Starting a few bespoke commissions in Asia - suggestions welcome, Q on Chest. collars

[harry2quinn]

Hey all - just commissioned a bunch of stuff in India. Contrary to prior experiences, when I've been gone off hearsay and limited budgets when getting clothing made, I decided to stop skimping and decided to do it right even if it's on fewer pieces. Getting most of it done at a place that's supposed to be the best (or one of) in India, with a couple of pieces at a more reasonable/less premium tailor. Without further ado: Tailor #1, Syed Bawkher. Standard details include

• fully floating canvas (his past work passed the pinch test)
• hand-stitched buttonholes (they're not on par with my Sartorio RTW, but very very good looking buttonholes nonetheless)
• horn buttons
• silk lining (option for bemberg)
• working sleeve buttonholes
• split curtain waistband.

The only thing I requested which he declined out of lack of expertise was pattern matching. I can live with that. 1. Fabric: Cerruti fabric, 55% mohair, 45% wool. Color dark goldenrod with rust plaid. Bottom right fabric here. Style: DB (Peak lapel of course) suit, standard details (lapel width, buttons, etc), flat front, suspender buttons, no belt loops, 1" cuffs. 2. Fabric: Holland & Sherry Cashmere and Super 120s. Dark navy with light blue chalkstripe alternating with light gray pinstripe. Looks a bit more conservative than it sounds, excellent drapey fabric, slightly on the heavier side. Style: Single breasted, 2-button suit. Flat front, no cuffs, requested slightly slimmer lapels, thinking 2-2.5". Thinking of making this a 3-roll-2 instead of straight up 2-button. Thoughts? I lean away from 3R2 since the asymmetry caused by the button in the middle of the roll annoys me a bit. 3. Fabric: (couldn't remember what the salesperson in London said it was, similar caliber English mill) slightly lighter charcoal with light blue windowpane, very very subtle plaid pattern, Super 100s. Almost looks solid from more than a few feet away. Style: Single-breasted, 2-button, peak-lapel sportcoat (I know this is not 'recommended', but I thought it would look good on this jacket, and may be a defining characteristic of this piece; plus, I don't have any peak SB and thought it would be good to break that rule once). 4. Holland & Sherry. Heather gray, to be used for flat front pants. Pretty straightforward. 5. 2 shirts with fabric from Ferno from Simone Abbarchi and Monti 120s from SF B&S - lavender microcheck and red and purple tattersall. Both french cuffed, spread collar, no chest pocket. Picture of latter fabric here. Tailor #2: Raymond - not too bad. Used them before, not someone you can expect to do canvassing, etc, but serviceable. In other words, outcome has been neither outstanding nor disappointing. Had to use this guy for the remaining two because the Syed Bawkher's quote for a 3/4 length coat was out of my price range (~$600). 1. Fabric: Unknown fabric - 100% cashmere with a milled in UK tag. Very interesting fabric. Black with white/light gray flecks dispersed through it, with a ribbed or almost bumpy texture. Never felt cashmere quite like it before, perhaps someone can clarify. Seller described it as a Scottish basket-weave intended as a jacketing fabric. Style: Couldn't see myself wearing a jacket of this, so making this into a 3/4 length spring/fall coat. Stylistically influenced by this Chesterfield coat. Peak lapels, just the two buttons with a pretty low stance. I really wanted my next coat to be a Chesterfield, but I opted out of the velvet collar on this one, of course (assuming it's pointless considering the fabric is already black - thoughts? Other colors, maybe a forest green?), and I requested jetted vertical pockets rather than horizontal flap pockets. 2. Grandi & Rubinelli blue microcheck. Barrel cuff (couldn't make FC due to fabric limitations... committing the sacrilege of having it styled as a french cuff shirt without the foldbacks so I can still wear cufflinks or close them with a double-sided button to resemble a barrel cuff if I choose). No chest pocket, spread collar. And here's the kicker. All told, I'd estimate it ran me about $1750: $550 for the fabric and $1200 for the tailoring. Assuming these turn out well (and I know the first tailor definitely should), then I'll consider that a price well paid for 2 suits, 1 jacket, 1 pair trousers, 1 3/4 coat and 3 shirts.

 

[aj_del]

Where did you order with SB ? Chennai ?

 

[harry2quinn]

Originally Posted by aj_del

Where did you order with SB ? Chennai ?

Yep.

 

[Despos]

Originally Posted by harry2quinn

The only thing I requested which he declined out of lack of expertise was pattern matching. I can live with that.

1" cuffs.

requested slightly slimmer lapels, thinking 2-2.5".

Peak lapels, just the two buttons with a pretty low stance.


A certain amount of pattern matching is mandatory. Would not feel comfortable with a tailor that says he is not experienced with that.


1" cuffs are way too small

2" or 2.5" lapels are way too narrow

3 buttons for an outercoat and get wide lapels

 

[aj_del]

Originally Posted by harry2quinn

Yep.

You havent got anything made from him and oredered 3 suits ? You have more faith in Indian tailors than I do. Hope everything turns out well.

 

[Lightbringer]

This will probably not end well

 

[NAMOR]

Originally Posted by aj_del

Where did you order with SB ? Chennai ?
nice. The last thing I would think to get in Chennai is a bespoke suit. So fcukng humid

Ill probably check out SB's work the next time im in Chennai.

 

[AxlJack]

Originally Posted by aj_del

You havent got anything made from him and oredered 3 suits ? You have more faith in Indian tailors than I do. Hope everything turns out well.

+1

 

[dbc]

I wouldn't order more than 1 thing on my first experience with a tailor.

