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golfinz

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The 104 arrived! Only thing I can say is WOW! They are gorgeous. Nothing like anything I’ve seen from a shoe before.
I’m unsure on sizing however (classic last). There seems to be a little room around the vamp/quarter/tongue/instep area. When tied, the eyelets close all the way and there is a little bit of space between the inside of the shoe and my foot. The arch fits great, width feels good and the ball of my foot seems to land in the right spot. My foot can slide forward just a tad if I’m put a little pressure forward. I ordered the same size as I do when buying Carmina Rain. Sent some comments to Phillip for some suggestions. He has been fantastic to communicate with.
1528F8A2-0712-4C81-AA3C-7B49F5952360.jpeg
11B2BEED-4F62-41B7-B2B2-8C09C4BAC5E9.jpeg
B1006B92-05DA-4AFA-9650-1E27FB419CD5.jpeg
 
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BColl_Has_Too_Many_Shoes

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The 104 arrived! Only thing I can say is WOW! They are gorgeous. Nothing like anything I’ve seen from a shoe before.
I’m unsure on sizing however (classic last). There seems to be a little room around the vamp/quarter/tongue area. When tied, the eyelets close all the way and there is a little bit of space between the inside of the shoe and my foot. The arch fits great, width feels good and the ball of my foot seems to land in the right spot. My foot can slide forward just a tad if I’m put a little pressure forward. I ordered the same size as I do when buying Carmina Rain. Sent some comments to Phillip for some suggestions. He has been fantastic to communicate with.
View attachment 1420141 View attachment 1420143 View attachment 1420142

They look great, but based on what you are describing a touch big on you. Sounds like a few modifications should do the trick.
 

golfinz

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They look great, but based on what you are describing a touch big on you. Sounds like a few modifications should do the trick.

Thanks! Phillip said based on my comments, they seem a tad big but didn't elaborate on what could be done to change the shoe; mostly likely because I'm trying to get into a pair by Aug 1 and he can't make a custom pair by then.

Thoughts on sizing down 1/2 size? Or am I trying to stick a round plug into a square hole?
 

DL120

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Not sure which I’ve posted and which I haven’t. So here are some recents:

mod111 on the classic last:
438D49F8-9F6F-4388-87F1-EBA2CA593362.jpeg


mod505 in Russian grain, on the chiseled last:
C95FC656-DD41-4F14-AB19-3DCA6B7D62E6.jpeg

371579D1-0947-4444-97A6-4593296D253B.jpeg


and my personal favorite my first MTO, mod633s in natty shell on the Riva last.
2B9A943B-7B6A-4F8B-B49B-F4089396605D.jpeg
 

BColl_Has_Too_Many_Shoes

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Thanks! Phillip said based on my comments, they seem a tad big but didn't elaborate on what could be done to change the shoe; mostly likely because I'm trying to get into a pair by Aug 1 and he can't make a custom pair by then.

Thoughts on sizing down 1/2 size? Or am I trying to stick a round plug into a square hole?

I would definitely not size down, because everywhere else would then become a problem. Unless of course, you then made adjustments to account for the decreased width.
I mean regardless you would need to make adjustments I guess which doesn't sound like will happen that quickly haha.

So as you said, it's the sticking a round plug into a square hole ?.

Actually what's surprising is that is pretty good advice concerning the sizing reference to the Rain. They fit about the same. I'm guessing the fitting was done online, and not in person?

For those that do order online, does Philip provide or can provide a generic fitting shoe (ie like in a trunk show)? To at least nail down proper sizing.
 

BColl_Has_Too_Many_Shoes

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Not sure which I’ve posted and which I haven’t. So here are some recents:

mod111 on the classic last:
View attachment 1420303

mod505 in Russian grain, on the chiseled last:
View attachment 1420306
View attachment 1420307

and my personal favorite my first MTO, mod633s in natty shell on the Riva last.
View attachment 1420318

As you all know, I'm on the Vote for 633 SpTD! To see this bum DL with both my desired last (Riva) and style SpTD, along with the mod 111 loafer leaves me green with envy.

