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1st Step

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Calm down old boy, don't work yourself into a fit over a sweater. You obviously don't know the cultural intonations associated with this particular garment.

And for God's sake, get someone to help you with your keyboard setting, writing with capital letters all over the sentence is equally goofy behavior, on par with walking around town in a cricket sweater with a pink shirt 😀
Hey, Everyone On The Cricket Team That Brought This Spier And Mackay Sweater, Raise Your Hands... :crackup: :crackup: :crackup:
 

DonRaphael

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Not sure. "GMTO Fox is the traditional Fox flannel. Heavy." is what I received as an answer. 390 gms minimum is how I'd interpret it. Since I was looking at something in the 340 range, it wasn't an option. Plus, with the ongoing MTO sale, the Minnis 340gms came out at $720. So not insanely expensive.

Just placed an order for three flannel suits: navy, mid grey and charcoal. Have made non standard requests. Will be interesting to see if Spier are willing to accommodate. 3 roll 2,5, straight lapels, 6 roll 1 for the DB charcoal, tweeks here and there etc.
Has anyone played around with changing the shoulders on the Neopolitan cut? I just made the request to keep the Neo cut but dans shirring and with very lightly padded shoulders and some roping to formalise the suits. I.e. keeping the Neopolitan connotations with open quarters, soft tailoring, wide lapels (albeit I asked for straight cut lapels and 3 roll 2,5) but with a slightly more formal shoulder expression.
 

zurich64

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Has anyone played around with changing the shoulders on the Neopolitan cut? I just made the request to keep the Neo cut but dans shirring and with very lightly padded shoulders and some roping to formalise the suits. I.e. keeping the Neopolitan connotations with open quarters, soft tailoring, wide lapels (albeit I asked for straight cut lapels and 3 roll 2,5) but with a slightly more formal shoulder expression.
Something on same lines I saw couple of days ago.

 

DonRaphael

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Something on same lines I saw couple of days ago.

Yes, exactly. I read that article not too long ago as well. Might be it that gave birth to my thoughts subconsciously. Thanks.

I'll be great to hear back from Spier and see whether they can do something like that. Obviously, I don't expect the same type of craftsmanship as in the article, but rather I'm trying to achieve the aesthetic expression of the same.
 
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zurich64

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Yes, exactly. I read that article not too long ago as well. Might be it that gave birth to my thoughts unconsciously. Thanks.

I'll be great to hear back from Spier and see whether they can do something like that. Obviously, I don't expect the same type of craftsmanship as in the article, but rather I'm trying to achieve the aesthetic expression of the same.
I like the soft shoulders and spalla camicia make on linen and cotton jackets from Spier, but on heavier weight clothes it looks a bit off. I have a navy, VBC flannel jacket in Neo cut where a little bit of structure in shoulders would have been nicer.
 

DonRaphael

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I like the soft shoulders and spalla camicia make on linen and cotton jackets from Spier, but on heavier weight clothes it looks a bit off. I have a navy, VBC flannel jacket in Neo cut where a little bit of structure in shoulders would have been nicer.
That is my exact experience. I don't mind the Neapolitan features on sport coats, casual jackets/suits or lighter fabrics. Even with wool. I think the Neo cut looks great combined with the Cavendish suits for example, as the wool is lightweight. I don't mind it at all. But I, as well, have a VBC navy Neo flannel jacket that I wish had more structure. I put it on the other day and immediately felt that a little more structure and some roping would do it more justice.

Glad I'm not the only one feeling this way. Really hoping Spier can deliver on my requests.
 

exfalso

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Has anyone played around with changing the shoulders on the Neopolitan cut? I just made the request to keep the Neo cut but dans shirring and with very lightly padded shoulders and some roping to formalise the suits. I.e. keeping the Neopolitan connotations with open quarters, soft tailoring, wide lapels (albeit I asked for straight cut lapels and 3 roll 2,5) but with a slightly more formal shoulder expression.
Rick is normally okay with changes with MTO styling as long as it doesn't break the pattern.

It's probably not a problem for MTO, but I have a couple MTM jackets with high buttoning point and 3r2.5 lapels. The "straight" Neapolitan lapels do have a slightly negative belly, so I found they always end up leaning a bit too casual. I would not worry too much about the shoulders as long as they are not too structured, though. The Neapolitan jackets do come with a bit of structure (canvas over the shoulder) so I do not think light padding will make a huge difference.
 
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DonRaphael

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Rick is normally okay with changes with MTO styling as long as it doesn't break the pattern.

It's probably not a problem for MTO, but I have a couple MTM jackets with high buttoning point and 3r2.5 lapels. The "straight" Neapolitan lapels do have a slightly negative belly, so I found they always end up leaning a bit too casual. I would not worry too much about the shoulders as long as they are not too structured, though. The Neapolitan jackets do come with a bit of structure (canvas over the shoulder) so I do not think light padding will make a huge difference.
Thanks for your input, sir. Care to share the name of the brands?

I concur with what you said. I'd like a "real" straight lapel on this one without any belly either way to make it more formal. Spier already offers it with other cuts, so it shouldn't, in theory, be an issue for them to actually deliver on this request.

I have some experience with Italian jackets featuring padding and extended shoulders, but not Neopolitan. My body don't require any padding at all in terms of fit. It's mostly for the looks of it. As you said, Spier's Neopolitan cut already feature some layer of canvas through the shoulder as it's not completely natural. I'm indifferent whether it be padding or layers of wadding actually as long as it raises the level of formality further and allow for some roping instead of the downward sloping Neopolitan spalla camicia shoulder.

