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Suit jacket snug on upper arms when reaching forward?

shendo

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Hello all,

I'm looking to buy a couple of suit. When testing range of motion, should the upper arms of the jacket feel snug or tight with my arms straight out in front of me? The salesperson said I wouldn't normally hold my arms out like that but I was simulating shaking hands, or holding a steering wheel, or reach for an item on a high shelf.

I'm not a big guy at all, 5'11" 165, so I have thin arms. I've tried on 40R which looked right on my shoulders but tight on the upper arms when I reached out. A 42R looked just slightly wide on the shoulders but had comfortable arm movement. I haven't been able to try any 41R, which seems to be an uncommon size.

Despite what the salesperson said, I thought a jacket should be comfortable in every way. I also don't want to accidentally tear the fabric if I happen to reach forward. Thanks for any advice!
 

comrade

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Welcome to Style Forum.

You are correct. It should be comfortable
Find another suit model and/or another salesperson
or store. 41 R used to be widely available. If you can't
find it, get a 42 R that's comfortable. The "42" basically
refers to the chest measurement, so you should be able to find one
with shoulders that are not too big because shoulder size can
vary with different models.
 
Last edited:

razl

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Despite what the salesperson said, I thought a jacket should be comfortable in every way. I also don't want to accidentally tear the fabric if I happen to reach forward. Thanks for any advice!


All your concerns are on the money. Good to see on your first foray that you're more interested in function than buying a label (that's what most noobs will focus on), so you're ahead of the game. And, you didn't let some saleperson talk you into it because of what they told you - bonus points.

Bottom line - you need to try on a number of different suit sizes, makes, and models to find one that works for you. You'll find that one 38 is another's 40 and yet another's 41. They all tailor to different dimensions, fits, and aesthetics. Even one manufacturer's particular model will can differ a lot from another. You're going to need to try a bunch on to find one that really fits and you like.

Of course, this is all assuming you're intent on buying off the shelf, if you're interested in getting something made-to-measure, look up the Kent Wang affiliate thread for one relatively inexpensive MTM option that is highly regarded by most forum members, and usually dials in a great fit with their process. If you're in the $1K'ish territory you could actually save yourself a lot of trouble and heartache going that route. Note that there are other MTM options in the same price territory, but KW consistently gets good marks on results, has great customer service, and I'd have a hard time thinking you could go wrong with them.
 

LA Guy

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All that said, you are not supposed to be able to row or get into a streetfight in your suit. It's a functional garment, but it's not a garment made for extreme sports. A sportscoat or suit jacket is not a sweatshirt. The correct way to size a suit is with your shoulders, and then your chest. Some makers make their suits, deliberately, like armor. It is supposed to make you stand straight and tall. St 5'11" and 165 lbs, unless you are all upper body muscle, and mostly shoulders, at that, you are unlikely to be larger than a 40US. Buy a measuring tape, and measure your chest at the largest part. The number you see there is going to be your suit size. Measure your true waist, which is the smallest part of your torso, and hasn't been where pants sat for many decades now. The difference between your chest size and your waist size is the drop you are looking for. If you are athletic, you might have a drop of 8 or more. Most American suits are drop 6, and most European RTW suits are drop 7, by default.
 

LA Guy

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I'd also really advise against internet MTM this time around. I'd also advise against trying to go cheap. Go to a place that is known for both service and quality garments, and find a salesperson whose judgement and knowledge you trust. If you don't even know your suit size, there is essentially no possibility that you are going to get MTM right by yourself. If you do MTM, do it through a place with a well established MTM program.
 

razl

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I'd also really advise against internet MTM this time around. I'd also advise against trying to go cheap. Go to a place that is known for both service and quality garments, and find a salesperson whose judgement and knowledge you trust. If you don't even know your suit size, there is essentially no possibility that you are going to get MTM right by yourself. If you do MTM, do it through a place with a well established MTM program.


This is all good info; however I'll point out that KW's MTM revolves around sending the person a stock suit to try on first and making adjustments (possibly with input from the customer's local tailor) from there. That doesn't sound much different than the op trying on a suit locally and getting it adjusted other than KW's rep for quality+price and dialing the fit in right.