 

[forex]

Originally Posted by Lightbringer

This will probably not end well

This will not end well.2" wide lapels?

 

[harry2quinn]

Originally Posted by Despos

A certain amount of pattern matching is mandatory. Would not feel comfortable with a tailor that says he is not experienced with that. 1" cuffs are way too small 2" or 2.5" lapels are way too narrow 3 buttons for an outercoat and get wide lapels
Thanks Chris! I'll change the cuffs then - 1.5"? Now that I think about it, 2.5" lapel does seem very narrow. It was hard for me to visualize without seeing it, and he said we'd figure it out at the first trial on Monday. I was just throwing a number out there - 2.75-3" seem ok? I was planning on the wide lapels for the coat, much like the picture. Is the 3-button a complete mandate? I hear you on the pattern matching - that was surprising to me. His point was no one EVER requests it in India - so they don't do it enough to be good at it... so they don't screw around with it. As far as doing it anyway because it's the better quality thing to do, Indian tailors frequently have to work with lesser amounts of cloth - I don't doubt most of the work he does is with 3 - 3.25m of cloth, which even for the 5'6" - 5'7" or so average height doesn't give a tailor a lot to work with for demands of pattern matching. All in all, I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt. We'll see Monday.

Originally Posted by NAMOR

nice. The last thing I would think to get in Chennai is a bespoke suit. So fcukng humid

Ill probably check out SB's work the next time im in Chennai.
I hear you

. I don't live here - I'm taking it back to Chicago in a week or so. It's 91 degrees right now, and weather.com says it 'feels like' 102.

Originally Posted by dbc

I wouldn't order more than 1 thing on my first experience with a tailor.

Originally Posted by Lightbringer

This will probably not end well
Positivity, my friends. I've seen them at work, I've seen the results of their work - if you knew a) someone was very good at what they did: other really good tailors are miles out of their league I'm sure, but that still puts them at the 95th percentile worldwide b) they cost a fraction of the alternative about 10-20% of getting it tailored in the US c) I'm only going to be in India for a short stretch of time, 10 days every 18 months or so, so I don't have the time to test and go back to him for a follow up d) I get to be the guinea pig that posts pictures and reviews for their work on SF

e) the entire 'experiment' costs me $1500 (the component that I spent on their work rather than on Raymond). f) I have a very positive gut feeling about this ... wouldn't you think the benefits outweigh the risks?

Originally Posted by bkstone

Give us a update when received

Will do - will post pics and comments on the first fitting in a couple of days. FYI - your gif isn't working.

 

[Lightbringer]

Originally Posted by harry2quinn

Positivity, my friends. I've seen them at work, I've seen the results of their work - if you knew
a) someone was one of the best at what they did - much like Chris Despos above (I don't doubt he is well out of their league, but I think Chris : American tailoring as Syed Bawkher : Indian tailoring
b) they cost a fraction of the alternative - getting it tailored in the US (about 10-20%)
c) I'm only going to be in India for a short stretch of time, 10 days every 18 months or so, so I don't have the time to test and go back to him for a follow up
d) I get to be the guinea pig that posts pictures and reviews for their work on SF

e) the entire 'experiment' costs me $1500 (the component that I spent on their work rather than tailor #2
f) I have a very positive gut feeling about this

... wouldn't you think the benefits outweigh the risks?

Will do - will post pics and comments on the first fitting in a couple of days. FYI - your gif isn't working.

c) Building a relationship and working slowly with a tailor over multiple commissions is highly helpful to getting what you want. I don't see this as a plus.

d) This will hurt. But we benefit at your risk I guess.

f) Never trust your gut.

 

[pvrhye]

For what it's worth, I like a 4 CM cuff. Rather than a 3roll2 I'd just request a soft roll on the lapel, since really, that's what I like about the 3roll2 look.

 

[harry2quinn]

Originally Posted by Lightbringer

c) Building a relationship and working slowly with a tailor over multiple commissions is highly helpful to getting what you want. I don't see this as a plus.

d) This will hurt. But we benefit at your risk I guess.

f) Never trust your gut.

c) Oh, I absolutely agree with the first point. But I need a few sportcoats right now, with the intent of building up my closet more over time. I intend to build that relationship over the next few years.

d) Indeed, you benefit at my risk. But I've learned the hard way before from spending on bespoke in India - only one of my three suits made in India has exceeded expectations, one met them and one failed miserably. So, it's hurt before - but considering the price, I think this is a small risk. The cost of all of this put together is less than the cost of a single suit at a decent tailor in the US; and any new tailor is a risk that the customer takes.

e) Agree to disagree

 

[harry2quinn]

Originally Posted by pvrhye

For what it's worth, I like a 4 CM cuff. Rather than a 3roll2 I'd just request a soft roll on the lapel, since really, that's what I like about the 3roll2 look.
I think you're right. Speaking of look at the picture on his homepage - that's the kind of roll I'll be going for, albeit without the 3-roll-2.5. To post below:

Originally Posted by Maccimus

Was that guy kidding you? So they never make checked coat? We've already seen some quite good examples from member aj_del.
No, that's not what I meant. People get checked coats, they just don't request pattern matching. Gentlemen, would appreciate it if we could get this back on topic - let me clarify, I'm not asking about whether this tailor is good or bad - I've done a good amount of research into this, talked to various people who recommended him, etc, and I'm confident about my decision to go with him. I appreciate the initial couple of posts with some observations, but a continued dissection isn't serving any purpose. I would, however, thank you for comments on my choices on the cut and style of the clothing. Especially on the velvet collar aspect!