St. Crispin's Appreciation Thread

[DWFII]



Gents, I mean no disrespect when I came here to seek help.


I have no reason to be disrespectful when I'm asking for advice. Basic human decency, even if not etiquette.

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!

The problem here is, I paid 15500 HKD for a customized last, which to the best of my knowledge, seems to infer that the last is made to suit my feet.

So it begs the question when my feet are constantly being crammed all over and in all the wrong places causing pain, when this last was supposed to be fitted according to my feet.

Now I am not asking for bespoke, because I know this is not bespoke. This is a customized last.

But I think something is wrong when a ready to wear shoe fits better and causes less pain, if any at all, than a "customized" shoe.

Anyway I had the pleasure of speaking to a visiting English bespoke shoemaker who suggested that the last was actually rather straight, and for my feet he would have "twisted" the last, so to speak, to accommodate for the rolling of my feet.

St Crispins have made use of stiffener all around the shoe. But by pushing it from the side and forcing my foot up, it actually just pushes my feet in the other side, due to the fact that there is no support for the bottom (via an insole).


I make no claim that St Crispin's helps my feet. All I did was ask around the forum and the members suggested St C's for the stiffener and PRET last. And Ethan himself confirmed this. And yet I am in pain.

It's nobody's fault, Ethan is not the shoemaker himself, and his knowledge might not reach so far as to the pronation of feet. However I do know that I spent what I spent, and I expect the performance that was confidently promised.

Don't worry about it...no one who knows anything about anything thought you were being disrespectful. Of anyone. There are just some people...on every forum...who look for reasons to stir up trouble.

And anyone who knows anything about forums knows that sometimes conversations drift, and there's no help for it...nor should there be. It's human nature and free speech at work. The only ones who are put off by this are the forum police and the people who don't have anything authentic to contribute--the same folks, IOW.

 

[chogall]

Gents, I mean no disrespect when I came here to seek help.

I have no reason to be disrespectful when I'm asking for advice. Basic human decency, even if not etiquette.

The problem here is, I paid 15500 HKD for a customized last, which to the best of my knowledge, seems to infer that the last is made to suit my feet.

So it begs the question when my feet are constantly being crammed all over and in all the wrong places causing pain, when this last was supposed to be fitted according to my feet.

Now I am not asking for bespoke, because I know this is not bespoke. This is a customized last.

But I think something is wrong when a ready to wear shoe fits better and causes less pain, if any at all, than a "customized" shoe.

Anyway I had the pleasure of speaking to a visiting English bespoke shoemaker who suggested that the last was actually rather straight, and for my feet he would have "twisted" the last, so to speak, to accommodate for the rolling of my feet.

St Crispins have made use of stiffener all around the shoe. But by pushing it from the side and forcing my foot up, it actually just pushes my feet in the other side, due to the fact that there is no support for the bottom (via an insole).

I make no claim that St Crispin's helps my feet. All I did was ask around the forum and the members suggested St C's for the stiffener and PRET last. And Ethan himself confirmed this. And yet I am in pain.

It's nobody's fault, Ethan is not the shoemaker himself, and his knowledge might not reach so far as to the pronation of feet. However I do know that I spent what I spent, and I expect the performance that was confidently promised.

Actually, SC has arch support built in. One conjecture could be that your feet is not used to the arch support and has pronation. The arch support forced your feet to stand in a neutral position thus some of the discomfort. But this doesnt explain how your toes are been pressed by the upper. Maybe visiting an SC trunk show when Mr. Car is present could resolve this issue.

p.s., the leather stiffener is built all around except the vamp to help stabilizing lateral movement of the shoes induced by beveled waists. Standard for most hand welted beveled waist shoes.

 

[DWFII]



Actually, SC has arch support built in.  One conjecture could be that your feet is not used to the arch support and has pronation.  The arch support forced your feet to stand in a neutral position thus some of the discomfort.  But this doesnt explain how your toes are been pressed by the upper.  Maybe visiting an SC trunk show when Mr. Car is present could resolve this issue.

p.s., the leather stiffener is built all around except the vamp to help stabilizing lateral movement of the shoes induced by beveled waists.  Standard for most hand welted beveled waist shoes.

The standard, AFAIK, for men's shoes, whether they be beveled waist or not, is that the heel stiffener be the same length as the last. Of course, that wraps roughly half way ...a little less actually...around the back of the foot. But that's often longer than most manufactured shoes esp. if the lining is not "bagged."

