The Bespoke Shoes Thread

[Texasmade]

Most makers are actually not like GJC. I've written about my 2 pairs of JLP shoes and how I was initially disappointed with the final product on the first pair. JLP saw that I wrote here in SF and reached out to me. They remade the shoes to fit better. On my 2nd pair, I requested slight modifications to the last shape to make them look sleeker which they accommodated.

I've also reached out to Nick Templeman to see if he could schedule his Texas trip over a weekend so I can start a commission on the green suede gatorskin loafers that I keep bringing up. He said he would work with me on that (no guarantees but he would try).

 

[j ingevaldsson]

Most makers are actually not like GJC. I've written about my 2 pairs of JLP shoes and how I was initially disappointed with the final product on the first pair. JLP saw that I wrote here in SF and reached out to me. They remade the shoes to fit better. On my 2nd pair, I requested slight modifications to the last shape to make them look sleeker which they accommodated.

I've also reached out to Nick Templeman to see if he could schedule his Texas trip over a weekend so I can start a commission on the green suede gatorskin loafers that I keep bringing up. He said he would work with me on that (no guarantees but he would try).

Yes, that is very important to remember, experiences like this is not common when ordering bespoke shoes. Most do a good job, and when things don't turn out well, things are sorted to customers pleasing. Part of the price tag of bespoke is to have some wiggle room for all the orders that go wrong in one way or the other. All bespoke makers calculate to lose money (in terms of work needed to put in mainly) on some clients and some orders, but make enough on the pairs that are the common ones, the ones where all go well, to cover for that.

 

[dauster]

I wasn't setting out to do any damage, for the record. I just wanted to document my experience and get input from people and experts about the best way forward.

My father is lucky; he actually was primed to treat himself to a pair of bespoke shoes, especially after I was so enthusiastic early in the process. Now he's definitely not getting any from GJC and may never treat himself to a bespoke pair, fearing the risk of disappointment like that.

just go with someone trustworthy like nick templeman and you will be fine. personally never dealt with him but I only heard good things. don't let it spoil you the fun of bespoke shoes.

 

[Cheshire symposium]

The recent emails have turned a bit more sour. I mentioned that the process has gone on for about 2 years, and GGJR wanted to correct it to the exact month (still just under 2 years). I proceeded to ask whether they would have allowed shoes in such condition to go out to clients such as Statham and Stallone. I'm still waiting for a response.

Can you kindly post the email correspondence? More than anything, it might act as a deterrent for guys who are considering going bespoke with these idiots. It also might be quite funny...

 

[dieworkwear]

Can you kindly post the email correspondence? More than anything, it might act as a deterrent for guys who are considering going bespoke with these idiots. It also might be quite funny...

Personally think this is a bad idea, and he should take whatever course that increases his chances of getting a refund. I don't think posting an exchange here accomplishes that.

 

[Cheshire symposium]

Personally think this is a bad idea, and he should take whatever course that increases his chances of getting a refund. I don't think posting an exchange here accomplishes that.

True; you are absolutely right.
Please post the exchange the next second after the refund clears in your account.

 

[dieworkwear]

True; you are absolutely right.
Please post the exchange the next second after the refund clears in your account.

I don't want to sound preachy, but it's possible that Junior and Senior read this thread. They shouldn't think that, if they actually refund this guy, he will go all out on the forum.

Would leave it to Shack to figure out what's best. But I would not lead them to believe that, if they eventually refunded me, I will post all their correspondence online for people to have a laugh.

There's a lot of money at hand and I feel really bad for Shack. I hope he's able to get a refund.

 

[Cheshire symposium]

I don't want to sound preachy, but it's possible that Junior and Senior read this thread. They shouldn't think that, if they actually refund this guy, he will go all out on the forum.

Would leave it to Shack to figure out what's best. But I would not lead them to believe that, if they eventually refunded me, I will post all their correspondence online for people to have a laugh.

There's a lot of money at hand and I feel really bad for Shack. I hope he's able to get a refund.

Yep - you are right, hopefully he gets refund - I will shut up!

 

[shackletonian]

Can you kindly post the email correspondence? More than anything, it might act as a deterrent for guys who are considering going bespoke with these idiots. It also might be quite funny...

Thanks for the interest, but I'm not going to do that. I think it would take something absolutely catastrophically horrific for me to post even a section directly from an email, irrespective whether I get my refund or not. I've paraphrased a bit and indicated the tone as souring at a point, and a bit of a rude quip from me. I don't think anybody benefits from posting the correspondence, and it could be viewed as malicious or otherwise, and I don't have any intention to do harm

Edit: Exactly as dieworkwear said above about not wanting GJC to think that, if they do right by me, I am waiting or biding my time. I would hope to encourage good customer service and not, myself, be a jerk. I can't help what anybody else does, but I can control what I do. In all this, I am trying my level best to present an accurate reflection of the experience. I'll provide an update once there is resolution (or if there is just a lot more of this), if they do right and give a refund or proceed down a path that I'd rather not go.