I've got no affiliation with KW and haven't pulled the trigger on a MTM from him myself, but I've been a thread lurker on his for quite a while and seen great results even for first timers (first time MTM'ers, that is).
 

jeffd

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It's hard to tell just how much movement the OP is looking for - the "reach for an item on a high shelf" is what catches my attention. I don't know of any OTR or MTM suit that will allow you to do that without pulling, at least not on me. The best I usually hope for in OTR is if I can raise my arms about 45° with the jacket buttoned before the chest starts to pull or the shoulders start to raise.

My suggestion is to try many many suits, as every brand is cut a bit differently. MTM is always an option, but that's no guarantee either. For me, I've found that some brands of OTR fit me better than any MTM I've gotten.
 

razl

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My suggestion is to try many many suits, as every brand is cut a bit differently.  MTM is always an option, but that's no guarantee either.  For me, I've found that some brands of OTR fit me better than any MTM I've gotten.  


What I said, but much more concisely stated. Solid advice and I agree - op should take note :)
 
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shendo

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The "42" basically
refers to the chest measurement, so you should be able to find one
with shoulders that are not too big because shoulder size can
vary with different models.

Thank you for clarifying about suit sizes. I seem to have an odd shaped body: most 40 jackets look right on my shoulders, my chest measures a 38 (38 jackets are tight), but a 42 feels most comfortable. Yes, I'm built like a coathanger on a hat rack. Some size 42s didn't look too wide on my shoulders so I may have to keep searching for a smaller size 42.

There aren't any fine clothing stores where I live so for right now I'm only able to try on suits at department stores, JosABank, and Men's Wearhouse. The only 40 that didn't have the tightness of all the other jackets when I reached forward was a charcoal Joseph Abboud, which I am keeping in mind.

Of course, this is all assuming you're intent on buying off the shelf, if you're interested in getting something made-to-measure, look up the Kent Wang affiliate thread for one relatively inexpensive MTM option that is highly regarded by most forum members, and usually dials in a great fit with their process.

Yes, I'm looking for an off the shelf suit. A MTM suit is a bit more than I would like to spend because I only wear suits a handful of times per year. I was aiming for around $500 or less but for a nice fitting, comfortable suit I am willing to go up to the $800 range. The Kent Wang suits look nice and if I end up going the MTM route, I'll be sure look at them again.


All that said, you are not supposed to be able to row or get into a streetfight in your suit. It's a functional garment, but it's not a garment made for extreme sports. A sportscoat or suit jacket is not a sweatshirt.
Measure your true waist, which is the smallest part of your torso, and hasn't been where pants sat for many decades now. The difference between your chest size and your waist size is the drop you are looking for. If you are athletic, you might have a drop of 8 or more. Most American suits are drop 6, and most European RTW suits are drop 7, by default.

I understand a suit is formal wear and I shouldn't expect to be very active in it. I limited testing my arm movements to non-strenuous activities such as simulating driving a car or browsing the eye-level racks at the stores. Most jackets seems to tighten more than I liked with arms out front. A few were simply snug instead of tight which was probably acceptable, but at the time I wasn't sure since I'm used to non-suit jackets that allowed plenty of activity and comfort. I think if the arms don't feel too constricted or I don't worry about ripping the suit, it should be fine.

Another drawback to my body shape is that I have a size 31 waist. I can wear a 32 waist with a belt, though. 33 or larger would make me look like MC Hammer. So a 42 with a drop 6 would mean accompanying pants would have a 36 waist. From what I've gathered, pants shouldn't be altered more than 2 inches. This poses a problem if I opt for a size 42 jacket that comes with 36 pants, unless I find suits with a drop 8. I would have liked a complete suit but I may have to buy jacket and pants separately.

Thank you all for the responses and advice. I will keep searching for a suit that properly fits me.
 

Off My Rack

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Sounds to me like you simply are not comfortable in a suit that fits you properly. I'm guessing that you aren't entirely sure what actually fits you in the shoulders. If you'll take a pic of a few coats and post them, people here will let you know which one fits you best. And folks here are significantly more knowledgable than any store sales associate, especially at the stores you mentioned.
 

razl

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Another drawback to my body shape is that I have a size 31 waist. I can wear a 32 waist with a belt, though. 33 or larger would make me look like MC Hammer. So a 42 with a drop 6 would mean accompanying pants would have a 36 waist. From what I've gathered, pants shouldn't be altered more than 2 inches. This poses a problem if I opt for a size 42 jacket that comes with 36 pants, unless I find suits with a drop 8. I would have liked a complete suit but I may have to buy jacket and pants separately.


