The Bespoke Shoes Thread

[dauster]

this is not a sports coat, but doesn't really quite cut like a overcoat (buttoning point, seems impractical, I guess London is just not that cold), I thought this looks pretty good

Permanent Style

Michael Browne bespoke coat: Review

www.permanentstyle.com

I also like this Thom Sweeney (though not c "clear" angle I suppose)

Permanent Style

Thom Sweeney jacket and trousers

www.permanentstyle.com

true the thom browne topcoat is amazing. unlike the other stuff

 

[dauster]

My first time in Dallas, I wandered into Highland Park with a coworker and we found ourselves in the Beretta store. It was nuts: there were all the usual things that go bang, but on top of it were $10,000 shotguns with elaborate engraved buttstocks, gold thermoses, shiny optics, and the clothes! Oh the clothes. So many tweeds with half belt backs, biswing shoulders, shoulder patches, and bellows pockets. The salesman even talked to me about having a jacket made to order with a left-side shoulder patch to accommodate my handedness. I was pretty stoked, 10/10 would buy everything if I could.

When he walked away though, my coworker, a proud Midwestern hick, scoffed and went, "This place is a ******* poser factory." I didn't know him very well at the time so I just showed him the features of the jacket and we moved on, but have since learned that he goes hunting/shooting in jeans, a Field and Stream shirt from Costco over his Underarmour t-shirt, Danner boots, and that big ugly vest full of pockets, and his weapons come from some guy with a store near his dad's house. He's much better at this thing than any upper class twit dressed like a Cordings mannequin, so there's that. I did eventually turn him on to Spier and Mackay and Allen Edmonds though and it stemmed from our little jaunt through that shop, so we'll call the trip a success though.



I think it's dress-up any way you cut it. A few years ago I went on a skeet-shooting date with someone whose only experience with guns was season 1 of The Crown. It was actually her idea and in her excitement she tried to do the costume thing with items she had (jeans, riding boots, flannel shirt, quilted Barbour jacket....in Los Angeles...). As we walked through the of parking lot she was pretty giddy at the sounds of the guns going off...Then we rounded the corner and she was like "...oh this is it?" at the sight of 50 sloppy fat old guys in t-shirts and shorts chatting while taking turns shooting. Apparently it wasn't the sartorial failure that disappointed her the most though; rather, she had been expecting that each shooter would have access to multiple shotguns, which their assistants loading each one for them. Instead it was just one assistant (me) and we only had the one gun between the two of us, which she kept whacking into the batting cage thing. Sometimes reality just isn't that glamorous.

Love this, pretty much sums up my life expectations of a beautiful shooting day in the highlands were the butler serves me wine and nicely plated food but reality is what you described.

But I think more than anything the difference is US vs UK. Same goes for golf - my driving range looks like a bunch of homeless guys decided to hit balls, while the Japanese and British at least look decent when playing golf.

 

[marlinspike]

All that said, one of the best shooters I ever shot with was also the richest guy I ever shot with who had custom made Purdeys that cost more than my car.

 

[Texasmade]

All that said, one of the best shooters I ever shot with was also the richest guy I ever shot with who had custom made Purdeys that cost more than my car house.

ftfy

 

[marlinspike]

ftfy

Eh, I think he said they were 80k each.

ftfy

Sorry, I wrote Purdey but meant Perazzi. He flew to Italy for the fittings, I think he said they were 80k.

 

[bdavro23]

All that said, one of the best shooters I ever shot with was also the richest guy I ever shot with who had custom made Purdeys that cost more than my car.

Speaking of Purdey, a shop in town used to carry their clothing line for a couple of years. Genuinely, it was ****, with terrible cuts, hideous tweeds and knitwear that would embarrass a hobbyist. I knew the owner pretty well and was there when the Purdey rep was in the store to talk about their buy for the upcoming season. Just for fun, I asked if I could buy a couple of shotguns through him and he looked like he was fighting the urge to start making out with me.

Custom guns, according to him, started at $100k...

 

[ValidusLA]

Oh the world of custom over unders.

One of the older gentlemen I shoot with - his "everyday" OU is a custom K80. He has a few Holland and Hollands which are out of control. Also an amazing shot.

Over Unders at the high end are watch and car level insanity. Most of the guys I shoot with make my 3.5k gun look like a starter toy.

 

[dieworkwear]

This my custom gun

 

[bdavro23]

Oh the world of custom over unders.