 

[WhyUEarly]

Indeed, though they charged me before they shipped it. There was a surprise with the charge; I had asked a year earlier for my outstanding balance and, apparently, they gave me their own books, suggesting that I had a credit of about 3k toward the final payment rather than 5K being owed. Had I known the condition and issues, I wouldn't have paid. I am totally at their mercy, but I also can't believe that having this play out further and people seeing what the shoes looked like for that cost would be good for business, either.

Frankly I think posting your images on Instagram or some other popular social media platform with the cleverly hashtag would be quite eyeopening for many people if they continue to give you a hard time on these botched orders.

 

[Son Of Saphir]

Thanks. I went and checked the shoes again this morning -- to give it a day before replying and see how they fit again. I realized that the oxfords felt strange near the heel because they use more padding under the heel than I've seen in any other shoe, so the drop off from padding under the heel to the rest of the foot is noticeable. Maybe that will go away with time? I compared it to the other GC shoes and other shoes in my closet and didn't see anything like it. Has anybody else experienced something like this? I was wondering whether it might have been their attempt to resolve the issue I had with the loafer heels, but making the heel feel odd.

I also am including photos of the loafer heels to show how differently they fit. On the heel of the right shoe, there is a little space between the top of the shoe and my ankle, but that seems to be within a margin. I used a sharpie to show the relative space. At that point, the sharpie is poking my foot, so it wouldn't go down further. By comparison, on the other heel, the sharpie goes all the way down to the shoe - there's more space, still, between the heel of the shoe and my foot.

Not all man ready for Cleverley,
Did George measure your feet?

 

[Son Of Saphir]

I feel so bad for @shackletonian . That anecdote about the wife is a bit crushing. I'm just kind of shocked. If GC can't be bothered to get a pair of alligator shoes properly, it's just very obvious that they do not value their customers at all. It's a pair of wholecut alligator. It would seem obvious that you would make sure it's get made by more experienced outworkers considering the cost of the material itself. I mean, if GC can't bother to satisfy and retain a customer who can afford alligator, then what kind of customer does GC want?

If you not rich or famous you nobody to Cleverley.
One alligator shoe = small timer
10 alligator shoe = not on radar yet
100 alligator shoe = respected customer.
10 shoe and famous = respected customer.

 

[Son Of Saphir]

My fittings with GC and Templeman have been basically the same. The shoes come to you without a sole. Sometimes there's a rough heel to lift up the back, so you can get a sense of how these look (shoes look different when they're completely flat on the ground). You slip them on and tell the person how they feel.

I find that shoes feel a little different without a sole. They're softer. But I basically just answer their questions. Usually, they ask if there's any tightness anywhere. The person fitting you will squeeze your foot a little to see how the uppers fit. It's a fairly quick process. Sort of like bespoke tailoring, I suppose, where you try on a basted jacket and answer some simple questions (e.g., "how does the chest feet," "how do you like the length," etc).

I don't know if I have any tips for the second meeting because, in my experience, everything is so simple, quick, and natural. You just try on the shoes and say if they feel uncomfortable or loose anywhere. In my case with GC, I mentioned that the heel felt loose on the first fitting. Senior said he would take note of it and asked me to come back for a second fitting. This repeated for a total of four fittings, each time with me saying how the heel fits loose, and then being promised that it will be adjusted. When the shoes were finally delivered to me, the heels again fit loose and I could stick a whole finger down the back between my heel and the shoe. That's partly why I was upset, as it felt like I went into five meetings for no reason whatsoever, as nothing was changed. Felt like I wasted my time.

It your fault.
You ask salesman to measure your foot for bespoke.
You ask salesman to make alteration for bespoke.
That not bespoke!
Bespoke is using skilled men to make shoe,
you use salesman for most important part.
Last maker should measure foot and make alteration.
Many man naive,
he not know how things work,
he not ready for bespoke.
People take advantage of naive man,
they smell weakness.
They try that trick on me,
and me point to George and say "you get Teemu and fix it"
and me say "you make many many mistake"
and me say "you fly him here and not cut corner"
and me say "me know what you up to George"
and me crunch his knuckle.

The george cleverley,
he make very very good shoe for right type of man.
he make bad shoe for many naive man,
me know many naive man who got bad cleverley shoe.
cleverley know right type of man to con.
it sad,
but not all man ready to do cleverley.

I believe Cleverley use them when their regular lastmakers can't keep up.

Me hear it to.

Good last maker + excellent bottom maker = excellent cleverley
salesman measure foot + any piece worker make bottom = can be ordinary

 

[aristoi bcn]

What if going to Cleverley and say: I order only if I get measured by Carnera. Otherwise I leave. Would that work?

 

[Son Of Saphir]

What if going to Cleverley and say: I order only if I get measured by Carnera. Otherwise I leave. Would that work?

get measured by a lastmaker with good experience,
ie, adam.
that would work.
have high standards,
not low standards.
you get measured by salesman,
you asking for trouble,
it not true bespoke.

Lady get bespoke from Lattanzi boutique in NYC
she get fitted by salesman many many time
she get bad fit.
She naive like many man who get measured by salesman at cleverley.
They not ready for real bespoke,
they not know what it is.
They have low standard because they not ready.

Look!
it remind you of men here?