Extended shoulder is not a necessity as I already have a large drop. Extending the shoulders further would only increase the drop, making me look even more top heavy. I'm not looking to further increase the difference eventhough roping will extended the shoulder line slightly compared to a spalla camicia.

This will be a fun and exciting experience if Spier is willing to accommodate my requests.
 

exfalso

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Thanks for your input, sir. Care to share the name of the brands?
All Spier & Mackay -- after all, this is the affiliate thread.

I concur with what you said. I'd like a "real" straight lapel on this one without any belly either way to make it more formal. Spier already offers it with other cuts, so it shouldn't, in theory, be an issue for them to actually deliver on this request.
Well, I had this conversation with Rick in person once. His answer was: "It will probably be difficult to communicate that with the factory", and from my experience, that seems to be true even for some seemingly innocuous requests.

Actually, I just requested 3r2 lapels for my next MTM suit as an alternative. My problem is that the buttoning point is quite high on the jacket and that makes the lapel curve appear more drastic. Maybe I will finally take some photos once it is done.

I have some experience with Italian jackets featuring padding and extended shoulders, but not Neopolitan. My body don't require any padding at all in terms of fit. It's mostly for the looks of it. As you said, Spier's Neopolitan cut already feature some layer of canvas through the shoulder as it's not completely natural. I'm indifferent whether it be padding or layers of wadding actually as long as it raises the level of formality further and allow for some roping instead of the downward sloping Neopolitan spalla camicia shoulder.

Extended shoulder is not a necessity as I already have a large drop. Extending the shoulders further would only increase the drop, making me look even more top heavy. I'm not looking to further increase the difference eventhough roping will extended the shoulder line slightly compared to a spalla camicia.

This will be a fun and exciting experience if Spier is willing to accommodate my requests.
Do let us know how it goes. I think I have a similar physique, which led me to in-store MTM program (i.e. I took a couple trips to Toronto), although I imagine it is near impossible for most of us given the pandemic and the very unfortunate closure of the downtown store.
 
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DonRaphael

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All Spier & Mackay -- after all, this is the affiliate thread.



Well, I had this conversation with Rick in person once. His answer was: "It will probably be difficult to communicate that with the factory", and from my experience, that seems to be true even for some seemingly innocuous requests.

Actually, I just requested 3r2 lapels for my next MTM suit as an alternative. My problem is that the buttoning point is quite high on the jacket and that makes the lapel curve appear more drastic. Maybe I will finally take some photos once it is done.



Do let us know how it goes. I think I have a similar physique, which led me to in-store MTM program (i.e. I took a couple trips to Toronto), although I imagine it is near impossible for most of us given the pandemic and the very unfortunate closure of the downtown store.
Have you tried to or asked for a lower buttoning point with Spier jackets? That's another thing I've contemplated but never asked for. Not sure if it would disturb the whole balance of the jacket. If Spier is willing to lower the buttoning point, it'd be interesting to know how they'd do it (just lowering it without any other adjustments or actually making proper adjustments in terms of repositioning the other buttons, hip pockets etc).

I'll surely do and report back as soon as I get an answer to my requests.
 

dapperclassic

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Has anyone played around with changing the shoulders on the Neopolitan cut? I just made the request to keep the Neo cut but dans shirring and with very lightly padded shoulders and some roping to formalise the suits. I.e. keeping the Neopolitan connotations with open quarters, soft tailoring, wide lapels (albeit I asked for straight cut lapels and 3 roll 2,5) but with a slightly more formal shoulder expression.
You might like the shoulder that is used on the Guabello DB suit, see below worn by @Betelgeuse
It's lightly padded and has some roping. I too have the suit but no pics of my own to share.
 

breakaway01

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It is my normal stance; I just realized I have very curved back. What do you mean about back balance being too long?Do you know if this is an easy fix for a tailor? Or the arrangements will cost more than the jacket?
With a very erect stance like yours, you need less cloth in the back and more in the front. You can also see in your photos how the front balance is short as the quarters are “scissoring” inwards slightly and not hanging straight down (the fabric pattern helps one see this better). I found this link and thought it was a good explanation. The photos in the “vertical balance” section look a lot like your own photos. I don’t know if this is something that can be altered (doubt it would be simple) or what the cost would be. You’d have to take it to a good alterations tailor. If they don’t understand what front and back balance are, go somewhere else.
 
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DonRaphael

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You might like the shoulder that is used on the Guabello DB suit, see below worn by @Betelgeuse
It's lightly padded and has some roping. I too have the suit but no pics of my own to share.
Thanks mate. Appreciate it. That looks moderately padded. Haven't handled any shoulder from Spier except the Neo, so don't know what to expect or how to relate apart from the looks of it in pics.

What's you experience with that shoulder vis-a-vis the Neopolitan? Is the difference marginal or significant in terms of appearance and fit? If you pinch both shoulders, approx. how much thicker is the padded one?
 

DonRaphael

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With a very erect stance like yours, you need less cloth in the back and more in the front. You can also see in your photos how the front balance is short as the quarters are “scissoring” inwards slightly and not hanging straight down (the fabric pattern helps one see this better). I found this link and thought it was a good explanation. The photos in the “vertical balance” section look a lot like your own photos. I don’t know if this is something that can be altered (doubt it would be simple) or what the cost would be. You’d have to take it to a good alterations tailor.
Won't be any help in this instance, but beginning this season it seems as if Spier will allow for adjustments with respect to shoulder drops and posture. I guess the aforementioned issue is what spier is trying to adjust for with this piece of info.
Screenshot_20210919_150558.jpg
 

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