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The Apple Discussion Thread

Discussion in 'Fine Living, Home, Design & Auto' started by ChetB, Sep 10, 2013.

  1. ramuman

    ramuman Senior member

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    It's absolutely worse off. I've said this several times that when a company loses it's obsessive leader, it's never the same. See Bell, Edison, Hughes, Fairchild, Gates, Ellison, and many many others as an example. The companies go on, however, things are never the same.

    I was just at the local computer science museum earlier today (there's a nice little coffee shop and charging place right near on the way to Mountain View - I don't stalk the place). I would say somewhere around 90% of the exhibits are devoted to Microsoft under Gates, Apple and Jobs, and Intel under Noyce/Moore and Grove. There are also a few historical pieces for Turing, Babbage, etc.

    Edit: I think Apple still makes great products, but revolutionary things like the Apple I and II, the Mac, the iPod and the music store, iPhone, and iPad are in the rearview mirror.
     
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2016
  2. GreenFrog

    GreenFrog Senior member

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    By worse off, I'm assuming you guys are saying their products and services are not as good as they could be under Jobs' vision / leadership? Believe me when I say this -- I want to think that would be true.

    But how could anyone know so? The dude is dead. When I see shit like the battery case, I shake my head and really do think Jobs would have axed that hideous monstrosity. But then I see and recognize instances where Jobs was absolutely wrong, too -- phablets, for instance. Has everyone forgot about Ping? Or what about their Rokr phone with Motorola? Obviously cherry picking abject failures out of a sea of successes, but the point remains.

    The guy was not infallible. I just wish we would move on from this "Jobs would never do this" or whatever narrative. It's so pointless. It's a completely empty statement (to me) and just kills the dialogue. What is anyone supposed to say in response to that?

    "O dam u right, case closed. Pack up dat bags brahs."

    I can point to their share price and show how Apple has grown to the company it is today under Tim Cook's leadership. I love how much more shareholder friendly he is. Does that not count for Cook? Jobs was also a monumental asshole of the first order. Does that not count against him?

    The only major thing I dislike about Tim is how uncharismatic he is. Other than that, he's been a damn good CEO.

    /rant
     
    1 person likes this.
  3. ramuman

    ramuman Senior member

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    My worse off definition is how innovation won't be the same without him. They've already proven that. Apple has brought things to us that have changed industries in the past under Jobs. Not so sure since.

    I think his infallibility was awesome. If you don't have a bit of batshit crazy in you, you're probably not trying to do revolutionary stuff that changes things for the better.

    /my rant
     
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2016
  4. HRoi

    HRoi Senior member

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    So this is where GF goes to be a fanboi now. I was curious why I no longer saw long rants about BMW in the cars thread [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2016
    3 people like this.
  5. ramuman

    ramuman Senior member

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    lulz

    Edit: I still love this movie - just Ive's part:
     
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2016
  6. ipractice

    ipractice Senior member

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    FYI people who got jet black, apparently its got more grip so another plus for going caseless. I personally drop my phone so many times that caseless would be a bad idea for me. I picked up two cases off slickdeals ($2 one, $10), and I'm actually going to use a screen protecter this time around. I normally don't baby my phone but I'm fully planning on selling it next year for the 8.
     
  7. otc

    otc Senior member

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    I dunno about that list.

    -I still agree with Jobs on phablets. Obviously people want them and buy them. People were buying android ones aplenty when jobs was alive...I think he knew they could sell a bunch of larger iphones, but he thought that the small form factor that supports one handed use was the purest, simplest, most usable device. It fits with one button mice and stuff like that--there's a market for it, and a huge use-case for it, but excluding it was so essential to the goal of keeping OS interactivity streamlined. Also, the bigger phone in some ways cannibalizes tablet sales, and many iphone plus users would be buying regular iphones if it weren't an option, so I am not sure how big of a win the phablet is.

    -Ping was stupid. I'll agree there, although it was designed to have facebook integration and was demoed by jobs with facebook integration...but released without it. They couldn't reach an agreement, and while I still think it sounded dumb...who knows what it could have been.

    -Rokr phone? I'd argue Jobs was 100% right on that. Everybody wanted an apple phone, but it was too early. They couldn't do what they wanted to do yet with an apple phone, but there was increasing pressure to make something happen. Better to license itunes to Motorola and let them push out the Rokr and Slvr phones. They take the heat on their record when the phones suck. Apple never made a bad phone...they just got paid to license their DRM and music player to a 3rd party. Nobody needs to be skeptical when they do release the iphone--in fact people can be excited and say "oh good, apple has come in to set things straight"
     
  8. GreenFrog

    GreenFrog Senior member

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    For phablets, the takeaway for me is that the market evolves and Apple has been meeting those different segments. People want different form factors as their use cases and needs change with technology, apps, and services. I, for one, never took to the 6 initially because one-handed use became all but impossible. I even went ahead and got myself an SE because I thought I'd enjoy the smaller screen size. Returned it within 5 days. Now I have a 7 Plus on order.