You lucky man you ??.
 

golfinz

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I would definitely not size down, because everywhere else would then become a problem. Unless of course, you then made adjustments to account for the decreased width.
I mean regardless you would need to make adjustments I guess which doesn't sound like will happen that quickly haha.

So as you said, it's the sticking a round plug into a square hole ?.

Actually what's surprising is that is pretty good advice concerning the sizing reference to the Rain. They fit about the same. I'm guessing the fitting was done online, and not in person?

For those that do order online, does Philip provide or can provide a generic fitting shoe (ie like in a trunk show)? To at least nail down proper sizing.

Yes, done online. I followed their online fitting instructions and sent that image to Phillip.

Regarding similarities to Rain. I've got about 5 pairs on the Rain last. The Classic last has much better arch support but, on my foot, has a touch more room in the instep. The classic last seems a little longer than Rain.. FWIW, I also wear a uk5 in the Carmina soller last and llubi last as they are wider than Rain.
 

BColl_Has_Too_Many_Shoes

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Yes, done online. I followed their online fitting instructions and sent that image to Phillip.

Regarding similarities to Rain. I've got about 5 pairs on the Rain last. The Classic last has much better arch support but, on my foot, has a touch more room in the instep. The classic last seems a little longer than Rain.. FWIW, I also wear a uk5 in the Carmina soller last and llubi last as they are wider than Rain.

I was thinking if you did size down that may improve the length, but my concern would than be the width and toebox. Because when I went with my preferred size of 8.5, as opposed to my real size 9.0 (yes I do like a tight fitting shoe haha) the shoe would have been unwearable.

Fortunately, because it was at a trunk show we adjusted and accounted for the width, instep, and heel. Wouldn't want the same thing happen to you.

So in this case, while I believe the Rain last tends to work for StC as a sizing reference, it would not have worked for me. Rain for me is an 8.5, but really should be wider.
 

DL120

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Thanks! Phillip said based on my comments, they seem a tad big but didn't elaborate on what could be done to change the shoe; mostly likely because I'm trying to get into a pair by Aug 1 and he can't make a custom pair by then.

Thoughts on sizing down 1/2 size? Or am I trying to stick a round plug into a square hole?

Without getting into if stc runs generous, or carmina narrow, since it’s all relative, my experience and that of everyone I’ve spoken to is half size difference between rain and StC. Except StC chiseled last, would be the same. But I somewhat find comparing carmina lasts and StC last a bit tough unless you just need a starting point due to lack of physical location.

Here’s a uk7.5 rain, uk7F classic.
F2261000-CC9E-49F4-AA8C-9D6AAC8E28DB.jpeg


if you can already move your foot forward a bit, and the lacing is closed that much, I’d say it’s safe to assume that will only exacerbate as you break them in since you can’t really tie them any tighter.

if you compare the (same size) length of the classic last and rain, at least on theball Of the foot and point where the toebox begins To narrow, you’ll see the classic Last will be a bit longer, maintain useable width further into the toe box due to the lack of the soft chisel the rain has. Based on your description, lack of time for a custom last, and my own experience with both, I think it’s safe to assume a half size smaller is the best bet. It’ll have a gap in the facing until broken in, but ideally, the facing should never be fully closed. If it does fully close, you lose the additional instep support created by a snug fit, with a minimal gap in the top few eyelets when tied snug.
 

golfinz

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Without getting into if stc runs generous, or carmina narrow, since it’s all relative, my experience and that of everyone I’ve spoken to is half size difference between rain and StC. Except StC chiseled last, would be the same. But I somewhat find comparing carmina lasts and StC last a bit tough unless you just need a starting point due to lack of physical location.

