japan, but have always felt a little uncomfortable seeing non-Asians wearing things like Visvim's noragi (and the many other fashion iterations). Would not call it cultural appropriation or racist. I just think it looks kinda corny.

Same with other Asian-derived styles, like Needles' "Chinese button" shirts. I can't shake the weeb association from my head.
 

ValidusLA

Distinguished Member
Supporting Member
Joined
Mar 14, 2019
Messages
4,095
Reaction score
5,996
I'm not Japanese and don't know anything about living in Japan, but have always felt a little uncomfortable seeing non-Asians wearing things like Visvim's noragi (and the many other fashion iterations). Would not call it cultural appropriation or racist. I just think it looks kinda corny.

Same with other Asian-derived styles, like Needles' "Chinese button" shirts. I can't shake the weeb association from my head.

To be clear, I don't think it's racist or appropriation either.

I think its weird looking and weeby.

I was saying I'm surprised he doesn't think it's appropriation.
 

FlyingHorker

Distinguished Member
Joined
Apr 27, 2014
Messages
4,884
Reaction score
5,599
it's interesting when a piece of clothing can cause revulsion due to looking too 'weaby' or possibly cultural appropriation.

I think it could be due to to how commonplace it is.

The popular drawstring trousers I've seen are essentially the pyjama(pants) half of kurta pyjamas worn in India. Pyjamas derivations are so ingrained globally, that it doesn't even ring as cultural associations with the average person.

1607368662315-png.1511898
 

dukenukem4ever

Distinguished Member
Joined
Aug 12, 2019
Messages
1,189
Reaction score
881
I only just read Validus' post, the one you're replying to, and I can't believe that you can have Japanese connections and not appreciate how way-out there it is. He's basically saying that his in-laws being far-right neo-imperialists (and Taiwanese to boot) gives them some special insight into wider Japanese culture and what's acceptable in contemporary Japanese society. Frankly it's one of the most jaw-droppingly weird things I've ever seen argued here and I'm amazed no-one's picked this up. the equivalent would be if I said my in-laws were Hungarian Nazi-sympathizers so they really know traditional German culture...

And BTW, I am sure you know that there is an enormous difference between formal kimono - which I have never worn, mainly because I have never had an occasion to (I do have a complete set gifted to me by my wife's uncle and aunt) - and things like yukata or jinbei, which is what the original conversation was about. I wouldn't wander around dressed like in full kimono, and for that matter, hardly any Japanese men would these days. But why would you feel weird wearing yukata on jinbei in super hot days in summer? Have you never been to an onsen town? it would be weird if you didn't wear yukata in Kinosaki (or wherever). What about sutetoko? What about sashiko or boro? And what about labels who make clothes influenced by traditional styles, like Sou-Sou? Or plenty of what Kapital or Visvim make?

It seems to me that, by your own account, your feelings are influenced by a sense of insecurity and being misunderstood. I get it. My Japanese is functional rather than fluent. And anyone who's spent long periods of time living in a different culture has felt that way sometimes, and of course I'm particularly conscious of difference - after all, I do cross-cultural social research. But I have a lot of close friends and colleagues (and in-laws) in Japan, and I have never come across anyone who had a problem with non-Japanese wearing Japanese clothes. After all, Japan may be the most magpie culture in the world and shamelessly appropriates anything and everything, absorbing, remaking it and more. It always seems to be non-Japanese (or some lunatic nationalist fringe) who have the issue with Japanese clothes, or indeed with making up all kinds of other imaginary norms of behaviour in Japan, when there are more than enough actual norms to worry about already...
I have no issues with anyone wearing what they want of course ! I just feel it is weird , just my opinion. I have never felt comfortable wearing yukata and just stuck to my linen shorts and linen shirts which is what I saw many many many more people in Japan wear versus Yukata even in the dead of summer.
again no issues with anyone wearing what they want I simply think it’s weird that’s all. I can feel that it is weird right?
you’re right about insecurity perhaps. I remember taking Japanese lessons a long long long long time ago in Kobe. Every time I spoke Japanese it felt so out of place for me. I could never master it. But when I lived in Taipei for several years for work and learned mandarin on the side it was quite easy for me to pick up and I use it regularly communicating with business partners in China.
no idea what we are talking about anymore lol.
As for the Taiwanese wife’s relatives being brainwashed by Japanese imperialists … errrrrrr I didn’t have any comment on that. My bad.
 

comrade

Distinguished Member
Joined
May 10, 2005
Messages
9,038
Reaction score
2,326
I’ve worn lederhosen for Oktoberfest in Munich. It felt like a costume for Oktoberfest that everyone else was wearing so I didn’t feel weird wearing it.
I was in Munich during Oktoberfest.The only thing Germanic that I wore was a pair
of Ludwig Reiter suede derbies, aside from my SS dagger.
 

hpreston

Distinguished Member
Joined
May 10, 2011
Messages
3,592
Reaction score
7,565

smittycl

Stylish Dinosaur
Supporting Member
Joined
Jul 13, 2012
Messages
20,303
Reaction score
33,576
I’ve popped in here from time to time. I don’t think I’m at the end of the road yet. I’m certainly slowing on purchasing, but still have a long term wishlist.

Due to space I am in the one in, one out phase (praise LuxeSwap)
Yeah, I do that as well. Just sent them two boxes of stuff and am eyeing a tailoring purge at some point.

Getting to the point where all bases are basically covered and anything new is just nice to have rather than a necessity.
 
Last edited:

lordsuperb

Distinguished Member
Joined
May 30, 2009
Messages
9,059
Reaction score
12,720
Yeah, I do that as well. Just them two boxes of stuff and am eyeing a tailoring purge at some point.

Getting to the point where all bases are basically covered and anything new is just nice to have rather than a necessity.
I am technically there; I need to purchase a few pair of pants but I have all the basics and wants (purple tragedy) covered. Will look to purchase a few tailoring things from NMWA when I have a major itch to scratch.
 

Featured Sponsor

Do You Have a Signature Fragrance?

  • Yes, I have a signature fragrance I wear every day

  • Yes, I have a signature fragrance but I don't wear it daily

  • No, I have several fragrances and rotate through them

  • I don't wear fragrance


Results are only viewable after voting.

Forum statistics

Threads
509,014
Messages
10,606,706
Members
224,793
Latest member
rieux
Top