The Desktop PC Building Thread

Discussion in 'General Chat' started by AR_Six, Jul 23, 2010.

  1. whiteslashasian

    whiteslashasian Senior member

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    I've had good experiences with Sapphire and HIS ATI cards.

    I really don't know how you'd eat up 4gb of ram playing a game. Even running the latest games with many programs in the background I only end up utilizing 2.8 to 3gb. I keep my W7 memory usage to a minimum by removing a lot of the clutter that runs in the background though.

    $60 for a 212+ is a bit steep. You can usually find similar coolers (with direct heat pipe contact) for ~$30-40.

    Where do you plan on buying your hardware? newegg.ca? ncix? Local shop?
     
  2. AR_Six

    AR_Six "Sookie!"

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    I have been mostly buying at memoryexpress here locally (they also have a website more or less identical to NCIX and Newegg.ca), by price matching newegg and ncix where necessary. The staff has been pretty helpful and I would rather give them my money. That being said I am buying my monitor off Newegg.

    I think in terms of exhaust, my case setup is looking to have a side panel with a nice big 200mm fan right above the GPU, so I probably want it to exhaust that way I would think.
     
  3. Hartmann

    Hartmann Senior member

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    Some cards also have aftermarket mods, those are useful if you plan on overclocking. I have the ATI 5770 with copper heatsink, but to be honest it runs everything great on stock anyway as I just play at 1600x1050.
     
  4. AR_Six

    AR_Six "Sookie!"

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    Yeah, if I can bump up to max res on a 28" I will, aside from online playing NHL where not stuttering is absolutely crucial.

    The reason I ask about ATI branded cards is this. I have my old laptop in for warrantee at future shop, and it's probably going to be DOA, so they'll either give me a new one or store credit. I don't need a new one, I already have one. So I might just take store credit and put it towards a 5.1 system for this setup, a cheap optical drive (no need for blu ray as I have a dedicated player hooked to my plasma), and POSSIBLY, a GPU.

    Here's the problem: this is a bit overpriced

    http://www.futureshop.ca/en-CA/produ...024mbgddr5p-en

    and I can't find it anywhere else to pricematch. 5850s come in at 300 or so on NewEgg, except for the sapphire toxic which is a little more. Moreover if you look at the specs, futureshop reports the core clock speed on all the ATI cards as 400mhz, whereas the standard for HIS, Sapphire, XFX et al. seems to be 750-800mhz. The memory clock speed is 1000mhz whereas some cards go a bit above that whereas there's an XFX that reports 4000mhz. I tend to conclude from that that the ATI card is inferior to the others.

    EDIT: Also, fuck that card, it doesn't even have an HDMI out.
     
  5. javyn

    javyn Senior member

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    FWIW, if you intend on running Ubuntu or any other Linux distro, avoid ATI cards. Horrible driver issues. If you just intend to run Windows 7, disregard this post.
     
  6. AR_Six

    AR_Six "Sookie!"

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    Will be running win7. Whenever my new laptop gets delivered it should come with a copy.
     
  7. KenN

    KenN Senior member

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    Yeah, if I can bump up to max res on a 28" I will, aside from online playing NHL where not stuttering is absolutely crucial.

    The reason I ask about ATI branded cards is this. I have my old laptop in for warrantee at future shop, and it's probably going to be DOA, so they'll either give me a new one or store credit. I don't need a new one, I already have one. So I might just take store credit and put it towards a 5.1 system for this setup, a cheap optical drive (no need for blu ray as I have a dedicated player hooked to my plasma), and POSSIBLY, a GPU.

    Here's the problem: this is a bit overpriced

    http://www.futureshop.ca/en-CA/produ...024mbgddr5p-en

    and I can't find it anywhere else to pricematch. 5850s come in at 300 or so on NewEgg, except for the sapphire toxic which is a little more. Moreover if you look at the specs, futureshop reports the core clock speed on all the ATI cards as 400mhz, whereas the standard for HIS, Sapphire, XFX et al. seems to be 750-800mhz. The memory clock speed is 1000mhz whereas some cards go a bit above that whereas there's an XFX that reports 4000mhz. I tend to conclude from that that the ATI card is inferior to the others.

    EDIT: Also, fuck that card, it doesn't even have an HDMI out.


    You have to remember that ATI designed the schematics, layout and the ASIC for the original reference design, so they know what they are doing. If the vendors, partners and OEMs are bumping up the core voltage and mvdd while still using the reference design, they are technically overclocking the card. Performance is not entirely dependent on MHz and voltages.
     
  8. AR_Six

    AR_Six "Sookie!"

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    Well it seems to me that it's not worth paying a premium for a card that isn't overclocked when there are others that have done so while maintaining reasonable heat levels. Not to mention my monitor is HDMI and no hdmi out is a dealbreaker. Why ATI wouldn't put something as obvious as that on a self-branded card retailing originally for over 400 bucks boggles this observer's mind. Even if price was a non-factor, the other-branded cards look better statistically and have a fairly solid background of reviews to look at.
     