    I find that I use my phone much more for media consumption and the bigger screen is just so much better for that. As for cannibalization, I think Apple actually wants that if it's going to cannibalize the iPad mini, their lowest margin iOS device. We shall see what their tablet lineup holds for the future, but my sense so far is that they're going to discontinue the Mini, or give it minor incremental improvements at best just to barely satiate that market segment. It will never get the Pro treatment, however, in my mind. The iPhone Plus is their highest margin product, so as a shareholder, I hope more people move towards that one. I expect their iPhone ASP to materially increase over the next quarters.

    Ping was stupid for sure. Social media has always been a weak spot for Apple. Even their connect feature for Apple Music is a dud.

    As for the Rokr phone, the famous Steve Jobs mantra was to say no to everything unless he thought it was ready and perfect -- well, whatever perfect meant to him. I believe the Rokr was introduced a year or two before the original iPhone was announced, meaning that R&D for said iPhone was well underway at the time. With that in mind, I feel like if we applied the characterization people have of Jobs now to then-Jobs, we'd all be like, "why the hell would he release that?" Was he seriously under THAT much pressure? Wasn't he famous for telling people to fuck off? Cause I sure as hell see him telling people to fuck off if they were demanding a phone at the time. That said, I wasn't at all in tune with Apple rumors or pressures at the time since I was in HS, so I can't speak to that with any conviction.

    I guess my overall takeaway is that the past decade has fundamentally upended mobile technology and how we live and interact as people now. The market moves quickly and Apple is adjusting to it as best as it can. It's futile for us to speculate what decisions Jobs would or wouldn't now and how that would compare to the Apple we know today.
     
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2016
  9. GreenFrog

    GreenFrog Senior member

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    I will add that I still think the Watch has the potential to become their next major hit.. but it's going to be another 2-3 years in my mind before it can actually be a viable health device. The iPhone didn't really start breaking out until the iPhone 4, so that timing aligns with the Watch's current trajectory.
     
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2016
  10. chobochobo

    chobochobo Senior member Moderator

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    FWIW, I think the Note 7 is a better phone than the iPhone 7/+, explosions excepted. But I am intrigued by the dual camera set up, so I may be breaking my iPhone duck soon.
     
  11. ramuman

    ramuman Senior member

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    You must have been one of the first to get an iPhone 7+ to compare the two.
     
  12. chobochobo

    chobochobo Senior member Moderator

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    I haven't compared the two IRL if that's what you mean. I'm using a Note 5, was going to go Note 7 but might go iPhone 7+.
     
  13. GreenFrog

    GreenFrog Senior member

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    Reading reviews of the iPhone now and, uh, yeah... the jet black is going back. Scratches like a motherfucker and the pics are terrifying.

    Wow.

    Will be keeping the matte Black instead.
     
  14. HRoi

    HRoi Senior member

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    Links to those reviews?
     
  15. GreenFrog

    GreenFrog Senior member

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    It's on techcrunch
     
  16. ipractice

    ipractice Senior member

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    Review roundup with links to each publication:
    http://appleinsider.com/articles/16...et-but-lack-of-the-headphone-jack-is-annoying

    Overall, reviews seem to be positive. iPhone release cycle and reviews are extremely predictable nowadays. But I don't think it can be understated how great it is that Apple makes conservative claims in their release conference, and that those claims hold up or exceed expectations (camera, processor, battery life in this case). That's why I was so confident in their implementation of the dual camera system. Can't even count the number of times I've watched a tech conference only to be utterly disappointed when I got my hands on the product. I recommend ARS Technica's review for a more technical look: http://arstechnica.com/apple/2016/0...w-great-annual-upgrades-with-one-major-catch/.

    Only consistent negatives are jet black casing which I did not opt for, and missing headphone jack which is something I'm happy they got rid of.
     
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2016
  17. GreenFrog

    GreenFrog Senior member

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    I have early October shipping dates for my iPhones but I really hope this is a case of apple underestimating and overestimating like last year.

    Going to Iceland at the end of September for a bachelor party and would love to have the 7 plus for picture taking by then.
     
  18. GreenFrog

    GreenFrog Senior member

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    #scuffgate

    Just bought apple's leather case in saddle brown.
     
  19. Jr Mouse

    Jr Mouse Senior member Dubiously Honored

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    Exert from Verge's iPhone 7 review.


    That's right. Neither the packed in Lightning EarPods or the new AirPods (preproduction) sound any better than the old 3.5mm EarPods. I hope everyone understands what this means. Apple took away our headphone jacks without giving us anything new. Anything better. Apple loves to discuss trade offs when talking about design and when they made decisions to remove technology from products, but there was no real "trade" made here.

    We get clunky adapters, headphones that will be more expensive due to having to licence Apple's proprietary Lightning standard and a line of Bluetooth 4.0 headphones from Apple and Beats that will pair to devices a little easier due to the W1 chip.

    I keep asking. What's the benefit? What do we users receive in this trade? Nothing. All those "benefits" listed above will work just fine on older iPhone models. It's a joke.

    As Nilay goes on to point out that this whole move would have made much more sense had Apple introduced a new "revolutionary" wireless standard. Something that beats the pants off Bluetooth. Something that users would benefit greatly from in the long run. As it is today, Apple customers just got screwed.
     
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2016

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