Sometimes as you mentioned, the heel stiffener is made extra long on the medial side to support the arch.

Then a "midliner" is added...whether they be beveled waist or not...that runs from the leading edge of the heel stiffener to the rear edge of the toe stiffener (with some overlap on both ends). This is there to add stiffness to the sides of the shoe for all the reasons you spoke of and to transition from the heel stiffener to the toe stiffener. It also reinforces and strengthens the inseam. Manufactured, and esp. GY, shoes seldom if ever, use a midliner.

Sometimes the insole is extended up in the waist to create additional support in the arch of the foot.

 

[woolymammoth]

Does St. Crispin's have different shades so-to-speak of black like John Lobb has black misty calf, black museum calf etc.? Thank you.

 

[chogall]

Does St. Crispin's have different shades so-to-speak of black like John Lobb has black misty calf, black museum calf etc.? Thank you.

They have different calf leather selection for black; one crust and one aniline. They do not have different aniline finished black calf when I place my order.

And IME, go for aniline not crust.

 

[woolymammoth]



 They have different calf leather selection for black; one crust and one aniline.  They do not have different aniline finished black calf when I place my order.

And IME, go for aniline not crust.

Thank you.

 

[patrickBOOTH]

They have two kinds of crust FUN and CRU along with aniline. I like the look of the crust more. It has more variation and gives some uniqueness to a "boring" color like black.

 

[chogall]

They have two kinds of crust FUN and CRU along with aniline. I like the look of the crust more. It has more variation and gives some uniqueness to a "boring" color like black.

I have FUN. It is very unique but I realize my preference John Lobb black box calf (Annonay?) after this deterrence.

 

[woolymammoth]



They have two kinds of crust FUN and CRU along with aniline. I like the look of the crust more. It has more variation and gives some uniqueness to a "boring" color like black.

What is crust FUN and crust CRU; I am not familiar with the terms, thank you.

 

[patrickBOOTH]

It's just their terms for the different leathers. One is from Italy and one is from Poland. Not sure which is which, but I have both. Fun is a bit shinier naturally, takes a shine easier, and almost looks "wet". It is also lighter while cru is more matte and a bit denser. Their aniline which they call VNA is the stiffest of them and I think the heaviest. VNA looks the most typical of them and looks what you would normally associate with a black dress shoe. Both crust leathers seem to have more of a natural grain or "skin" look to them.

 

[teslamike]

I wanted to confirm some information about sizing that I received from another member. Can you guys please verify that it is accurate:
"The actual 6.5 has "6 1/2 F", whereas the 6.0 has "6 F 1/2". It is very strange, and I do not understand it myself, but that is the method of notation that SC uses."
Is this true for your shoes as well? For example if you have a size 8F does it show "8F 1/2"?

 

[emiristol]

I am the member that @teslamike mentions. I sold a pair of 6.0 F St. Crispin's shoes to him, and there is some confusion about the notation which SC uses on their boxes.

Specifically, I explained that the unambiguous size of any SC shoe is stamped on the sole (in this case, 6.0F). However, as any SC owner will attest to, SC uses a strange notation on the box, in that they will often write a "1/2" after the letter width (e.g. the "1/2" after the F on the left box, or after the G on the right box, in the photo below). What this denotes, I have no idea. Regardless, the true size of the shoe is stamped on the sole.


Photo courtesy of another SF member's tumblr.

I normally prefer to keep such matters private, but in this context, I believe it is important that my explanation is accurately conveyed. Sorry for clogging up the thread.

 

[chogall]

SC true size is stamped on the sole and written on the inner side of the tongue. I have no idea what the /2 after fitting denotes.

My pix btw.

 

[woolymammoth]



It's just their terms for the different leathers. One is from Italy and one is from Poland. Not sure which is which, but I have both. Fun is a bit shinier naturally, takes a shine easier, and almost looks "wet". It is also lighter while cru is more matte and a bit denser. Their aniline which they call VNA is the stiffest of them and I think the heaviest. VNA looks the most typical of them and looks what you would normally associate with a black dress shoe. Both crust leathers seem to have more of a natural grain or "skin" look to them.

Thank you for the explanation. Any opinions/preferences on which leather would best lend itself to these shoes?

 

[patrickBOOTH]

It's personal preference really. FWIW, I have those same shoes in CRU.