  9. javyn

    javyn Senior member

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    I hate to derail, but I have been wondering this. Why do people spend so much money and effort to overclock?

    I'm not talking about bumping up a 2.9 ghz to 3.2 on stock cooling/voltage.

    But the serious people, who go out, mod their cases, buy water cooling systems, etc. What's the point when in all likelihood, it's cheaper to just buy the faster processor?

    Or is there no good reason, as I'm assuming there isn't, and it's the same thing as people ricing out their Hondas?
     
  10. AR_Six

    AR_Six "Sookie!"

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    Who even knows. Though I'm sure a lot of them just get the fastest damned processor they can, and do the other stuff to avoid the larger expense of frequent upgrades. For me, I figure 3.4ghz quad is probably plenty to handle anything I'm going to need to do anyway.
     
  11. javyn

    javyn Senior member

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    Cool. I'd like to chime in more here, but I don't think I can offer anything that hasn't been mentioned already. Enjoy your build.

    I'd also like to tout my love for Gigabyte motherboards, but OP got an Asus, and am not going to get into a Gigabyte v. Asus debate. That's like fighting over Coke v. Pepsi, or Tastes Great v. Less Filling.
     
  12. imschatz

    imschatz Senior member

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    I hate to derail, but I have been wondering this. Why do people spend so much money and effort to overclock?

    I'm not talking about bumping up a 2.9 ghz to 3.2 on stock cooling/voltage.

    But the serious people, who go out, mod their cases, buy water cooling systems, etc. What's the point when in all likelihood, it's cheaper to just buy the faster processor?

    Or is there no good reason, as I'm assuming there isn't, and it's the same thing as people ricing out their Hondas?

    It's a hobby.

    Anyone can take $1000, buy PC components, and plug them together to make a PC. And I mean anyone. But to take a $1000 PC and make it perform at the same level as a $1500 PC via overclocking takes some skill and patience. That's the really fun part about building a PC.

    And in the short run .. yes it may be cheaper to buy the better components, but when you upgrade processors every couple years, and keep the same case/cooling system, overclocking in the long run is much cheaper.
     
  13. imschatz

    imschatz Senior member

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    I hate to derail, but I have been wondering this. Why do people spend so much money and effort to overclock?

    I'm not talking about bumping up a 2.9 ghz to 3.2 on stock cooling/voltage.

    But the serious people, who go out, mod their cases, buy water cooling systems, etc. What's the point when in all likelihood, it's cheaper to just buy the faster processor?

    Or is there no good reason, as I'm assuming there isn't, and it's the same thing as people ricing out their Hondas?

    It's a hobby.

    Anyone can take $1000, buy PC components, and plug them together to make a PC. And I mean anyone. But to take a $1000 PC and make it perform at the same level as a $1500 PC via overclocking takes some skill and patience. That's the really fun part about building a PC.

    And in the short run .. yes it may be cheaper to buy the better components, but when you upgrade processors every couple years, and keep the same case/cooling system, overclocking in the long run is much cheaper.

    Not to mention you get more life out of your motherboard. Most of these components last way beyond the time needed by the user. For example: a motherboard for a techy may be worthless after a couple years, same with the processor. To overclock it to a level to keep the user satisfied with performance for another 6-months to a year said user may be able to wait until the next gen of software/hardware before doing an entire rebuild. Think all the people who build top-end machines 3-4 years ago that still want to play top end games. Their systems may have been getting pretty outdated and they might have been thinking about replacing and upgrading to Vista .. but with some tech skills could of overclocked and waited until Windows 7 was released instead.

    Oh and back to the hobby point .. Think about those guys who put $10,000 stereo's in their cars just to make as much noise as possible. It's completely impractical but they enjoy it. Same goes for PC builders. Watch the youtube videos of the guys back in the P4 days using liquid nitrogen to OC those processors to unheard of speeds. Just facinating stuff.
     
  14. javyn

    javyn Senior member

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    Yeah, I didn't take into consideration the fancy cooling systems can last forever. Still though, I have an AM3 Propus Quad, and when it's out of date, I'll probably slap something better in for AM3 I get off craigslist after the AM4, 5, whatever comes out.

    Different strokes.
     
  15. AR_Six

    AR_Six "Sookie!"

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    Thing about AMD is they're really good for backwards compatibility, so even if you need to swap out the CPU at some point, your Mobo should last you a while. The currend AM3 processors will work with a large number of previous gen boards apparently, for example. I think it's more an issue of needing to upgrade if PCI-E is no longer the standard, or if you need more slots than you have currently, that kind of thing.

    As much as cpu cooling and stuff like that outlasts current tech you also have to realize there's going to be some cool new thing on the horizon in that department too. Just because hydro is in vogue right now doesn't mean someone won't find a better way, wasn't that long ago no one used water cooling.
     

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