Your dimensions aren't too far off form mine, though a bit more of a dilema. I'm 6'3" about a 41 chest and a 33 waist @ an athletic 180lbs, so I can make most drop 7s work and the rarer drop 8 is usually fine. You're right in that, if you do decide that a 42 is best for your shoulders you're probably going to need separates to get a good fitting pair of trousers.

Since I already plugged one SF affiliate, let me point you at another - ehaberdasher has their own in-house line called Benjamin which are priced around your altitude and often available in separates. Note that their Benjamin inventory seems to be in constant flux as they keep tinkering with the various models, so you'll want to contact and/or revisit them if you don't see something currently available. I'll point out that a lot of traffic in their thread consistently says that the Benjamin line is very high quality for the price - half canvassed? maybe full canvas for the sartorial models?.

There are some other lesser known affiliates that I can't recall who may have similar options. In general, dollar for dollar at your price point, they'll provide superior products to what you'll find at the stores you mentioned. Again though, fit is king. - a lesser suit that fits you well is superior to a fantastic napoli one which doesn't .

Thank you all for the responses and advice. I will keep searching for a suit that properly fits me.

You're on the right track, keep going. Hope that helps!
 

WatchmeWhipWatchmena

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Guys I really need help with this. I have a lot of suit jackets where if I reach forward it's restricting. Otherwise, it's a perfect fit. No bowing in the lapels, the shoulders drape perfectly around the shoulders and neck. The biggest problem I'm getting on all suits is the tightness in the upper neck, square neck they call it. And the armholes digging into my shoulders. On my 42R suit jackets and more I can fix the square neck by letting out the centre seam accordingly from the back. and it drapes nicely then.

All my suits are vintage, so could do with some guidance. Is it a case I need a 46R UK jacket? My suits are 42 and some of them are fine when I reach forward, probably because of how the armhole is cut.

Does taking in the side seams of a suit jacket greatly affect the armhole fit? Do I need to let out the side seams? If I do this, then I won't have that waist supression that I like. I can still reach forward, nothing snaps. I just want it fit like a cardigan lol.
 

gimpwiz

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Gut feeling:

1. Suits need to fit well and allow a decent range of motion, but

2. Suits don't need to allow all ranges of motion, and one shouldn't expect it.

A bit of a quandary.

Anyways, IMO, the answer is basically: don't worry about it. If it fits well in the robot pose and lets you walk around and such, and you know your alterations to get it to fit great, but some motions are awkward, then uhh, don't do them. I say this because I suspect, and I you mentioned exactly what I suspect, which is that it's due to a low armhole. And yeah, the armhole being cut too vertically tall to allow more people to fit it inevitably means the suit is worse to move around in, the shoulder wants to lift up and it's tight. But some are fine because the armhole is cut better, likely simply higher for the most part.

The reason you wouldn't do anything about this is because it's effectively infeasible to adjust the armhole height after the jacket is made. It's not worth chasing this.

And certainly you wouldn't go from 42R to 46R (4 extra inches in the chest, plus-minus) just to be able to reach forward a bit.

A suit jacket is not gonna fit like a cardigan, they're just not cut the same or made in the same way, it's not ever going to happen.
 

breakaway01

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Guys I really need help with this. I have a lot of suit jackets where if I reach forward it's restricting. Otherwise, it's a perfect fit. No bowing in the lapels, the shoulders drape perfectly around the shoulders and neck. The biggest problem I'm getting on all suits is the tightness in the upper neck, square neck they call it. And the armholes digging into my shoulders. On my 42R suit jackets and more I can fix the square neck by letting out the centre seam accordingly from the back. and it drapes nicely then.

All my suits are vintage, so could do with some guidance. Is it a case I need a 46R UK jacket? My suits are 42 and some of them are fine when I reach forward, probably because of how the armhole is cut.

Does taking in the side seams of a suit jacket greatly affect the armhole fit? Do I need to let out the side seams? If I do this, then I won't have that waist supression that I like. I can still reach forward, nothing snaps. I just want it fit like a cardigan lol.

I am not a tailor but I have never heard of a "square neck" in this context, and also not clear how letting out the center seam would address this. Have heard of square shoulders but not a square neck.

Where do you feel the armholes digging in to your shoulders?
 

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