One of the older gentlemen I shoot with - his "everyday" OU is a custom K80. He has a few Holland and Hollands which are out of control. Also an amazing shot.

Over Unders at the high end are watch and car level insanity. Most of the guys I shoot with make my 3.5k gun look like a starter toy.

Ask them if they want to buy clothes from me. I'll come out after the world restarts and give them another outlet to seed small business...

I'll buy you lunch if it works out

On guns: A guy I used to shoot with occasionally is close to being a billionaire, if he isnt already. His gun of choice was a Winchester 101 that he had slightly modified. I always liked that about him, even though he was kind of an asshole.

 

[bdavro23]

This my custom gun

View attachment 1558868
View attachment 1558870

I also liked Contra. Now I feel old...

 

[ValidusLA]

Ask them if they want to buy clothes from me. I'll come out after the world restarts and give them another outlet to seed small business...

I'll buy you lunch if it works out

On guns: A guy I used to shoot with occasionally is close to being a billionaire, if he isnt already. His gun of choice was a Winchester 101 that he had slightly modified. I always liked that about him, even though he was kind of an asshole.

He's about 40 years my senior. From Oklahoma - only in LA because he used to be a CEO out here before he retired.

I don't think he would take clothing tips from me! Never seen him in CM. Likes guns, likes cars, likes good wine, but he's a jeans and ocbd kinda guy.

 

[shackletonian]

Last GJC update for a few months, I suppose. I received the alligator wholecuts back this week. When I placed the order, I asked for a belt to match the shoes. The new pair has a different color and finish, so the belt doesn't match (bad). The leather quality is better than before (good), but one shoe still has a lot of rough patches (bad). Additionally, the shoes have a fit problem on the right foot, small toe, that is bad enough that I can't wear the shoes. It has been a problem on every pair of shoes and iteration that I have had with both this and the loafers. I was also surprised because GGJR had not replied to my previous email and then sent these to me without warning.

I was so frustrated by the process that I dreaded opening the box and was anxious about trying the shoes on. First, we looked at the leather quality, learning from last time, and noting the issues. I waited a few days before emailing GJC again because I had to do the think all customers who pay $8000 for a pair of shoes love to do: worry that they are being overly critical. After some reasonable assurances, I decided to voice my frustration and exasperation and demand (not request) a refund for the shoes, the process, and lack of discussion with me.

Yet again I was damned for previous kind words offered and polite understatements about issues I knew that they could address.

GGJR brought up two other instances in which I tried to cancel or return other "MTO" orders. In 2019, April, I ordered a pair of Riviera loafers. GGJR kindly waived the MTO fee, not at my request. The shoes supposedly had a 3-4 month make time. By November, I asked whether the order could be cancelled because it was winter. I was told 'no' because they were finally made and sending out. Ok! I had bought a pair of AC Churchills in their shop in March 2019 and had them shipped to me in the US, but the size was off. This shouldn't have surprised me: I have bought 4 pairs of AC shoes, all in the same size. My first, a used pair of Bodies purchased off SF, fit very well. Two pairs of AC (de Rede and Bulows) were purchased by 3rd party retailers and they fit... differently. The de Rede was a boat. The Bulow was like a full size too small. The Churchills were too large, too.

GGJR explained that the adjustments had been noted for my left foot (not right) and that the "fit should be perfect" and that the loafers needed more work than my initial emails about a "bit of slippage." He also told me that, if I want to discuss it further, I should do a trunk show.

My reply broadly noted that I had explained the tone of my comments before and wasn't worried about being understated because I knew that they would see the issues. I didn't understand how they could say the loafers needed to be remade in January 2021 and not October 2020 when they say the amount of gap. I noted that my tone changed in January because my patience was out and the quality of the alligator shoe and leather was so insulting.

To the point about how the fit "should be" and the notion that bespoke products are not returnable, I suggested that, perhaps, I should tell my right foot that it needs to fit the shoes better, that I know other people have returned shoes to them, and other professionals in the bespoke shoe industry (and involved in shoe repair) had advised me to demand a refund.

I don't know whether I will receive a response. In the past, GGJR doesn't always reply. I can say that the process was promising enough at the start, but I missed some probable warning signs and the process devolved into a disappointing mess of an experience. The experience put a bad enough taste in my mouth that it almost turned me off bespoke footwear altogether.

Caueat emptor, I suppose, and, if you're a person new to the world of bespoke, do your research. If you see signs of issues with a maker, dig deeper and don't trust rumors.