Here’s a uk7.5 rain, uk7F classic.
View attachment 1420383

if you can already move your foot forward a bit, and the lacing is closed that much, I’d say it’s safe to assume that will only exacerbate as you break them in since you can’t really tie them any tighter.

if you compare the (same size) length of the classic last and rain, at least on theball Of the foot and point where the toebox begins To narrow, you’ll see the classic Last will be a bit longer, maintain useable width further into the toe box due to the lack of the soft chisel the rain has. Based on your description, lack of time for a custom last, and my own experience with both, I think it’s safe to assume a half size smaller is the best bet. It’ll have a gap in the facing until broken in, but ideally, the facing should never be fully closed. If it does fully close, you lose the additional instep support created by a snug fit, with a minimal gap in the top few eyelets when tied snug.

THIS is perfect and makes me comfortable enough to swap out for the 1/2 smaller. The fit of your Rain is almost exactly the same as mine (lacing width, flexing in leather, etc). Thanks for taking the time to write the above.

Beautiful pictures!
 
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BColl_Has_Too_Many_Shoes

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Without getting into if stc runs generous, or carmina narrow, since it’s all relative, my experience and that of everyone I’ve spoken to is half size difference between rain and StC. Except StC chiseled last, would be the same. But I somewhat find comparing carmina lasts and StC last a bit tough unless you just need a starting point due to lack of physical location.

Here’s a uk7.5 rain, uk7F classic.
View attachment 1420383

if you can already move your foot forward a bit, and the lacing is closed that much, I’d say it’s safe to assume that will only exacerbate as you break them in since you can’t really tie them any tighter.

if you compare the (same size) length of the classic last and rain, at least on theball Of the foot and point where the toebox begins To narrow, you’ll see the classic Last will be a bit longer, maintain useable width further into the toe box due to the lack of the soft chisel the rain has. Based on your description, lack of time for a custom last, and my own experience with both, I think it’s safe to assume a half size smaller is the best bet. It’ll have a gap in the facing until broken in, but ideally, the facing should never be fully closed. If it does fully close, you lose the additional instep support created by a snug fit, with a minimal gap in the top few eyelets when tied snug.

That's interesting that you take a half size down on the StC from the Rain. Interesting because, IIRC, even Philip himself suggested same size as the Rain. Possibly even Skoaktiebolaget (one of their retailers) may have suggested similar sizing.

I would be curious if others experienced that as well. Always useful to have more information than less, especially for people purchasing directly online. Attempting to find the best fit possible increases your love for these shoes, which are just beautiful looking shoes ??.

And in the case of @DL120, more beautiful because he has the 633s haha.
 

Encore

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That's interesting that you take a half size down on the StC from the Rain. Interesting because, IIRC, even Philip himself suggested same size as the Rain. Possibly even Skoaktiebolaget (one of their retailers) may have suggested similar sizing.

I would be curious if others experienced that as well. Always useful to have more information than less, especially for people purchasing directly online. Attempting to find the best fit possible increases your love for these shoes, which are just beautiful looking shoes ??.

And in the case of @DL120, more beautiful because he has the 633s haha.
Potentially due to instep, Rain has a lower instep than Stc Classic.

People with different instep may take different sizes comparing Rain and Classic.
 

willyto

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It also comes down to preferences. Some people like a good grip in the heel but loose vamp and toebox while others prefer a snug shoe all over that gives support and will need break in a bit.
 

BColl_Has_Too_Many_Shoes

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It also comes down to preferences. Some people like a good grip in the heel but loose vamp and toebox while others prefer a snug shoe all over that gives support and will need break in a bit.

I am in the latter camp. A snug fit throughout the shoe. Ideally snug around the heel and waist, but with a bit of breathing room around the joints and toes.

Of course, everyone's foot is different. Saying that, it is always useful to have a reference point when an individual is unable to visit a store or the trunk show is not an option.

This is why, although probably not always a possibility, I am in favor of the maker shipping out a test shoe (like the ones used in trunk shows). Unfortunately, not everyone will fancy paying the shipment charges, but at least you get a truer sense of sizing.
 

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