 

[clee1982]

really s*cks, guess just not a lot recourse at this point...

on AC RTW, think the issue is they use different manufacturer (though most likely same for a given model), there have been EG/CJ/AS, so I guess depends on which sizing can be all different...

 

[laufer]

Last GJC update for a few months, I suppose. I received the alligator wholecuts back this week. When I placed the order, I asked for a belt to match the shoes. The new pair has a different color and finish, so the belt doesn't match (bad). The leather quality is better than before (good), but one shoe still has a lot of rough patches (bad). Additionally, the shoes have a fit problem on the right foot, small toe, that is bad enough that I can't wear the shoes. It has been a problem on every pair of shoes and iteration that I have had with both this and the loafers. I was also surprised because GGJR had not replied to my previous email and then sent these to me without warning.

I was so frustrated by the process that I dreaded opening the box and was anxious about trying the shoes on. First, we looked at the leather quality, learning from last time, and noting the issues. I waited a few days before emailing GJC again because I had to do the think all customers who pay $8000 for a pair of shoes love to do: worry that they are being overly critical. After some reasonable assurances, I decided to voice my frustration and exasperation and demand (not request) a refund for the shoes, the process, and lack of discussion with me.

Yet again I was damned for previous kind words offered and polite understatements about issues I knew that they could address.

GGJR brought up two other instances in which I tried to cancel or return other "MTO" orders. In 2019, April, I ordered a pair of Riviera loafers. GGJR kindly waived the MTO fee, not at my request. The shoes supposedly had a 3-4 month make time. By November, I asked whether the order could be cancelled because it was winter. I was told 'no' because they were finally made and sending out. Ok! I had bought a pair of AC Churchills in their shop in March 2019 and had them shipped to me in the US, but the size was off. This shouldn't have surprised me: I have bought 4 pairs of AC shoes, all in the same size. My first, a used pair of Bodies purchased off SF, fit very well. Two pairs of AC (de Rede and Bulows) were purchased by 3rd party retailers and they fit... differently. The de Rede was a boat. The Bulow was like a full size too small. The Churchills were too large, too.

GGJR explained that the adjustments had been noted for my left foot (not right) and that the "fit should be perfect" and that the loafers needed more work than my initial emails about a "bit of slippage." He also told me that, if I want to discuss it further, I should do a trunk show.

My reply broadly noted that I had explained the tone of my comments before and wasn't worried about being understated because I knew that they would see the issues. I didn't understand how they could say the loafers needed to be remade in January 2021 and not October 2020 when they say the amount of gap. I noted that my tone changed in January because my patience was out and the quality of the alligator shoe and leather was so insulting.

To the point about how the fit "should be" and the notion that bespoke products are not returnable, I suggested that, perhaps, I should tell my right foot that it needs to fit the shoes better, that I know other people have returned shoes to them, and other professionals in the bespoke shoe industry (and involved in shoe repair) had advised me to demand a refund.

I don't know whether I will receive a response. In the past, GGJR doesn't always reply. I can say that the process was promising enough at the start, but I missed some probable warning signs and the process devolved into a disappointing mess of an experience. The experience put a bad enough taste in my mouth that it almost turned me off bespoke footwear altogether.

Caueat emptor, I suppose, and, if you're a person new to the world of bespoke, do your research. If you see signs of issues with a maker, dig deeper and don't trust rumors.

I feel your pain and you have my sympathies. I had also bad luck or experience with bespoke makers. My advice to people is to avoid bespoke. If you decide to commission bespoke only do it if you can try on the final product before paying the remaining balance money. Once you pay you have little or no recourse.
Doing remotely bespoke is asking for a trouble.

 

[marlinspike]

Has anybody been hit with import duties on a pair of shoes before? I'm hopeful they'll get classified as an orthopedic appliance per 9021 as they are in fact made to measure and in my case to alleviate an orthopedic problem (Orthopedic appliances include footwear and special insoles designed to correct orthopedic conditions, provided that they are either (1) made to measure or...), but I was surprised to be questioned about it since my experience has always been CBP as a courtesy waives import for individuals who are the final user below any extreme value.

If anybody else here gets bespoke shoes not simply because they can simply afford the luxury but because they have a foot condition that surgery has a low success rate with, customs ultimately agreed that these fall under 9020 as an "other" orthopedic appliance. Hopefully they arrive soon since they were just being held at the last stop before delivery. I wouldn't try this if you were faking, I have a very real and obvious orthopedic condition that simplified it, but good to know for others like me.